Interest Rates

[V1VRV2]

I’m looking to purchase a 91-98 Mooney M20J MSE or Allegro. Anyone make a purchase recently and can disclose interest rates? I’m waiting for AOPA finance to get back to me with terms. Budget is $150K max. Looking at borrowing $120K over 20 yrs with a 20% ($30K) down payment. Is there a preferred lender on the forum? Thanks in advance!

Edited June 22, 2020 by V1VRV2

[Tim Jodice]

I used Wings Financial they start at 4.5% but they limit the term to 10 years.

[FloridaMan]

We Florida financial (they lend nationwide now) starts at 3.99%. Talk to Alexander Martin. 

[Bravoman]

Why limit yourself to 150K? Back in my electronics selling days when I was much younger, I used to tell people that if you can finance it you can afford it!

[StevenL757]

10 hours ago, V1VRV2 said:

I’m looking to purchase a 91-98 Mooney M20J MSE or Allegro. Anyone make a purchase recently and can disclose interest rates? I’m waiting for AOPA finance to get back to me with terms. Budget is $150K max. Looking at borrowing $120K over 20 yrs with a 20% ($30K) down payment. Is there a preferred lender on the forum? Thanks in advance!

Speak with Bob Howe or Pat Fallon at Dorr Aviation.  Rates are currently at 3.95%.  Most pleasant, personalized, easy processes I've experienced.  Very small company with decades of experience who not only care about what they do, but fight hard for GA as a whole.  Based in MA, but lend nationwide.  Terms up to 20 years...per website.

https://www.dorraviation.com/

Steve

Edited June 22, 2020 by StevenL757
Terms

[V1VRV2]

1 hour ago, Bravoman said:

Why limit yourself to 150K? Back in my electronics selling days when I was much younger, I used to tell people that if you can finance it you can afford it!

I can afford to pay for the plane in cash. I can afford to buy a plane for you and a couple of your friends too in cash. Why would I do that when the return on that money in the market has given me a 43 percent return this year and interest rates are historically low. Never use your money when you can use someone else’s. 

Edited June 22, 2020 by V1VRV2

[Bravoman]

43 minutes ago, V1VRV2 said:

I can afford to pay for the plane in cash. I can afford to buy a plane for you and a couple of your friends too in cash. Why would I do that when the return on that money in the market has given me a 43 percent return this year and interest rates are historically low. Never use your money when you can use someone else’s. 

Generally agree, but it is also nice not to owe anybody anything.

[steingar]

I have always counseled young people not to go into debt on a toy.

[flyboy0681]

1 minute ago, steingar said:

I have always counseled young people not to go into debt on a toy.

You know what they say, if it floats, fks or flies, it's cheaper to rent.

[Danb]

24 minutes ago, Bravoman said:

Generally agree, but it is also nice not to owe anybody anything.

Not much of an issue if you have the wherewithal to pay it off anytime

[the_elkhartian]

Daniel Steiner at BANK Burlington....I had a fantastic experience with BANK. Their website is www.bank.bank

I was about 6 business days from application to close. I got rough quotes from AOPA and US Aircraft Finance....BANK was a lot more laid back and willing to talk to me about all kinds of crazy options and what-ifs. Rates and fees were same or lower than anything else I found and they let me decide about a lot of things that add up (ex. escrow....a lot of lenders require it, but BANK let me skip it since I was going through a broker.) And the lender took care of registering everything for me, so even though I'm a first-time buyer and I had no concerns about screwing up the FAA paperwork.

I met them year before last at OSH. I hadn't really thought of them since then, except that I have a swag glasses microfiber wipe that I keep on my desk at work. (So I guess swag does work!)  Daniel is a pilot. The CEO of the bank is a pilot. Just good, hometown country banking out of Iowa.

[Mike A]

4 hours ago, StevenL757 said:

Speak with Bob Howe or Pat Fallon at Dorr Aviation.  Rates are currently at 3.95%.  Most pleasant, personalized, easy processes I've experienced.  Very small company with decades of experience who not only care about what they do, but fight hard for GA as a whole.  Based in MA, but lend nationwide.  Terms up to 20 years...per website.

https://www.dorraviation.com/

Steve

Earlier this year Dorr told me they wouldn’t go below 5.35%. Granted that was on a refinance but still astronomically high in my opinion. 

[V1VRV2]

5 hours ago, StevenL757 said:

Speak with Bob Howe or Pat Fallon at Dorr Aviation.  Rates are currently at 3.95%.  Most pleasant, personalized, easy processes I've experienced.  Very small company with decades of experience who not only care about what they do, but fight hard for GA as a whole.  Based in MA, but lend nationwide.  Terms up to 20 years...per website.

https://www.dorraviation.com/

Steve

Thanks Steve.... I called Pat and was told they only deal with income based lending. I need asset based lending. The search continues!

AOPA got me back and told me their rate was 4.5 on a 20 year loan.

To all worried about my financial situation. I am good! More than good. Borrowing is a financial tool.I have more than enough money to buy the plane cash outright. So no more about that.

[the_elkhartian]

9 minutes ago, V1VRV2 said:

I need asset based lending.

One of the things I talked to BANK about was loaning against some equity that I'm not interested in selling at the moment. They were open to it.

I ended up not doing it, just because I realized I was making something simple too complicated....and I had the cash (and cashflow) to just do a traditional financing....I started my career as an investment banker (worst job I ever had)...so my mind can go to unnecessarily complicated financial arrangements.

