Landing Height System for Mooney

[Microkit]

17 hours ago, StevenL757 said:

@donkaye, @Microkit,

This certainly looks impressive.

Quick question:  In general, what does this give me that my Garmin GRA55 doesn’t?  Can the Microkit output be wired to display on, say, my G500txi...similar to where the RA Minimums are displayed?

Steve

The LHS only announces the height through the audio/intercom system.  Considering it kicks in 100ft AGL and below, you don't want to be looking inside at the panel that low.

 

[Microkit]

6 hours ago, philip_g said:

is the difference between the certified and experimental in the hardware or is it some sort of setting that can be changed on the device? Like, if a guy bought one for a certified plane could he then move it to an experimental and change it over to give lower alerts

Philip,

Since Aug 2019, all experimental units are shipped with approved certified components such as the control unit components, Wi-Fi, Audio subsystem and laser element.  So same base firmware.  Though slightly different.  It's the same regarding the Audio system and callout. 

Installer needs to select using the Wi-Fi that this is for Certified System to comply with the installation instructions.   

Certified units can be installed and bought for experimental, though not the other way around, installer will not see that option in Wi-Fi, making the entire installation invalid.  

Regards

Nidal

 

[Microkit]

6 hours ago, RobertGary1 said:

While it sounds fun I’m unclear what the advantage is. Makes sense in a 747 where I can imagine it’s hard to estimate height. 

-Robert 

 

We do in fact have a lot of professional airline pilots (airlines and charter jets) who order it for their personal airplane.  They all share a similar comment: “I will take any aid I can get”.

 

There are many (and some are saying the majority) of GA (personal, non-professional) pilots only doing an average of 30 hrs a year of flying.  That's less than 3 hrs a month.  Which will probably come to 2 or 3 landings a month at most.

And those who did not fly for a while.  The confidence level is low, only on the landing part.  Not the takeoff, or straight & level.  They are secretly worried if they are going to screw up the landing after some months of no flying.

Also, a weak landing light at pitch-black nights.

The FAA and many others have several articles about optical illusions listing contributing factors such as runway width & length, runway and terrain slope, Water refraction as rain on the windshield can create the illusion that you're flying at a higher altitude making a hard landing a real possibility and other factors such as haze and fog.

Many uses it to train themselves to hear 50 on top of the edge (or numbers) of the runway.  

Others just want the perfect landing each time.  Each develop their own technique, some told us they come with power, hear 5 reduce power slightly, hear 1, power out and flare. Others said they hear 70, put power at 10” MP and never have to touch again till 1, compared before where they keep playing with power more/less till the flare.

And there is also the personal confidence factor in general regardless of the training. 

Here is an actual comment found on VAF forum from an RV customer in Australia:

“Obviously it doesn't replace technique, observation and knowing your aircraft but I think as a training aid it could be very useful. I used it when I flew into a RV event here in Australia at the old WW2 base at Temora. My local runway is narrow, the one at Temora is about three or more times the width, the system really helped with my confidence around the perspective issues (not wanting to bounce the length of the runway in front of a 1000 people)”

[Ned Gravel]

On 11/21/2020 at 12:14 PM, carusoam said:

Welcome aboard Nidal!

Looks like you did your homework.  Sponsorship organized with Craig.  

Can you describe the type of sensor being used and a bit about the installation?

Looks like it is neatly placed in an inspection panel...

Best regards,

-a-

 

Pic of Nidal’s sensor on a Mooney... (something has made seeing this pic challenging...)

Click the link, then click view...   no need to download...

7877DF41-ED50-4B38-B804-CE506CE90A81.webp 44.48 kB · 38 downloads

Here ya go Tony.  Always pleased to assist.

[G-SLOT]

I think this looks great and I'm very keen to order one. Few questions:

1)  Will you ship to the UK/Europe (my aircraft is N-registered and installation would be signed off by an A&P/IA)?

2)  Can this be installed on foreign registered aircraft (EASA - UK/EU specifically)?

3)  I have a M20R with the Monroy long range tanks. Is there an access panel available where this unit can be installed without interfering with a fuel tank?

Thanks!

[Microkit]

58 minutes ago, G-SLOT said:

I think this looks great and I'm very keen to order one. Few questions:

1)  Will you ship to the UK/Europe (my aircraft is N-registered and installation would be signed off by an A&P/IA)?

