CORRISION PROOFING DURING MAINTENANCE

[Danb]

At what point should we take measures to protect our engine from corrision during normal or long term maintenance.

Plane is in for annual for one month should we do any protective measures 

Plane is getting new panel expect one months downtime 

Plane is in for paint and new interior three- six months

I try to fly my plane weekly as recommended by many msers to prevent corrosion, sometimes difficult to do.

So I wanted guidance on what if anything to do when the plane is down for repairs or upgrades?

[PeytonM]

I think I remember an article in AOPA Pilot a few years ago that recommended an oil change an an extra pint of Camguard right before an extended storage, which I would interpret as longer than 1 month. I think Mike Busch has written on this subject, too.  I had hip replacement surgery a few years ago, and was AOG for 8 weeks, and I did an oil change plus extra CG. I even used desiccator plugs, which may have been overkill. It was wintertime in Chicago, so RH was low. The trouble with any of these recommendations is that there is little data supporting them.  Storage conditions during extended work on the plane vary across the country, and there is seasonal variability, too.

if you do oil analysis, you can follow iron to see if there’s a pop after extended storage, and then worry about THAT if you do.  I’ve not seen any variability. And then do you change the oil at 4 months, even if the plane sat idle for 2 months??

At the end of the day, it’s what YOU are comfortable with. 

[jetdriven]

Plug a dehydrator into it. No water, no rust. 

[Seymour]

Plenty of information and opinions about how and when to pickle an engine in this thread.   (Unfortunately, I didn't read it until the paint job extended well beyond the original quoted duration.)

 

[Guest]

Mist the cylinders with LPS#3 and install dehydrator plugs in place of the spark plugs, fresh oil and Camguard for the bottom end.

Clarence

[Planegary]

somewhere a few years ago i read where someone built a dessicator for their aircraft engine. does anybody remember reading this article or have any of you built a dessicator or do you just buy one already built?

 

[Kmac]

I would like other opinions on the following as well...

As I would do for my Mooney, following my father and other hangar neighbor, pull the dipstick after flying when the oil is hot you can see the steam/water leaving through the oil fill.  I see it as a way that must reduce water and rust in the engine.  Not necessarily for long term storage, but I would do it after each flight as I was preparing to leave the hangar.

[ArtVandelay]

Mist the cylinders with LPS#3 and install dehydrator plugs in place of the spark plugs, fresh oil and Camguard for the bottom end.
Clarence

I assume not in that order, because you have to run engine to check for leaks and flush the dirty oil, otherwise you’ll have dirty oil coating the engine and camguard is useless sitting in the pan.
Also wouldn’t removing the air filter and stuffing it with a rag to prevent outside air and moisture from getting into the engine be a good idea, saves having to refill the plugs.

[tmo]

1 hour ago, Planegary said:

somewhere a few years ago i read where someone built a dessicator for their aircraft engine. does anybody remember reading this article or have any of you built a dessicator or do you just buy one already built?

Something ready made or  something more or less home made?

FWIW, mine is an aquarium pump, pushing air into a food container with silca gel (aka kitty litter) which goes out through an air filter and into the oil dipstick.  Adding a humidity sensor to the "air drying box" today, in the long run I might end up closing the cycle and feeding the air from the engine (oil line) back into the aquarium pump.

[tigers2007]

I saw a desiccant dryer the other day where instead of a snap-lid food container the gentleman used a six foot or so of 1" vinyl tubing coiled up and full of desiccant. The air is forced to go through all of the desiccant material.   

[Guest]

1 hour ago, ArtVandelay said:

I assume not in that order, because you have to run engine to check for leaks and flush the dirty oil, otherwise you’ll have dirty oil coating the engine and camguard is useless sitting in the pan.
Also wouldn’t removing the air filter and stuffing it with a rag to prevent outside air and moisture from getting into the engine be a good idea, saves having to refill the plugs.

My post is conceptual in nature, not full step by step instructions.  Mooneyspace doesn’t pay me enough for that.

Clarence 

[Planegary]

the dryer i read about was home made and used an aquarium pump and i believe a 2 liter soda coke bottle for dessicant. it sounds like what you built

 

[DonMuncy]

8 hours ago, Planegary said:

somewhere a few years ago i read where someone built a dessicator for their aircraft engine. does anybody remember reading this article or have any of you built a dessicator or do you just buy one already built?

 

I built one. Glad to share details.

[Planegary]

please do share

 

[carusoam]

Some previous discussions...

