Janat83 Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 I usually put 7quart of oil with new oil change, when it gets below 6 quarts I add 1 quart of oil, my oil consumption is 1 quart every 6 hrs, now my oil level at 5 shall I add oil before taking oil analysis sample or I can send it without adding make-up oil??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragsf15e Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Janat83 said: I usually put 7quart of oil with new oil change, when it gets below 6 quarts I add 1 quart of oil, my oil consumption is 1 quart every 6 hrs, now my oil level at 5 shall I add oil before taking oil analysis sample or I can send it without adding make-up oil??? Not unless you’re going flying before the oil change. If you’re asking if you should add a qt just to drain it, don’t. Just drain it, take the mid drain sample and be done. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janat83 Posted September 17, 2020 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Ragsf15e said: Not unless you’re going flying before the oil change. If you’re asking if you should add a qt just to drain it, don’t. Just drain it, take the mid drain sample and be done. I usually fly for 15-20min before oil change to heat up the oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 17, 2020 Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 Adding new oil To the old oil will adjust the concentration numbers.... by dilution... It won’t matter much, if you keep good records... and follow the same procedure each time... But, if you change up procedures, and do things differently randomly... your readings will be off by about 20%... Realistically... We are typically looking for trends and spikes.... Spikes will be easy to see no matter how much extra oil you add.... Trends are a little more sensitive... adding random quarts every now and then, will add some noise to the data... Try to to take your oil sample while changing/draining it, Before adding any additional (That day)... If you are adding oil every six hours... you may want to record that with your oil sample data, too... Typical is generally every 8 or 9hours... short flights with lots of T/Os, loses a quart a bit earlier than long X-Countries... How often are you changing your oil? Every 25, 50, 100 hrs? PP thoughts only, not a mechanic... Best regards, -a- 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janat83 Posted September 17, 2020 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2020 1 hour ago, carusoam said: Adding new oil To the old oil will adjust the concentration numbers.... by dilution... It won’t matter much, if you keep good records... and follow the same procedure each time... But, if you change up procedures, and do things differently randomly... your readings will be off by about 20%... Realistically... We are typically looking for trends and spikes.... Spikes will be easy to see no matter how much extra oil you add.... Trends are a little more sensitive... adding random quarts every now and then, will add some noise to the data... Try to to take your oil sample while changing/draining it, Before adding any additional (That day)... If you are adding oil every six hours... you may want to record that with your oil sample data, too... Typical is generally every 8 or 9hours... short flights with lots of T/Os, loses a quart a bit earlier than long X-Countries... How often are you changing your oil? Every 25, 50, 100 hrs? PP thoughts only, not a mechanic... Best regards, -a- Than you for detailed reply I usually do my oil change every 50 hrs, last time they founf increased aluminum and chrome so they recommended doing another oil analysis after 30 hrs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcraft938 Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 I would like to tie into this with a similar question on the topic. I now have almost 70 hours on the overhauled engine. Even prior to overhaul, putting 8 quarts in after oil change was futile, I would get the same result putting 7 quarts in and the 8th just open the bottle and throw it down the belly. If I put 7 quarts in, within an hour or so it is slightly above 6 quarts and it doesn't budge for at least 10 hours then slightly below 6. The OH shop and AP told me if doing short flights to leave it there, keep an eye on it, they wanted to see what it did and to increase my oil change interval from 25hrs to 30-35. At 29 hours it dropped slightly to exactly 5.5 on the stick, so rather than add and throw off the sample, just did the oil change there. Is this pretty normal for the rest of you, that your O360 seems to not like much more than 6 quarts and it kind of finds it's happy level and hangs out there for awhile? It just seems unsettling to have an 8 qt system and to know it's going to settle at 5.5 to 6. I'm glad I can get 25+ hours there, but it just seems if something starts to change, that's not much buffer. Penn Yan is happy with it, "said, oil consumption definitely stabilized, you're broke in" and everyone saying the oil samples are real good. