rbridges Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 I finally broke down and bought a bad elf for a first generation wifi ipad. My primary goal is to put my sectionals and IFR plates on the ipad. I figured the GPS part would be a bonus. I'm only VFR now, but I'm planning to resume my instrument training when it gets a little cooler. I realize there have been a ton of threads about ipad apps, but I wanted to know what's most simple and cost effective. Also, do these digital copies meet the requirements for sectionals/charts needed for flight i.e. can I quit buying the paper copies and junking up my cockpit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BorealOne Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Foreflight is by far the best choice - preflight wx + planning, enroute and terminal charts, and GPS. Nothing else comes close. As to legalities, the current guidance seems to be: AC 120-76a section ’1. Purpose’: “Other part 91 operations do not require any specific authorization for EFB operations provided the EFB does not replace any system or equipment required by the regulations.” More on http://blog.foreflight.com/2010/05/08/ipad-aviation-aopa-and-fsdo-approval/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted September 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 thanks for the info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danb35 Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 ...and, to add to what the AC says, part 91 operations in light aircraft don't have any legal requirement for charts onboard the aircraft. That is, you can have old charts, unofficial charts (e.g., state-published charts), hand-drawn charts, or no charts at all, and you're perfectly legal (with the exception of the Los Angeles SFRA, and possibly others). Of course, if you have something other than a current FAA (or Jepp) chart and, as a result, do something stupid/dangerous/illegal, you'll get busted under 91.103 in addition to whatever else they might get. I have Foreflight on my iPad, but haven't had a chance to fly with it yet. It's great to have the whole country on a magazine-sized device, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted September 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Quote: danb35 ...and, to add to what the AC says, part 91 operations in light aircraft don't have any legal requirement for charts onboard the aircraft. That is, you can have old charts, unofficial charts (e.g., state-published charts), hand-drawn charts, or no charts at all, and you're perfectly legal (with the exception of the Los Angeles SFRA, and possibly others). I didn't realize that. I thought it was mandatory to have a current sectional to operate your plane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danb35 Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Quote: rbridges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Back in the day, outdated charts were a violation. People were afraid to have them in the plane. Overall a silly idea to throw away plan B. FAA has a history of being slow, but sometimes moves in the right direction. Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 That is funny. I won't throw out old charts, you never know when you might need them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panther1400 Posted September 4, 2011 Report Share Posted September 4, 2011 Just got to use wingx for the first time today on a flight from Denver to Minnesota and I think it is great with the Skyradar, not saying foreflight isnt good but I started learning Wingx and love it so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 Soon to be WingX fans, If you are a first time buyer, and were thinking of purchasing WingX in the near future, Hilton is donating a significant portion of revenue to 9/11 related charities.....see details below. http://campaign.r20.constantcontact.com/render?llr=y9zjvlfab&v=001Xb0L0r5qCg29nORQzOcbyN8usLTClLb6UMFLOYV1JWC9q80cjLr707CB4AEA6C8-QVnw27MglTNRoIHyY172_mNlt8h11to6nE-uNLJDRIs%3D Remembering 9/11 Hilton Software LLC will donate 91.1% of all revenue from initial subscriptions of WingX Pro7 for iPad purchased via the App Store on Sunday 9/11/2011. We will be donating the money to the following charities: Children's Cancer Research Fund Angel Flight West Wounded Warrior We call on other companies to donate to their favorite charities on this important day. Sincerely, Hilton * This does not include Synthetic Vision or Fuel subscriptions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted September 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2011 I just did a 400 mile trip and used foreflight w/bad elf. I don't have 3g on the ipad, so I downloaded the vfr sectionals for GA, NC and SC. I absolutely loved it in comparison to the paper charts. I could get airport information so much easier, and tracking the flight was great. I have a 430, and this is a great supplement for it. It would be great if I had 3g so that weather could be added. Just from my limited use, I loved it. My only gripe is that the screen is somewhat hard to read in the bright daylight. edit-I just found out that the ipad was set on the dimmest screen setting, so that may not be an issue next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danb35 Posted September 11, 2011 Report Share Posted September 11, 2011 3G reception in the air is spotty at best--you're going to want to look at XM or ADS-B for inflight wx. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Immelman Posted September 13, 2011 Report Share Posted September 13, 2011 Quote: rbridges I realize there have been a ton of threads about ipad apps, but I wanted to know what's most simple and cost effective. Also, do these digital copies meet the requirements for sectionals/charts needed for flight i.e. can I quit buying the paper copies and junking up my cockpit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlunseth Posted September 13, 2011 Report Share Posted September 13, 2011 rbridges- There are two sliders for setting the brightness of Foreflight in your iPad. One is in the Settings button of the iPad, and the other is in "Brightness & Wallpaper" in Foreflight. The Foreflight instructions say you are supposed to reduce the setting in the iPad first, and then use the slider in Foreflight to reduce it further (for night ops). But either one of the two will affect the brightness. If you need yours full bright, just make sure both settings are full bright, or you will still be getting about half bright (which probably describes alot of us, but that's beside the point). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted September 13, 2011 Report Share Posted September 13, 2011 We have local charts in paper but the iPad is wondeful for an X-C trip, we were going to spend 250$ in paper charts for a houston-oshkosh-canada trip. So we bought the iPad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackn Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 Just want to pass this along. I just bought 3G iPad2. 3G must be on to get GPS to work. Last week I shot two approaches in actual IFR. The GS wouldnt couple on either one. Over the weekend I shot a few more, this time with the iPad shut off, and everything worked fine. Today I shot another with the iPad on, GS wouldn't couple. I don't know whether it's the 3G or the WiFi that's interfering, as both were on. I fly with the KFC-150. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 Hmm, glideslope, or iPad with the approach plate, pick any one. Can you put a bad elf on it in airplane mode and see what it does? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 Hmm, glideslope, or iPad with the approach plate, pick any one. Can you put a bad elf on it in airplane mode and see what it does? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 JackN, This seems to be a pretty important discovery. Since the AP is not driven by an antenna, I would more suspect interference with the GS receiver. Piloto and others will know more. What do you have for a receiver? Garmin 430/530? I have a BK KX 165 coupled with a KAP 150 and have seen some less than perfect behavior. Now I am wondering if I have seen something similar. Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrBill Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 I suspect the 3G part of the IPAD. Probably overpowering the sensitive GS receiver. You should be able to disable each radio in the IPAD separately like I can do with my IPOD Touch. That will indicate which one is doing it. THe 3G transmitter will vary power but peak at about 7 watts. Being shielded in your cabin is probably makeing it pump out the power to get to a tower. I don't fly wiht my cell phone on in IMC for that reason. Dr. Bill BTW Wireless is my specialty... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 Wireless Dr. Bill now brings up another important detail... Could be the cell phone doing the deed as well.... Now i have some flight testing to do.... Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottfromiowa Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 I used my wifes IPad II with Wing X Pro. The 3 g is NOT I repeat NOT enabled and the GPS function in the IPAD worked flawlessly. You do NOT have to have the 3g enabled in the Ipad II to have functional GPS... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 Ipad1 test Wifi -off Cellular data (3G) -off GPS still works Airplane mode - on GPS not available with airplane mode on. Probably a good idea to turn off wifi prior to flight. It is my understanding that some battery power is required to keep searching for wifi connection. Quick review... Turning airplane mode on, kills 3G, wifi and gps receiver. Leaving airplane mode off, and turning off wifi and/or 3G leaves the GPS receiver operational. Overall the airplane mode was a wishful attempt to allow us to use iPads during take off and landing phases of commercial flight. Continental is uninterested in how great my electronic device is, it is still an electronic device with a switch. Unfortunately the internal GPS can't keep up very well with such small airliner windows.... Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 is this also true with a bad elf? Or does the wireless need to be on to enable that as well? I have a iPad 2 wifi and it works great with the bad elf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackn Posted September 15, 2011 Report Share Posted September 15, 2011 Thanks Carusoam. You are correct. Still getting to know the iPad, I like it on my lap, but its too big on the yoke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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