2)  Can this be installed on foreign registered aircraft (EASA - UK/EU specifically)?

3)  I have a M20R with the Monroy long range tanks. Is there an access panel available where this unit can be installed without interfering with a fuel tank?

Thanks!

. 

1) Yes.  International shipping option already available on the online store.  Needs to be signed off by A&P or IA.  

2) it’s been done before.  And that was before getting the FAA NORSEE approval certificate.  I am sure after the certificate it may help a little (or a lot).  Currently, countries outside the US do not recognize NORSEE similar to STC just because it's still new.  The few cases it was done, a special approval was granted just for that registration.    

3) We are not sure about the long range tanks and I hope someone here can chime in. Also, if you don't have an annual coming up, you can open the panels to check.

[Microkit]

11 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

The Mooney inspection panel mounting location you have photographed above will not interfere with the Monroy long range tank installation.  

Thank you.  

The photo of the Mooney and Cessna we have on the site actually taken by customers themselves after installation and satisfactory first flight. 

[1964-M20E]

@Microkit did you think about adding an announcement at the 100ft mark when the system begins announcements "100 feet, Confirm Gear Down and Locked"  This would be a good last minute reminder for those with retracts and if being installed on a fixed gear the statement could be silenced during installation.

[Microkit]

3 minutes ago, 1964-M20E said:

@Microkit did you think about adding an announcement at the 100ft mark when the system begins announcements "100 feet, Confirm Gear Down and Locked"  This would be a good last minute reminder for those with retracts and if being installed on a fixed gear the statement could be silenced during installation.

Yes.  Already available on experimental and we planned to talk to FAA about the firmware update early next year, but seems due to great feedback about this feature from many, we will initiate the firmware update approval now and check in with them to see their feedback or first reaction on idea.    So far, we expect to have the customer decide on the alt, probably 70’ or 50’ or maybe both.  Message needs to be short so the next height announcement is not missed. So probably “Check Landing Gear” or “Verify Gear Down” 

[Hank]

I like "check landing gear." It's short and to the point.

I'm also a fan of the KISS principle, as well as the 7 Ps.

[neilpilot]

2 hours ago, Hank said:

I like "check landing gear." It's short and to the point.

"check gear"

[aviatoreb]

2 minutes ago, neilpilot said:

"check gear"

My p2audio system says just that.  "Check Gear!" "Check Gear!" in a frantic voice.  Definitely gets your attention and distinct from any tone.

And it says "Gear is down" in a soothing calm voice if that is what you deserve.

[Hank]

4 minutes ago, neilpilot said:

"check gear"

I don't want to miss what is a single, calm enunciation. It's not like Erik's Rocket frantically screaming several times . . . .

[aviatoreb]

11 minutes ago, Hank said:

I don't want to miss what is a single, calm enunciation. It's not like Erik's Rocket frantically screaming several times . . . .

So these systems in general are called "Bitchin' Betty" for a reason.  The "Check Gear!" "Check Gear!" annunciation is in a frantic woman's voice.  The "Gear is Down" is slow calm and deep draw and I swear it's the voice of Sam Elliot.  I swear you can just hear his bushy mustache.

Part of my check list during taxi to take off hold short line includes pressing the test annunciator button which cycles through the voices (there is one for "Overspeed" too).  

 

[N201MKTurbo]

28 minutes ago, aviatoreb said:

So these systems in general are called "Bitchin' Betty" for a reason.  The "Check Gear!" "Check Gear!" annunciation is in a frantic woman's voice.  The "Gear is Down" is slow calm and deep draw and I swear it's the voice of Sam Elliot.  I swear you can just hear his bushy mustache.

Part of my check list during taxi to take off hold short line includes pressing the test annunciator button which cycles through the voices (there is one for "Overspeed" too).  

 

In Brice's 310 the voice in his AAS is indeed Sam Elliot. 

[aviatoreb]

1 minute ago, N201MKTurbo said:

In Brice's 310 the voice in his AAS is indeed Sam Elliot. 

I don't know for a fact that my P2audio is Sam Elliot, but it sure sounds like him.

[Microkit]

 

We got a request from a "Pilot" asking if they can send in their "significant other" voice so we can generate the binary file to be uploaded to the unit.  We said sure!  

The received file contained the correct callout (in a frustrated manner) but at the end after “0”, there was: “You know you are a little bit off the centerline” message!  We decline to disclose if the pilot was a male or female  

And before you guys start pointing fingers at someone here, this was last year with a twin-engine AirCam.  

