the_elkhartian Posted June 17, 2020 Report Share Posted June 17, 2020 My shiny new airplane has databases from 2019. I'm having trouble wrapping my head around the different database subscriptions.....Jeppesen, Garmin, Seattle Avionics... Looking for pro tips for how to get what I need, while keeping maximum cash in the bank (and wife off the back). Equipment: Aspen Evolution Pro 1500 (PFD/MFD) Garmin GTN 650 Relevant Factors: I'm in AZ so terrain/obstacles are more of a concern than, say, Iowa. I have Foreflight with all the whistles and bells (connects via my GTX345) Only flying in the US I've searched the forum and the Google more generally, hard to find any concise (or recent) answers. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob - S50 Posted June 17, 2020 Report Share Posted June 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, wingtipwalker said: My shiny new airplane has databases from 2019. I'm having trouble wrapping my head around the different database subscriptions.....Jeppesen, Garmin, Seattle Avionics... Looking for pro tips for how to get what I need, while keeping maximum cash in the bank (and wife off the back). Equipment: Aspen Evolution Pro 1500 (PFD/MFD) Garmin GTN 650 Relevant Factors: I'm in AZ so terrain/obstacles are more of a concern than, say, Iowa. I have Foreflight with all the whistles and bells (connects via my GTX345) Only flying in the US I've searched the forum and the Google more generally, hard to find any concise (or recent) answers. Here's what we do for our GTN650. We essentially buy an annual subscription for the Garmin USA Navigation database ONLY. That's $299 for the year. If you don't fly IFR and don't need approaches, you probably don't need an annual subscription to this either. Just buy a one time update every now and then just incase navaids disappear or airways change. Mountains don't move so we don't buy a terrain subscription. If I'm VFR I can usually spot obstructions, and it's pretty rare to find one that is over 1000 AGL anyway. Those lower than 1000' are only a factor during takeoff and landing phase for me anyway. If I'm IFR, following the published procedure will keep me clear of obstacles. Therefore, we don't buy an obstacle subscription. We don't use SafeTaxi on our GTN, we all have something similar on our tablets so we don't buy that either. Every few years we might do a one time update on the obstacles and SafeTaxi. That's only about $100 or so every 3 or 4 years. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Lloyd Posted June 17, 2020 Report Share Posted June 17, 2020 Agree, the $299 Navigation Database for the US from Garmin gets all the airport info, approaches, arrivals, departures, etc. If you already have charts, obstacles, terrain on your Foreflight, just update those on the 650 every few years. Not familiar what is available or needed for the Aspen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeOH Posted June 17, 2020 Report Share Posted June 17, 2020 If you intend VFR only and have ForeFlight, I wouldn't even worry about updating the Garmin; especially if it's 2019. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0TreeLemur Posted June 17, 2020 Report Share Posted June 17, 2020 Towers sprout and grow. I update the terrain database once per year. Towers are the real threat descending into strange fields on a hot, bumpy, busy VFR day. A friend told me that having the GPS scream at you about a tower ahead is a real attention getter. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59Moonster Posted June 17, 2020 Report Share Posted June 17, 2020 I was with Jepp and had a new GNX375 installed. Couldn't get this changed on the weekend because sales was closed, which put me in a bind. When I tried to get it switched, I was told it would be a $500 yearly subscription. I asked why so much more than Garmin. And I quote "Our database is more accurate" and we are here for you 24/7. But then was told they have to collect a fee for Garmin. So since I couldn't switch anything on a weekend and I can get it for almost 1/2 the price I cancelled and got the $299 version straight from my GPS maker. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59Moonster Posted June 17, 2020 Report Share Posted June 17, 2020 5 minutes ago, 0TreeLemur said: Towers sprout and grow. I update the terrain database once per year. Towers are the real threat descending into strange fields on a hot, bumpy, busy VFR day. A friend told me that having the GPS scream at you about a tower ahead is a real attention getter. He is already using Foreflight, so that will also show him. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niko182 Posted June 17, 2020 Report Share Posted June 17, 2020 24 minutes ago, 59Moonster said: I was with Jepp and had a new GNX375 installed. Couldn't get this changed on the weekend because sales was closed, which put me in a bind. When I tried to get it switched, I was told it would be a $500 yearly subscription. I asked why so much more than Garmin. And I quote "Our database is more accurate" and we are here for you 24/7. But then was told they have to collect a fee for Garmin. So since I couldn't switch anything on a weekend and I can get it for almost 1/2 the price I cancelled and got the $299 version straight from my GPS maker. "we are here for you 24/7, except when sales is closed". Lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toto Posted June 18, 2020 Report Share Posted June 18, 2020 I do the $299 nav subscription and the $49 SafeTaxi one-time in the same order. So my nav is always current for IFR and SafeTaxi is not more than a year old. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LANCECASPER Posted June 18, 2020 Report Share Posted June 18, 2020 4 hours ago, 0TreeLemur said: Towers sprout and grow. I update the terrain database once per year. Towers are the real threat descending into strange fields on a hot, bumpy, busy VFR day. A friend told me that having the GPS scream at you about a tower ahead is a real attention getter. In Jeppesen, Towers are in an Obstacles database not Terrain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradp Posted June 18, 2020 Report Share Posted June 18, 2020 Doesn’t Seattle offer a Black Friday lifetime deal every year for the aspen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_elkhartian Posted June 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 18, 2020 36 minutes ago, bradp said: Doesn’t Seattle offer a Black Friday lifetime deal every year for the aspen? Interesting. I’m hoping “virtual OSH” yields a lot of timely deals this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kortopates Posted June 18, 2020 Report Share Posted June 18, 2020 5 hours ago, Niko182 said: "we are here for you 24/7, except when sales is closed". Lol Sales