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIghpockets Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 I am not an A&P but it has been my experience in my J that I only put in 7 quarts. Oil level will slowly fall to 6 over 15 hours. I wind up adding 2 quarts per oil change which is done after 30-40 hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob - S50 Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 hour ago, Tcraft938 said: I would like to tie into this with a similar question on the topic. I now have almost 70 hours on the overhauled engine. Even prior to overhaul, putting 8 quarts in after oil change was futile, I would get the same result putting 7 quarts in and the 8th just open the bottle and throw it down the belly. If I put 7 quarts in, within an hour or so it is slightly above 6 quarts and it doesn't budge for at least 10 hours then slightly below 6. The OH shop and AP told me if doing short flights to leave it there, keep an eye on it, they wanted to see what it did and to increase my oil change interval from 25hrs to 30-35. At 29 hours it dropped slightly to exactly 5.5 on the stick, so rather than add and throw off the sample, just did the oil change there. Is this pretty normal for the rest of you, that your O360 seems to not like much more than 6 quarts and it kind of finds it's happy level and hangs out there for awhile? It just seems unsettling to have an 8 qt system and to know it's going to settle at 5.5 to 6. I'm glad I can get 25+ hours there, but it just seems if something starts to change, that's not much buffer. Penn Yan is happy with it, "said, oil consumption definitely stabilized, you're broke in" and everyone saying the oil samples are real good. Thanks Very common, at least for the IO360, to spit out anything over 6. At oil change we fill to 6. We keep two quarts of oil premixed with Camguard in 1/3 quart bottles than can added to the engine through the access door without needing a funnel. That also allows us to add oil before we need a full quart. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaylw314 Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 On 9/16/2020 at 8:11 PM, Janat83 said: Than you for detailed reply I usually do my oil change every 50 hrs, last time they founf increased aluminum and chrome so they recommended doing another oil analysis after 30 hrs. You don't HAVE to get your oil sample during an oil change, although it's certainly more convenient to do so. You could always get a sample before you add more oil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaylw314 Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 hours ago, Tcraft938 said: I would like to tie into this with a similar question on the topic. I now have almost 70 hours on the overhauled engine. Even prior to overhaul, putting 8 quarts in after oil change was futile, I would get the same result putting 7 quarts in and the 8th just open the bottle and throw it down the belly. If I put 7 quarts in, within an hour or so it is slightly above 6 quarts and it doesn't budge for at least 10 hours then slightly below 6. The OH shop and AP told me if doing short flights to leave it there, keep an eye on it, they wanted to see what it did and to increase my oil change interval from 25hrs to 30-35. At 29 hours it dropped slightly to exactly 5.5 on the stick, so rather than add and throw off the sample, just did the oil change there. Is this pretty normal for the rest of you, that your O360 seems to not like much more than 6 quarts and it kind of finds it's happy level and hangs out there for awhile? It just seems unsettling to have an 8 qt system and to know it's going to settle at 5.5 to 6. I'm glad I can get 25+ hours there, but it just seems if something starts to change, that's not much buffer. Penn Yan is happy with it, "said, oil consumption definitely stabilized, you're broke in" and everyone saying the oil samples are real good. Thanks Engines have to be able to run safely on 1/2 the maximum oil sump capacity, so 4 quarts should be no problem at normal flight attitudes, just no safety margin. 6-7 qts should be fine While extra oil would seem to be a good safety margin in case you start losing oil, it's not a very USEFUL safety margin. If it's a catastrophic failure, you have other problems. If it's accompanied by another failure which changes engine performance or oil temp/pressure, you're going to make a precautionary landing anyway If it's a slow leak, you're going to notice when you check your oil next time. If it's a leak that starts during and is just fast enough to cause total oil loss in the duration of a single flight and doesn't cause a change in engine performance (like a sump valve that fails), you're not going to have any way of detecting that problem until you're out of oil anyway. It'll just happen at an unpredictably later time in your flight. Knowing you have that extra oil only helps if you know your engine burns oil fast enough to be an issue on a long cross-country flight. If you burn 1 qt every 5 hours, put the extra oil in