[Microkit]

It's official.  “Check Landing Gear” optional audio message will be part of the firmware.  We just received the final FAA approval to add Voice Reminders to the LHS unit.   This addition also allows us to add other voice reminders in the future without having to go back for further approval as long as the reminders are just voice alerts or announcements and not physically connected to the airplane system. 

An idea that just came up; a reminder to switch fuel tanks which can be repeated every 30 min.  Though for sure not in the first firmware release (can be updated via downloadable file later on). 

The “Check Landing Gear” is going to be part of the first release and can be enabled using the Wi-Fi.  It will be announced after the first height announcement is made.

Thanks to everyone who sent us requests and encouragements to start talking with the FAA about this now, rather than later next year as initially planned.

[hammdo]

Woo-Hoo! Can’t wait to get mine!

-Don

[Warren]

Great news on the check gear addition.  Just ordered one.

@MicrokitAny chance of the future addition to add a sense line for the gear down sensor so that it will confirm the gear down vs. just a reminder? And, have some logic to say "Gear Down" or "Check Gear" as appropriate.

[Mcstealth]

On 12/9/2020 at 2:49 PM, Microkit said:

It's official.  “Check Landing Gear” optional audio message will be part of the firmware.  We just received the final FAA approval to add Voice Reminders to the LHS 

Can it be a sexy female (or male)voice, and not the "teacher on Ferris Bueller" voice?

[Microkit]

4 hours ago, Warren said:

Great news on the check gear addition.  Just ordered one.

@MicrokitAny chance of the future addition to add a sense line for the gear down sensor so that it will confirm the gear down vs. just a reminder? And, have some logic to say "Gear Down" or "Check Gear" as appropriate.

Thank you.   Adding to this exact unit won't be possible.   Though, for sure we are planning sometime early next year to talk to the FAA about the possibility of a newer unit.  Using the same mounting and unit dimensions.  

So it will be a simple swap for those who already bought this one, with a very minimal swap fee, most probably < 10% of the current value to swap to a newer unit which adds a wire sensor to the Gear-Up Switch side.    

A re-designed circuit board, testing and certification process needs to be done on that board along with its software certification, and a 5-pin connector will be used to add the extra wire input.

To be clear, this potential newer unit that connects physically to the Gear-Up Switch could not be approved under NORSEE, or may take a year or two to get it approved.   We expected we would get the current unit approved in 6 months, but took two years.  We expected to get the “Check Landing Gear” reminder to be approved in two months, but it took one week!    

 

2 hours ago, Mcstealth said:

Can it be a sexy female (or male)voice, and not the "teacher on Ferris Bueller" voice?

The certified units currently shipping uses a female voice for the announcements, and a male voice for the Check Landing Gear.  Though I can't say anything about being a sexy voice or not .  

Once we complete our first phase by February, then we will be able to accommodate custom requests for those who would like to send in their own voice files or like to have a different language, or accent even.

[larrynimmo]

I ordered mine...I am looking forward to that extra layer of gear up reminder and would like the landing countdown.

since I have an AI that I work closely with, I expect to install right away after receiving it, and I will give a full report on it.

[Mcstealth]

2 hours ago, Microkit said:

Thank you.   Adding to this exact unit won't be possible.   Though, for sure we are planning sometime early next year to talk to the FAA about the possibility of a newer unit.  Using the same mounting and unit dimensions.  

So it will be a simple swap for those who already bought this one, with a very minimal swap fee, most probably < 10% of the current value to swap to a newer unit which adds a wire sensor to the Gear-Up Switch side.    

A re-designed circuit board, testing and certification process needs to be done on that board along with its software certification, and a 5-pin connector will be used to add the extra wire input.

To be clear, this potential newer unit that connects physically to the Gear-Up Switch could not be approved under NORSEE, or may take a year or two to get it approved.   We expected we would get the current unit approved in 6 months, but took two years.  We expected to get the “Check Landing Gear” reminder to be approved in two months, but it took one week!    

 

The certified units currently shipping uses a female voice for the announcements, and a male voice for the Check Landing Gear.  Though I can't say anything about being a sexy voice or not .  

 

Jessica Rabbit (for those of us generational enough to know) voice will do.

[carusoam]

She’s not bad.... she’s just drawn that way... -J Rabbit

-a-