Airplanes are relatively stable assets...like a house. Nobody gives you crap for taking out a 20-year 4% mortgage on a house.....but when it's a 20-year 4% loan on an airplane suddenly it's bad? I don't think so. To each his own. 

[carusoam]

6 hours ago, V1VRV2 said:

 

To all worried about my financial situation. I am good! More than good. Borrowing is a financial tool.I have more than enough money to buy the plane cash outright. So no more about that.

So... you are saying money is fungible..?
 

Try to use some discretion while discussing large sums on MS...

Finances are a personal thing... some have more than others... 

Avoid accidentally being rude... 

Definitely share your methods... various MSers have been open with there businesses, and how they run them...

Brevity counts, because MS isn’t a business or investment site either...

No matter how much you have, there will always be a bigger fish...  Those P-ing matches take away from the spirit of MS...
 

The real issue... MS is an open site available to everyone on the internet... try not to attract unwanted attention...
 

Many of us leave our prized possession out on the ramp... let’s not attract attention to them...

 

Back to the discussion...

Have you compared finance rates for other things..?  Some people have refinanced their house, and used the dough to pay for the plane...

interest rates in that market are close to 3% and can be dragged out for decades if desired... and there are Consumer protections for that when the economy crashes and things go sour faster than this past March...

PP thoughts only, not a finance administrator...

[1001001]

On 6/22/2020 at 3:08 AM, V1VRV2 said:

I’m looking to purchase a 91-98 Mooney M20J MSE or Allegro. Anyone make a purchase recently and can disclose interest rates? I’m waiting for AOPA finance to get back to me with terms. Budget is $150K max. Looking at borrowing $120K over 20 yrs with a 20% ($30K) down payment. Is there a preferred lender on the forum? Thanks in advance!

I have had a very good experience with Dave Savoie at US Aircraft Finance out of Vermont.  https://www.usaircraftfinance.com/

[LANCECASPER]

15 hours ago, V1VRV2 said:

To all worried about my financial situation. I am good! More than good. Borrowing is a financial tool.I have more than enough money to buy the plane cash outright. So no more about that.

You have a grand total of 6 posts on Mooneyspace.

If you ask a specific question on any subject on this forum you can expect some to give you direct answers to the question and others to give you answers that relate to the question, but are slightly off topic. If all you are looking for is validation of decisions you've already made and answers that are a bit off topic to your question bother you, this is definitely not the forum for you. The wide variety of answers to the subjects discussed in here is where I learn the most.

[moontownMooney]

Good experience with Pilot Bank. We had 20% down and 15 yr term but I think they'll go longer. I cant speak to how competitive their rates are. Ours were set when rates were much higher and we were limited in lenders by the age of the aircraft.

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[V1VRV2]

11 hours ago, carusoam said:

So... you are saying money is fungible..?
 

Try to use some discretion while discussing large sums on MS...

Finances are a personal thing... some have more than others... 

Avoid accidentally being rude... 

Definitely share your methods... various MSers have been open with there businesses, and how they run them...

Brevity counts, because MS isn’t a business or investment site either...

No matter how much you have, there will always be a bigger fish...  Those P-ing matches take away from the spirit of MS...
 

The real issue... MS is an open site available to everyone on the internet... try not to attract unwanted attention...
 

Many of us leave our prized possession out on the ramp... let’s not attract attention to them...

 

Back to the discussion...

Have you compared finance rates for other things..?  Some people have refinanced their house, and used the dough to pay for the plane...

interest rates in that market are close to 3% and can be dragged out for decades if desired... and there are Consumer protections for that when the economy crashes and things go sour faster than this past March...

PP thoughts only, not a finance administrator...

I didn’t open the Pandora’s box of my financial situation.

My secret to personal wealth is the stock market. I was an airline pilot about 15 years go. Had to leave aviation due to a medical issue. I opened up a business. Something I will never ever ever do again. It was very successful but not worth the loss of sleep and quality of life. Just sold it last July.  My equity was built in the stock market. I do my own trading of individual stocks. My current recommendations... FSLY, AMZN, VEEV, NVDA, SHOP, TTD, ESTC, AAPL, GOOGL, NOW. All currently in my portfolio. The last 4 mo the market has gone crazy. Im up 45% for the year. 158% alone on FSLY!

I decided to go back to the airlines in January but yeah... it didn’t work out that way with COVID. Decided to get a plane and here we are.

I have thought about getting a mortgage on the house but would rather explore asset lending first since I have no reportable income or employment at this time.
 

Sorry if I came across as anything other than polite. 

[OHAEDO]

This is a wondrous group of diverse people - learners - adventurers - helping each other. This - to me - respectfully - in in the WHO CARES territory. Good for you - tho - but way way way outside the realm of relevance. My POV


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[Seth]

You can also look at Van Bortel in Texas. They were very competitive 9 years ago.

 

https://vanbortel.com/aircraft-financing

 

 

-Seth

[Mooney_Allegro]

I used AirFleet Capital for my financing back in 2016.  They're based in Chandler, AZ I believe and have various locations.  The contact name is Jim Blessing.  Their number is 800-390-4324.   At first I applied with AOPA financing and was rejected despite spending days on their application process.  I wasn't happy with AOPA Financing one bit!  My credit was perfect, with no outstanding loans.  I applied with AirFleet Capital and my loan was approved within days.  AirFleet was a seamless process and I'd definitely use them again for any future loans.  Everyone was super nice at AirFleet.  Jim is an aircraft owner and often attends all of the aviation trade shows.  They would be my number one choice in the future.  My interest rate back in 2016 was 4.39%.  I have no idea what it would be now.