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Need Help Finding Tank Resealer


cliffy

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We have a local Mooney (G) in a hangar here that has developed what can only be described as a HUGE tank leak on the right tank and a much smaller one on the left. The owner wants both resealed and knows generally what its going to cost. I looked it over and told him to drain the right and not use it. I would have no problem with him flying on the left only to get it to a repair shop. 

The owner is preferring, if it can be worked out, to have someone come out here (KPGA) and do it in his hangar, if not, he'll fly it somewhere else. He would really prefer to have it done in his hangar, if at all possible. 

Anyone in the group know of a repair shop out here in AZ, NV, UT, or CA (maybe even CO) that would come out here to the middle of nowhere to do this job?  He's aware of expenses for hotels, travel and food, etc. How about any knowledge of who can even do it in their shop out here in the wild west? Anyone had a complete reseal out here?

I would be most appreciative of any leads at all    Thanks 

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29 minutes ago, cliffy said:

 He's been advised but still would prefer it to flying it somewhere  if at all possible. 

Who wouldn't prefer that? If there was a wet tank specialist, Mooney or otherwise, that would be willing to haul all of their equipment all over the country and live on the road I think we would have heard about them by now. A local mobile mechanic coming to your hangar is one thing, mobile tank re-sealant is a different story since it takes many days to get the job done. Even if someone was doing this, the price would most likely be much more than most people would be willing to pay.

If you're his friend help him to realize that getting an expert (someone who has perfected this and does it all of the time) to come to him at a price he would be willing to pay is never going to happen. Experts in that field have a home base where people come from all directions, not the other way around. They can work on more than one airplane at a time since there's time in the old sealant dissolving and the new sealant curing. At the most, with good weather planning,  it might take him two days to get it to somewhere they do this on one tank and take an airline home with a 2-3 week return ticket. 

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2 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

Who wouldn't prefer that? If there was a wet tank specialist, Mooney or otherwise, that would be willing to haul all of their equipment all over the country and live on the road I think we would have heard about them by now. A local mobile mechanic coming to your hangar is one thing, mobile tank re-sealant is a different story since it takes many days to get the job done. Even if someone was doing this, the price would most likely be much more than most people would be willing to pay.

If you're his friend help him to realize that getting an expert (someone who has perfected this and does it all of the time) to come to him at a price he would be willing to pay is never going to happen. Experts in that field have a home base where people come from all directions, not the other way around. They can work on more than one airplane at a time since there's time in the old sealant dissolving and the new sealant curing. At the most, with good weather planning,  it might take him two days to get it to somewhere they do this on one tank and take an airline home with a 2-3 week return ticket. 

Agree completely. I told him I would at least try to find someone but that he would probably need to take it somewhere.  I know of a couple of places ( yes MN and TX) but I haven't heard of any out here, Maybe there is one or two but I don't know  hence pulling on the combined knowledge base of MS!   :-)

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I would recommend that he try to find someone to patch it first.  I patched mine using Maxwells method two years ago and it is still leak free flying from a grass strip.  I did remove the old sealant from the leaking area prior to patching.  You should be able to find somebody that could patch it at least.  

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2 hours ago, cliffy said:

Yes understood the problems doing it in place. He's been advised but still would prefer it to flying it somewhere  if at all possible. 

He can prefer all he wants. But it's not gonna happen. As others have said, this job requires a large amount of large and cumbersome equipment. It also takes a lot of time. It's not the hands on working time, but short amounts of work followed by hours or days of waiting for things to dry, cure, dissolve, etc. This is why you need a permanent shop location and several airplanes in for the work at the same time. 

The typical cost for this job is $7000 give or take $1000. I would expect if there were such a thing as a mobile operation, it would cost 5x to 10x that amount. He'd be better off to push the plane into the scrap heap and buy a new one.

 

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The big players are Paul Beck at Oasis Aero in Flying Cloud (?), MN; Don Maxwell at KGGG and the nice folks in Troutdale, OR have licensed his process; and Edison at Wet Wingologists in sunny South Florida (Edison did my C in 2010). Houston Tank Specialists are also beginning to make a name for themselves. Seems the folks in southern IL are no longer doing their polyurethane sealig process, but it had a 30-40% higher price anyway.

I doubt the job can be done for 7AMU anymore, I paid almost that much . . . What size tanks does the G have? Mine are 52 gal; expect to pay at least 1AMU more for 64 gal tanks.

