New Garmin GI275 think round G5's

[Marauder]

Just now, aviatoreb said:

I agree too - so the nature of my question was the thought is there may well still be some residual value in our mechanical gyro instruments but it will be dropping.

That said, it is a legit position for someone to say, hey I have an old (say KFC200) autopilot and I can keep it running with all the cheap seconds people are now dumping on the market.

There is one Mooney owner, who will remain nameless, that cornered the eBay market on the Collins NavCom. He bought a half dozen of them at dirt cheap prices and has been steadily replacing them as they fail over the last several years. He is down to his last unit and is now just starting to look at NavComs.

[aviatoreb]

2 minutes ago, Marauder said:

There is one Mooney owner, who will remain nameless, that cornered the eBay market on the Collins NavCom. He bought a half dozen of them at dirt cheap prices and has been steadily replacing them as they fail over the last several years. He is down to his last unit and is now just starting to look at NavComs.

Right - perfect.  That is exactly what I mean.  It is a very legit idea.

[Marauder]

Just now, aviatoreb said:

Right - perfect.  That is exactly what I mean.  It is a very legit idea.

The Collins radio owner epitomizes the motto of the Cheap Bastard's club, "Hold them so tight that Abe Lincoln's eyes bulge". 

[Skates97]

8 hours ago, GLJA said:

So..... how long before Uavionix and Garmin have a lawsuit battle again over this and the AV-30?

 

5 hours ago, Marauder said:

 

Have you looked at the prices? Those 4 units alone based on the “starting at” prices listed on the Garmin site will run you $11k. Add in the GADs, you probably are pushing $15k.

I wonder what this does to the G5 business. Orphan the product?


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Looking at what these and the price it makes me glad to have put the pre-order on two AV-30's about a year ago and locking in the $1,495 price for each. 

[hypertech]

I'm having this discussion with my avionics shop now.  I'm on the schedule for 2 G5s and a GFC500.  I'm leaning towards staying the course.  These new gauges have a higher resolution but more packed onto a smaller screen.  Other than synthetic vision, I'm not sure I see a functional difference over G5s.  And they are quite a bit more expensive.  The timeline is also longer - it could interface to my KFC225 now, but not a GFC 500 till later this summer.

If I did the staged upgrade of two of these now and then the GFC500 when a servo goes or something else is wrong with the autopilot, the total overall cost is quite a bit higher - and I'd have to pay the shop to cut into the wiring twice.  The alternative is square gauges, slightly lower resolution, no synthetic vision but a complete clean sheet installation.

[MBDiagMan]

That clears up why the Avionics AV30’s certification has been held up.

[tigers2007]

AeroVonics better start talking about their AV-30 legacy autopilot interface ASAP. I can care less about the the fancy display clutter data. Just give me a digital AI that will drive my Century IIb and we’ll call it good.


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[pwnel]

1 hour ago, tigers2007 said:

AeroVonics better start talking about their AV-30 legacy autopilot interface ASAP. I can care less about the the fancy display clutter data. Just give me a digital AI that will drive my Century IIb and we’ll call it good.
 

Yip, exactly my point too.  And I suspect same for most folks who want to just keep the Century's going.

 

2 hours ago, hypertech said:

I'm having this discussion with my avionics shop now.  I'm on the schedule for 2 G5s and a GFC500.  I'm leaning towards staying the course.  These new gauges have a higher resolution but more packed onto a smaller screen.  Other than synthetic vision, I'm not sure I see a functional difference over G5s.  And they are quite a bit more expensive.  The timeline is also longer - it could interface to my KFC225 now, but not a GFC 500 till later this summer.

If I did the staged upgrade of two of these now and then the GFC500 when a servo goes or something else is wrong with the autopilot, the total overall cost is quite a bit higher - and I'd have to pay the shop to cut into the wiring twice.  The alternative is square gauges, slightly lower resolution, no synthetic vision but a complete clean sheet installation.

Out of interest - what is the labor quote for installing your two G5s? (or is it mixed in with the GFC500?) For two 275s interfaced to my Century one avionics expert today said to expect 40 hours.  That sounds about 30 hours more than I expected.  

EDIT: seems 30 hours labor for a dual G5 install is actually fairly standard

Edited January 15, 2020 by pwnel

[Yetti]

4 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

I was not aware - will a D10A drive a KFC200?

It will drive the Dynon Servos. It has the Autopilot software integrated into the EFIS   No need for another box. Well technically it should have the A/P Panel

[aviatoreb]

25 minutes ago, Yetti said:

It will drive the Dynon Servos. It has the Autopilot software integrated into the EFIS   No need for another box. Well technically it should have the A/P Panel

Ok - well yeah but then you need to buy an autopilot.  And is a d10a and dynon autopilot system w/o sky view certified?  And is any of that certified for Mooney?

[aviatoreb]

2 hours ago, MBDiagMan said:

That clears up why the Avionics AV30’s certification has been held up.

Are you suggesting these are rebranded av30s in disguise?  If you aren’t... now I am wondering anyway... maybe they are?  Otherwise they are a avp30 “knock off” in quotes since they did it better and faster.

