Which Mooney to pick

[StevenL757]

Warren, can you share anything more about whether your budget includes some of the items others have indicated?  I can guarantee you won’t be finding a reliable C model with a modern up-to-date redundant cockpit that will reduce workload on the long XC trips you’re describing.  Given your mission, I suggest reconsidering your target aircraft and/or upping your budget.

Steve

[jghyde]

I found a C for under $45k in 2019. It has great exterior paint, good leather interior, full IFR, old GPS & no ADS-B. That last annual will cost me around 12 amus as I am overhauling the prop and re-rigged the gear (manual gear), replaced engine mounts, and re-rigged and replaced the two elevator bushings in the tail. Next, a new panel will cost me 20 amus. And I'll probably put in an overhauled O360 engine at the end of 2020. By the time I'm done, $102.5k baby! And it will still be worth $50k. It's a sickness. But I can go places at 143 KTAS at 10 gph.

 

[steingar]

Like the guys said, 50 AMUs will buy a nice C or a crap E.  Are those coast to coast trips on a schedule?  If so, plan on tubing them.   Very few GA aircraft have a decent dispatch rate and the ability to handle those kinds of flights on a routine basis. None of them a can be had for 50 AMUs.

The really pivotal question is who do you need to bring?  If you've a spouse and kids to bring with, you might want the bigger back seat of the F.  

[warrenehc]

No kids. Just me and the Lady. My flight schedule is flexible.

[kellym]

On 12/27/2019 at 2:06 PM, warrenehc said:

Hello, I am a low time pilot (250 hours), but I have multiple cross country flights from coast to coast. 

I have owned and flown a Cessna 150 since 0 hour of flight training. 

Im looking to get into a M20 C,E,orF

I have been doing the research and know the differences of carb and injected, the leg room and fuel capacity between the three. 

What I’m looking for is opinions and suggestions on what to step into next.

Budget is around 50k. 

 

With that budget, look for a C. They are the most numerous, least expensive to maintain, and cruise within 5 kts of the E and F. You want to keep at least 10% of purchase price for unforseen maintenance the first few years. Get the nicest C you can find within your budget.

The leg room for the front seats is identical, only back seat leg room is increased in the F.  The E is the fastest of the 3, but in most cases won't make much difference. Only if you plan on operating in frequent high density altitude operations will the extra power of the E be a significant difference. It will out climb the other 2.

[Hank]

13 minutes ago, kellym said:

The E is the fastest of the 3, but in most cases won't make much difference. Only if you plan on operating in frequent high density altitude operations will the extra power of the E be a significant difference. It will out climb the other 2.

Agree that the speed difference is pretty negligible. But a C climbs pretty well even on a hot summer afternoon when it has a 3-blade Hartzell on the nose! 

[M20F]

You talk about your mission but not your personality.   Do you look good in a suit?  Do people gravitate to you?  Do you eschew a $100 hamburger for a martini and a cigar?  If so step into an Executive and people will know you have arrived. 

Edited January 2, 2020 by M20F
Spelling!

[carusoam]

Eschew... new MS word of the day... 

-a-

[drapo]

1 hour ago, M20F said:

You talk about your mission but not your personality.   Do you look good in a suit?  Do people gravitate to you?  Do you askew a $100 hamburger for a martini and a cigar?  If so step into an Executive and people will know you have arrived. 

Or... if you wear your cape plus a yellow and red logo  under your suit and if you  dislike kryptonite, then you have to get a SUPER 21 

[DonMuncy]

 

9 hours ago, carusoam said:

Eschew... new MS word of the day... 

-a-

The intellect and  vocabularies of MSers is amazing

[Hank]

15 hours ago, carusoam said:

Eschew... new MS word of the day... 

-a-

Eschew obfuscation! 

[M20F]

8 hours ago, DonMuncy said:

 

The intellect and  vocabularies of MSers is amazing

More so some then others :-)

[0TreeLemur]

On 12/31/2019 at 8:45 PM, warrenehc said:

No kids. Just me and the Lady. My flight schedule is flexible.