for a 8 hour flight, sure. Otherwise 6-7 qts is fine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcraft938 Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 hour ago, Bob - S50 said: Very common, at least for the IO360, to spit out anything over 6. At oil change we fill to 6. We keep two quarts of oil premixed with Camguard in 1/3 quart bottles than can added to the engine through the access door without needing a funnel. That also allows us to add oil before we need a full quart. Great ideas. The access door seems like it's not lined up well, just enough to make the quart bottle not want to sit there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 4 hours ago, Tcraft938 said: Great ideas. The access door seems like it's not lined up well, just enough to make the quart bottle not want to sit there. Perfect for when you want to lubricate the exterior of your engine... just add a touch of wind... Everyone has a favorite solution for a valved extender for the oil bottle... about $1.50 at the aviation section of manny moe and Jack’s Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0TreeLemur Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 7 hours ago, Bob - S50 said: Very common, at least for the IO360, to spit out anything over 6. At oil change we fill to 6. We keep two quarts of oil premixed with Camguard in 1/3 quart bottles than can added to the engine through the access door without needing a funnel. That also allows us to add oil before we need a full quart. Regarding oil consumption and minimum amount, you have a decent safety margin. From the Lycoming 360-series Operators Manual: OIL SUMP CAPACITY All Models (Except AIO-360 Series, O-360-J2A) ................................................8 U.S. Quarts Minimum Safe Quantity in Sump (Except – IO-360-M1A, -M1B; HIO-360-G1A) ................................................2 U.S. Quarts IO-360-M1A, -M1B; HIO-360-G1A ..................................................................4 U.S. Quarts AIO-360 Series ........................................................................................................... Dry Sump O-360-J2A..............................................................................................................6 U.S. Quarts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 18, 2020 Report Share Posted September 18, 2020 Knowing where the oil pick-up is helps... The small screened oil tube is a bit off the bottom of the oil sump... A couple of quarts may barely cover the top of the screen... Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcraft938 Posted September 21, 2020 Report Share Posted September 21, 2020 The way I look at it, too much (within reason) is better than not enough. I can by a lot of quarts of oil for the price of overhaul. Also my AP jokes, it's good anticorrosive treatment for the belly. "Have you ever heard of corrosion on the belly of a plane that flies fairly regularly?" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertGary1 Posted September 21, 2020 Report Share Posted September 21, 2020 On 9/18/2020 at 5:15 AM, Tcraft938 said: I would like to tie into this with a similar question on the topic. I now have almost 70 hours on the overhauled engine. Even prior to overhaul, putting 8 quarts in after oil change was futile, I would get the same result putting 7 quarts in and the 8th just open the bottle and throw it down the belly. If I put 7 quarts in, within an hour or so it is slightly above 6 quarts and it doesn't budge for at least 10 hours then slightly below 6. The OH shop and AP told me if doing short flights to leave it there, keep an eye on it, they wanted to see what it did and to increase my oil change interval from 25hrs to 30-35. At 29 hours it dropped slightly to exactly 5.5 on the stick, so rather than add and throw off the sample, just did the oil change there. Is this pretty normal for the rest of you, that your O360 seems to not like much more than 6 quarts and it kind of finds it's happy level and hangs out there for awhile? It just seems unsettling to have an 8 qt system and to know it's going to settle at 5.5 to 6. I'm glad I can get 25+ hours there, but it just seems if something starts to change, that's not much buffer. Penn Yan is happy with it, "said, oil consumption definitely stabilized, you're broke in" and everyone saying the oil samples are real good. Thanks I had Lycoming build my engine. I can fly around with 8 quarts just fine. Doesn't blow off. 100 hours TT on the engine now. -Robert 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janat83 Posted October 7, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 Update on the last oil analysis , I got the new analysis and it didn't show any big changes, however most of the metals are higher than the universal average even though I did the last analysis at 30 hrs as recommended by Blackstone! Any thoughts of any recommended action, engine time is 1060 Hrs. SMOH with Chromed Cylinders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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