Edited January 16, 2020 by aviatoreb

[Yetti]

9 minutes ago, aviatoreb said:

Ok - well yeah but then you need to buy an autopilot.  And is a d10a and dynon autopilot system w/o sky view certified?  And is any of that certified for Mooney?

Nope you are not getting it.  The EFIS and the autopilot are in the D10A all that would need to be added is 3 servos for $750 each. and more than likely the A/P panel for $550  moving from experimental world to certified.   The D10A is certified for the whole Mooney line through the EAA.   The STC is $100 from the EAA.  Not yet on the servo install in the Mooney.  Garmin does not have an A/P solution for the vintage models either.

[tigers2007]

I am a cheap bast**d who spends money unwisely. No way I'm going to sink 20 AMU's into my '64D to get a EFIS with TruTrak or Garmin autopilot. If I can dump 7AMU's or so and have a fancy EFIS linked to my legacy Century then its fair game.

[aviatoreb]

29 minutes ago, Yetti said:

Nope you are not getting it.  The EFIS and the autopilot are in the D10A all that would need to be added is 3 servos for $750 each. and more than likely the A/P panel for $550  moving from experimental world to certified.   The D10A is certified for the whole Mooney line through the EAA.   The STC is $100 from the EAA.  Not yet on the servo install in the Mooney.  Garmin does not have an A/P solution for the vintage models either.

I’m not getting it. I don’t understand.  What you are describing  is simply not available for Mooney or any certified airplane for that matter.  Am I wrong?  Not if I want an autopilot.  Sure the d10a is available for my Mooney but not for any autopilot not even the dynon autopilot.  

and I thought that dynon is planning for autopilot for Mooney but as a package with the sky view system.  A fantastic system, but not yet available.  And a lot more than just d10a and servos.

Edited January 16, 2020 by aviatoreb

[jetdriven]

I was told by the Dynon rep at OSH that a full skyview with autopilot and ADSb is over 30k.  Only their certified installation shop can do the work and it’s a complete package for the most part. So cheaper than Garmin but not by much.  I have a quote for a g3x touch and GFC500 for 40k

[McMooney]

Woot can see 2 of these and  gfc500/TRUTRAK in my future, man I feel broke

[bradp]

18 hours ago, MilitaryAV8R said:

Typical of Garmin, did you notice that it only lists Garmin products for GPS source?  I guess if you have Avidyne or some other system you are out of luck.  I am still planning to wait for the Dynon autopilot approval and then install the full HDX system.

It’ll work but just won’t be listed on the STC IM. 

[jetdriven]

17 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

I agree too - so the nature of my question was the thought is there may well still be some residual value in our mechanical gyro instruments but it will be dropping.

That said, it is a legit position for someone to say, hey I have an old (say KFC200) autopilot and I can keep it running with all the cheap seconds people are now dumping on the market.

One issue with gyros in the KFC 200, you have to have them aligned every time you install a new gyro in the panel. So there is that expense.

[MIm20c]

12 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

Are you suggesting these are rebranded av30s in disguise?  If you aren’t... now I am wondering anyway... maybe they are?  Otherwise they are a avp30 “knock off” in quotes since they did it better and faster.

I really don’t think you can compare the Garmin unit to the av30. Construction wise a fully certified TSO’d unit designed for twin turbine aircraft. The build looks to be a big step above the G5 from the outside/connections. My guess is the per unit cost is way above the G5. 

[tigers2007]

Larry Anglisano is probably going bananas knowing he can make another video with Garmin's Jessica Koss. I'm not sure if someone posted yet but here is Garmin's official video on the tube.

[Jerry 5TJ]

I saved a spot for the GI 275 when I did a copilot side clean-up last year:

[tigers2007]

I really wonder how much head-scratching goes on in the accounting department to determine the pricing; dart board? Their EIS starts at 5.3 AMU's. That is ridiculous considering EI's CGR-30 is 3.1 to 3.7 AMU's. There is no comparison to an EDM-930 considering how small the screen is.

I was perusing the Pilot's Guide and it appears that a GMU-11 will be required for the autopilot thus adding to the installation cost.

**Update** Sarasota Avionics has posted their prices and shows the Garmin 275 EIS w/4cyl sensors for $4,678 (12% off MSRP). They show the plain jane AI version for $3,489 and the AI version with heading and autopilot interface for $4,689.

[jetdriven]

Question I have is will they ship this box to me. On bt the Garmin rep said  those are required dealer installation

[tigers2007]

Just now, jetdriven said:

Question I have is will they ship this box to me. On bt the Garmin rep said  those are required dealer installation

Call Sarasota and ask if p/n 010-02327-20  can you shipped to you direct. 1-888-289-0997

The mystery will be if they have this in stock or if they are drop shipping them directly from a Garmin fulfillment center.

[Oldguy]

37 minutes ago, tigers2007 said:

Call Sarasota and ask if p/n 010-02327-20  can you shipped to you direct. 1-888-289-0997

The mystery will be if they have this in stock or if they are drop shipping them directly from a Garmin fulfillment center.

Their web site says "Install only", but is that negotiable if you are another avionics shop, or is it truly "Dealer only install"?