Realisticly, I would expect prices to be in the 10AMU range, which is also what bladder install cost back in 2010, in addition to the weight penalty. 

Seems like there was a thread several years ago describing how to make some sort of sprayer and recirculating pump for adventurous souls who wanted to roll their own strip and reseal, but there's still a lot of handwork required to make sure that the old sealant is completely gone. Then of course, applying new sealant is entirely hand done, all through awkward, small access panels, with lots of areas [like drainage holes through ribs, tank vents, etc.] that need to NOT be coated . . . . Not a job for the timid, and not for this hands-on engineer.

Good luck finding someone willing to come to your friend. Likely won't find anyone, and if you do, it will likely be an inexperienced person. This is really not a job for a beginner unless well supervised by someone who knows what is being done and what should be done.

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53 minutes ago, Hank said:

The big players are Paul Beck at Oasis Aero in Flying Cloud (?), MN; Don Maxwell at KGGG and the nice folks in Troutdale, OR have licensed his process; and Edison at Wet Wingologists in sunny South Florida (Edison did my C in 2010). Houston Tank Specialists are also beginning to make a name for themselves. Seems the folks in southern IL are no longer doing their polyurethane sealig process, but it had a 30-40% higher price anyway.

I believe Don Maxwell doesn't do complete re-seals, but will patch. I think he refers complete re-seals to Paul Beck/WeepNoMore in Wilmar MN

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http://donmaxwell.com/fuel-tank-repairs-how-we-fix-them/

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/prosealant.php?clickkey=16658

...etc...

Sounds like you need to likely patch less-bad tank to get it safe to ferry someplace else.

Or perhaps try the the leak-detection method above and patch on the bad tank too?

 

Edited by Immelman
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3 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

He can prefer all he wants. But it's not gonna happen. As others have said, this job requires a large amount of large and cumbersome equipment. It also takes a lot of time.

Maybe for a strip and reseal. But a patch requires very ordinary tools. 
 

-Robert 

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Thanks to Hank for the awesome summary!

I did get to speak with Carl Sharon from Houston Tank Sealing at the Mooney Summit...

One option that didn’t get mentioned...

Is the person in need a member of the eternal CB club...?

Sometimes life puts you in the CB club for an extended period of time...

There is one thread around here that demonstrates how to strip and reseal your own...

If roll your own makes sense... find Alex’s thread...

 

The challenge with the mobile idea... doing it right may take a second trip...

The big shops warranty the work and offer to fix the leak by bringing it back... and / or will go to the plane to do the work... (or something similar to that)

I had DMax reseal the top access panels as part of the PPI a decade ago... the patch has worked well for a decade...

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic...

Best regards,

-a-

 

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I did my rebuild in a T hanger in Dallas, TX.  Instrumental in the process was a sheetmetal mechanic from Gulstream.  We initially cleaned the tanks and sealed them in the hangar so the airplane could be flown (next stop was avionics).  We could have used ferry tanks but chose to take a stab at sealing them (the tanks had already been cleaned).  That allowed us to at least fly the plane to central Tx where eventually a leak developed.  We then flew the airplane to Paul Beck where the tanks were restripped and done correctly.  

This job is more than just getting the tanks clean and painting on sealant.  Experience in knowing what can and will go wrong is important.  

Patch the tanks if necessary before the flight.  The plane can be flown on one tank, you just need to watch consumption and make more fuel stops.  

My experience with Paul Beck has been excellent and I would refer anyone to him without reservation.

John Breda

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I sincirely hope that all the fine folks from the Mooney factory have alreday found new jobs.  The job market, in general, seems to be doing great, and this is a highly specialized industry where ratings and experience do matter a lot.

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What is the plane owner's objection to taking it somewhere? If he doesn't want to make the trip, there are people building hours who will ferry it for him for just expenses. I posted a request for a ferry pilot on the mooney fb group and my inbox was filled up with people wanting to do it.

 

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, M20F-1968 said:

.  The plane can be flown on one tank, you just need to watch consumption and make more fuel stops.  

 

 

 

That’s debatable. I know some of the fsc will not allow their pilots to fly with one tank. A bad seal in your selector will mean you’ll suck air into the fuel system.

some people go multiple years without changing the seals in the selector. 

-Robert 

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