The shortest unit of time in a man's life?   9 months. <drum roll>

Really, the stock answer to the question of which Mooney to seek is "What is your mission?"   Short body (C & E) are really great two person airplanes, with enough back seat room for little people.  If your mission includes hauling non-small people in the back seat, then the F it is.

The O-360 in the C does can produce carb ice any time the dew point is greater than freezing and the carb temperature is below 32.  I use carb heat as a precaution flying through clouds or precipitation when the carb temperature as indicated on the engine monitor says I should.  One time I forgot, and sure enough, carb ice developed.  Other than that I think one could safely say that this engine is one of the most robust and reliable aircraft engines ever produced.

The IO-360 gets you 20 more horses, but at the cost of a fuel injection servo and injectors, with additional maintenance and fault pathways.

The long body F comes with a slight speed penalty all things being equal.

Good luck.  The C is perfect for me and my co-pilot, and an occasional passenger.

[Bob_Belville]

In defense of the M20E vs the relatively ubiquitous C... (I'm possibly prejudiced by 20 years of E ownership and 3000 hours in that specific model.)

• As mentioned above, the IO360 is normally well balanced as to gami spread and will run LOP without GAMI injectors. 
• With Griggs bladders (O&N) fuel can be 64 gallons in an E and endurance of over 6 hours with ifr reserves. (8 gph, 145 ktas.) 
• 200 hp vs. 180 hp is not nothing. Extra power means, shorter takeoff, better climb, faster cruise speed, and higher ceiling vs. M20C.
• The IO360 installation in an E will have the engine running cooler than the O360 in a C. 

If the acquisition premium, everything else being equal, is upwards of 10 AMUs for an E, and the mission is traveling (as compared to training and local flying) the E is the better choice. And, unlike $10k spent on typical airframe and panel improvements, the extra initial cost should be recouped when the plane is sold. 

 

[ArtVandelay]

Side note, you said budget is $50K, if you had an unexpected issue that requires ~$10K to fix, do you have it?  If not, I would not spend $50K buying the plane, and would keep some in reserve.

[gsxrpilot]

46 minutes ago, Bob_Belville said:

In defense of the M20E vs the relatively ubiquitous C... (I'm possibly prejudiced by 20 years of E ownership and 3000 hours in that specific model.)

• As mentioned above, the IO360 is normally well balanced as to gami spread and will run LOP without GAMI injectors. 
• With Griggs bladders (O&N) fuel can be 64 gallons in an E and endurance of over 6 hours with ifr reserves. (8 gph, 145 ktas.) 
• 200 hp vs. 180 hp is not nothing. Extra power means, shorter takeoff, better climb, faster cruise speed, and higher ceiling vs. M20C.
• The IO360 installation in an E will have the engine running cooler than the O360 in a C. 

If the acquisition premium, everything else being equal, is upwards of 10 AMUs for an E, and the mission is traveling (as compared to training and local flying) the E is the better choice. And, unlike $10k spent on typical airframe and panel improvements, the extra initial cost should be recouped when the plane is sold. 

I owned one of the nicest C's anywhere and thoroughly loved flying it. But every time I flew it, I wished it was an E. The E has all the advantages of the C and is still just a bit better. 

That's precisely why, when I was shopping for a K, I settled on a 252 instead of a 231. I didn't want to go fly every day wishing it was a 252.

[Raptor05121]

Absolutely nothing wrong with a C model. 20hp would be nice to have but at the same time, I'm not worrying about the all-too-common split cases, the more expensive angle-valve TOH cost, injector spiders, etc, etc. And for 2 people, any Mooney will be light and will climb well better than 500fpm.

Speed wise, its a wash. You're talking an E model touching down with a C turning downwind after 150 miles depending on how many turns the red knob gets. As long as you're doing 45 knots faster than a 172, I think we're all happy.

I'd take that 50k and find the nicest panel-equipped C model I could find. $10k difference will buy a year and a half's worth of fuel for 20hp and more expensive MX