closes on weekends, but once you are a subscriber and have a technical problem you truly do have 24/7 technical support. Nor is there a long line in a queue to get help. They really are there for you. But if you don't fly out of the US you really don't need Jepp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59Moonster Posted June 18, 2020 Report Share Posted June 18, 2020 8 hours ago, kortopates said: Sales closes on weekends, but once you are a subscriber and have a technical problem you truly do have 24/7 technical support. Nor is there a long line in a queue to get help. They really are there for you. But if you don't fly out of the US you really don't need Jepp. I figured since I was an existing customer they would have helped me. After all, it sounds like a technical support problem to me. I had an old GPS, now I have new GPS and the cards are technically different . Either way, they lost my business when he told me their database is more accurate and that pilots should chose them because of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawnd Posted June 18, 2020 Report Share Posted June 18, 2020 Sales closes on weekends, but once you are a subscriber and have a technical problem you truly do have 24/7 technical support. Nor is there a long line in a queue to get help. They really are there for you. But if you don't fly out of the US you really don't need Jepp. I agree about Jepp tech support. Friendly and really they are available 24x7.Also, can someone with the Garmin NavData tell me what they list for FSS for KLMT on one of their devices like GTNs? Garmin pilot had listed an invalid frequency from their NavData that doesn’t exist in FAA charts or AFD. Jepp had the right one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yetti Posted June 18, 2020 Report Share Posted June 18, 2020 Download updates from Dynon site. Ya I had to be that guy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_elkhartian Posted June 20, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 Does any old USB—>SD Card reader work for the updates to the Garmin data card? or have they successfully figured out a way to force you to buy their $70 card dongle? Either way, I guess it’s not as bad as the $1.2k they charge for the WiFi flight stream 210 or whatever that is basically a branded $20 WiFi enabled memory card. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragsf15e Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 Just now, wingtipwalker said: Does any old USB—>SD Card reader work for the updates to the Garmin data card? or have they successfully figured out a way to force you to buy their $70 card dongle? Either way, I guess it’s not as bad as the $1.2k they charge for the WiFi flight stream 210 or whatever that is basically a branded $20 WiFi enabled memory card. Depends... for the old CF (I think) cards that the GNS430w uses, you have to buy the $60 garmin USB adapter. For the SD cards in the G1000 I fly, a cheap SD card reader works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niko182 Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 I use my laptop sd reader. It takes like 7 minutes to update both the g3x and the gnx375. Definetely not worth spending 1500 dollars on a 510 and another 100 per year on garmin pilot. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob - S50 Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 9 hours ago, wingtipwalker said: Does any old USB—>SD Card reader work for the updates to the Garmin data card? or have they successfully figured out a way to force you to buy their $70 card dongle? Either way, I guess it’s not as bad as the $1.2k they charge for the WiFi flight stream 210 or whatever that is basically a branded $20 WiFi enabled memory card. I use an inexpensive card reader to update databases for our GTN650. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toto Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 10 hours ago, wingtipwalker said: Either way, I guess it’s not as bad as the $1.2k they charge for the WiFi flight stream 210 or whatever that is basically a branded $20 WiFi enabled memory card. Yeah the FS510 is an honest to goodness $20 device that is sold for $1500, I suppose because everyone would have concerns about whether a generic wifi sd card would get flagged on a ramp check. Anyway, you're paying the $1500 for the data (which may well be nothing more than a text file with a serial number in it), and to create a disk image for sharing with pilot friends would certainly be sketchy from an IP perspective. But still. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 On 6/17/2020 at 5:54 PM, 0TreeLemur said: Towers sprout and grow. I update the terrain database once per year. Towers are the real threat descending into strange fields on a hot, bumpy, busy VFR day. A friend told me that having the GPS scream at you about a tower ahead is a real attention getter. "CAUTION! OBSTACLE AHEAD" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kortopates Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 14 hours ago, wingtipwalker said: Does any old USB—>SD Card reader work for the updates to the Garmin data card? or have they successfully figured out a way to force you to buy their $70 card dongle? Either way, I guess it’s not as bad as the $1.2k they charge for the WiFi flight stream 210 or whatever that is basically a branded $20 WiFi enabled memory card. Garmin gives you their card writer with the purchase of the GTN's - so I've never had a reason not to use one of the two I have. Till I had the FS-510 - now I don't spend any time messing with updating cards since its automatic. With the old GNS cards, which where more $ and proprietary, they only failed when you removed them to re-program or re-inserted them - always right before a flight. Frustrating. The touchless FS updating eliminates that besides giving your iPad connectivity to the units for exchanging flight plan data as well as uploading database updates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0TreeLemur Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 3 hours ago, flyboy0681 said: "CAUTION! OBSTACLE AHEAD" To quote Jeremy Clarkson: "Then some poo comes out." 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gacoon Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 On 6/17/2020 at 2:04 PM, David Lloyd said: Agree, the $299 Navigation Database for the US from Garmin gets all the airport info, approaches, arrivals, departures, etc. If you already have charts, obstacles, terrain on your Foreflight, just update those on the 650 every few years. Not familiar what is available or needed for the Aspen. I have an Aspen and that will work OK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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