• air flow
• drying mechanism
• what parts of the engine are included
• what parts of the engine are not
• how to handle the un-included parts...
• intake, cylinders, exhaust, case vent, oil cap...all air access points
• recharging the desiccant...

https://mooneyspace.com/search/?q=Engine desiccant dryer&updated_after=any&sortby=relevancy&search_and_or=and

Best regards,

-a-

[MoonFlyer68]

Due to my work, I am forced to take frequent 2 month breaks from flying my plane.  While I know this is not the cheapest option, I use the Black Max to help protect my engine during these extended times that I can't fly.

http://www.flyingsafer.com/p-n-2065.html

[DonMuncy]

My engine dryer. I used a much bigger compressor than necessary, I happened to have. Do not try to use one of the little compressors used to inflate a flat tire. They will not stand up to this use. I put mine on a timer and it comes on once a day for 5 minutes. (My WAG as to how much it should be run). The compressor blows into a hole drilled near the bottom of a half gallon glass container holding a desiccant . The outlet is at the top and is fed into the breather in the cowl flap (231). I remove the oil filler cap and temporarily replace it with a "one way valve" I constructed with a funnel and ping pong ball. The desiccant jar holds a indicator card that changes from blue to pink when it needs renewing (cooked in the oven at 375 degrees or so for 30 to 45 minutes.) I have been using the same desiccant for 10 years now. It usually need rejuvenation every 3 or 4 months. Feel free to ask if this is not enough info.

[Planegary]

simple and elegant,  thanks!

[tmo]

@DonMuncy - you are indeed the master tinkerer.  Thank you for sharing.  Questions:

 - is your desiccant silca gel, or something more advanced technologically?  what is the volume of the desiccant?

 - how did you seal the funnel in the oil filler tube?

 - when able, can you please post pictures / a detailed description of how you attach to the breather hose and how airtight that attachment is?

FWIW, I went the "positive pressure all the time" way to not worry about sealing the dry air in the engine, but would like to "upgrade" to a (semi) closed loop, possibly measuring the humidity of the positive pressure air.  But definitely going to a tube-type desiccant container to assure full flow through desiccant is top priority.

[DonMuncy]

I used some dry beads. I think they are silica. I used somewhere above a quart, because that was the volume of the jar I found. More or less would not make a difference, I think, except for how long between regenerations.

I built a cylindrical aluminum device about the same diameter of the oil filler, and used a toilet stool gasket to seal it over the filler neck. the funnel is glued (Plumbers Goop) inside the aluminum cylinder with the ping pong ball loose inside, I covered the top of the funnel with fabric to keep dust out.

The connection on the breather is made with a convenient size metal tube wrapped with electrical tape to just the right size to fit in the breather. Remember it has to extend inside far enough to get past the hole in the side of the breather. I will try to get photos next time I go to the hangar.

Perhaps a closed loop would be ideal in theory, but the positive pressure seems to work quite well, and I don't find the regeneration to be onerous. As to measuring the humidity level, I have zero idea about how good my system is. I also do not know how necessary or effective the entire system is, but it is pretty cheap insurance, and if you have too much time on your hands like I do …..

Feel free with more questions or PM, email etc. 214 207-6744 muncy-d@hotmail.com

[jetdriven]

14 hours ago, MilitaryAV8R said:

Due to my work, I am forced to take frequent 2 month breaks from flying my plane.  While I know this is not the cheapest option, I use the Black Max to help protect my engine during these extended times that I can't fly.

http://www.flyingsafer.com/p-n-2065.html

I also have a black max. Plug it into the breather. Loosen the dipstick. No corrosion.  Its 500$ but it preserves a $36,000 engine. More for a 231. 
Silica gel Descant Beads work too, but they need to be recharged fairly often. Get the orange indicating oneself mix with white, not the blue, cobalt is a carcinogen.

 You have to have a closed loop for this, because if you are taking it outside humid air, running it through a Desiccant bead system, a quart of beads will get saturated in a couple of days. Having it run less than an hour per day, it doesn’t do enough drying out inside the engine to be of much use.. I used to have a Tanis box and it would last for two weeks to a month. You need to keep a nice closed loop supply of dry air circulating through the engine and keep it that way.

Yes, it’s 500 bucks. It’s about the same price as taking a CFI out for three hours and getting real good instruction on slow flight or ILS’s  and landings for example, it is something that saves you from something that could be worse. The same rationale goes for the $1200 sidewinder. Our hanger has less than 1 foot of clearance each side of the tail. So it’s like well buy a sidewinder and sneak into the hanger very carefully, or push with your head down and pay for a $8,000 elevator every few years. It’s good money for a good cause. Preventatively

[EricJ]

14 hours ago, DonMuncy said:

My engine dryer. I used a much bigger compressor than necessary, I happened to have. Do not try to use one of the little compressors used to inflate a flat tire. They will not stand up to this use. I put mine on a timer and it comes on once a day for 5 minutes. (My WAG as to how much it should be run). The compressor blows into a hole drilled near the bottom of a half gallon glass container holding a desiccant . The outlet is at the top and is fed into the breather in the cowl flap (231). I remove the oil filler cap and temporarily replace it with a "one way valve" I constructed with a funnel and ping pong ball. The desiccant jar holds a indicator card that changes from blue to pink when it needs renewing (cooked in the oven at 375 degrees or so for 30 to 45 minutes.) I have been using the same desiccant for 10 years now. It usually need rejuvenation every 3 or 4 months. Feel free to ask if this is not enough info.

I always like hearing about your invention gismos here.   Very cool stuff and pragmatic.