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1977 M20J with 1057-00-5G Actuator issue


DEGWS

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Hi from Germany,

I had the first gear issue with my M20J today. When I seleted gear down the gear starts to extend. But Icould hear that it was getting slower and slower until it stopped. I think it was about 80% down with the gear unsafe light on. Tried to select gear up and this worked fine. After checking electrical volts and CBs I tried a second time to lower the gear and it worked. Green light! Perfect!

Anyone has an idea what could be the problem? After thinking about the flight today...: When I retracted the gear after takeoff I realized that the gear comes up slower than before. Not too much but definitely slower. The Motor?

Thanks for your ideas!

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Where would you send the Motor and actuator? Is it possible to remove only the motor?

I had an issue with the flap motor about 2 years ago. I cleaned the motor with brushes and the collector. After it worked again without and issue.

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Welcome aboard DEGWS!

Common starting places... with the support of your mechanic... (if needed)

1) up on jacks...

2) clean and lube all mechanical parts...

3) make sure the emergency gear is properly stowed...

4) operating differently depending on the direction... sounds a lot like relays, and switches... and other electrical parts of the system...

5) mechanical binding usually throws a breaker...

6) in the case of interference with the E-gear... damage to a brass gear occurs first... possibly making gear extension impossible.

7) Some Mooney electric motors went to globe motors for OH.  There is probably a specific place to go for that one...

Private Pilot thoughts only, not a mechanic...

Best regards,

-a-

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2 hours ago, DEGWS said:

Hi from Germany,

I had the first gear issue with my M20J today. When I seleted gear down the gear starts to extend. But Icould hear that it was getting slower and slower until it stopped. I think it was about 80% down with the gear unsafe light on. Tried to select gear up and this worked fine. After checking electrical volts and CBs I tried a second time to lower the gear and it worked. Green light! Perfect!

Anyone has an idea what could be the problem? After thinking about the flight today...: When I retracted the gear after takeoff I realized that the gear comes up slower than before. Not too much but definitely slower. The Motor?

Thanks for your ideas!

I would not fly the plane again until you get this resolved.  You need to break the system down into 3 main parts, the actuator, the electrical system and the landing gear themselves.

With the plane on jacks disconnect the actuator rod end bearing from the retraction truss.  Make sure that the landing gear all move freely and smoothly, clean and grease the system per the maintenance manual, WD40 is not an approved lubricant for any airplane. Make sure that nothing is caught in the gear.  While SB M20-190B doesn’t mention your gear actuator by part number, it suffers the same type of internal gear wear and is cheap inspect and grease.

LASAR in California can repair the actuator if needed.

Some relays/solenoids can be opened to inspect the contact area, if damaged or worn replacement may be required.

Clarence

 

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On Tuesday I will have a closer look on the gear. The actuator and Motor has been overhauled in 2011 about 450 hours of flying ago. I always lubricate the actuator and gear as written in the manual every 100h or at least every 12 month. So I suspect that should not be the problem. I will first have a closer look to the solenoids and wiring. Which solenoids you can recommend for replacement?

 

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24 minutes ago, Gagarin said:

I got very good results with WD-40. Besides lubricating it removes all the dirt from the rod ends and is not sticky.

It is not sticky, but it does leave behind a film that can attract dirt (the WD stands for water displacement). The reason Triflow is specified is that it is a dry film lubricant that doesn't attract dirt. Dirt is what wears out rod ends. 

I don't think WD-40 is recommended for anything in aviation, but I'd be willing to be proved wrong if someone finds a reference. It is great for coating circular saw blades to keep them from rusting, though. :)

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So does Tri-flow, and it doesn’t ruin your Teflon coated rod ends. Nor does it attract dirt, like WD40 does, which ruins rod ends. Seriously, quit giving bad advice. I’m going to call you out every time. 

It says tri-Flow on rod ends right there in the service manual.  There is a a reason for that. Reasons perhaps you don’t understand, or why you think you are so smug and smarter than the factory that built it.  

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3 hours ago, PT20J said:

It is not sticky, but it does leave behind a film that can attract dirt (the WD stands for water displacement). The reason Triflow is specified is that it is a dry film lubricant that doesn't attract dirt. Dirt is what wears out rod ends. 

I don't think WD-40 is recommended for anything in aviation, but I'd be willing to be proved wrong if someone finds a reference. It is great for coating circular saw blades to keep them from rusting, though. :)

Skip

Check this out https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=wd-40+IN+AVIATION&qpvt=wd-40+IN+AVIATION&view=detail&mid=4DDB6CE4B74EF9AE2AFC4DDB6CE4B74EF9AE2AFC&&FORM=VRDGAR&ru=%2Fvideos%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dwd-40%2BIN%2BAVIATION%26qpvt%3Dwd-40%2BIN%2BAVIATION%26FORM%3DVQFRML

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Standard WD40 is not a lubricant: https://youtu.be/f6531zzBkcE

They make a silicone version that is as well as a PTFE version, but why are we even having this discussion over a 10 dollar container of lube? The service manual specifies what to use, if your engine says 5w-30 do you use 0w-20?

 

 

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Today with plane on jacks I cycled the gear several times. Now I am pretty sure that the motor is the problem. Motor is sometimes slower but every cycle on a different position. Issue is in both directions, up and down.

Is it possible to remove the motor without removing the complete actuator? Brushes are sealed with epoxy or something like this. Any ideas how to open to check Them and replace?

 

thanks 

Edited by DEGWS
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7 minutes ago, DEGWS said:

Today with plane on jacks I cycled the gear several times. Now I am pretty sure that the motor is the problem. Motor is sometimes slower but every cycle on a different position. Issue is in both directions, up and down.

Is ist possible to remove the motor without removing the complete actuator? Brushes are sealed with epoxy or something like this. Any ideas how to open to check Them and replace?

 

thanks 

You should run them manually with the emergency system so you can feel the gear and see if it is binding. 

To check the brushes, use a pick or an x-acto knife to pop the epoxy off. Replace the epoxy when you are done.

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