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Seeing the posts on Facebook about the CAFE M20E and its cool cowl got me thinking.
 
My cowls on my 201 definitely could use some work, both in fiberglass and paint. I was looking at a friend’s RV4 (or 6?) that he built, and his engine cowls split top to bottom below the inlet, but there were no cam locks holding the top and bottom together. Instead there was an internal hinge with a piece of wire that he pulled out from the rear.
 
It seems the main wear points on mine would be eliminated with such a mod.
 
Could this be done on a 201 cowl? Would the fastening system require an STC to be created? Has anyone tried this? I’m guessing Sabermech might have some insight given his cowl work...
 
Thanks!
 
 
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Lancair used a similar design.

 

You would likely need an STC to change the existing cowl design. A 1-off STC used to be easier to get approved versus one that would be put into production, but I don't know if that is still the case.

 

Also, that CAFE super-E used a prop extension to get a more streamlined/aero cowl profile, so that starts you down a rabbit hole of consequences...

 

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To enrich the thought process... for 201 upgrades...

1) The 201 was the first aerodynamically improved and fiberglass cowl that Mooney produced...

2) The cowl was so good, any extras are sought after by people with M20Fs....

3) The cowls have been in circulation for so long, they have a tendency to wear in... 40+ years and their called modern Mooneys... :)

4) There is a great MSer thread that outlined what it takes to get a worn cowl up to like/better than new condition... that included strengthening, hardware resetting, surface refinishing, and final painting... Find Byron...

5) Another 201 That is slowly converting from aged beauty to like new, just got a different cowl... see 201er’s yellow beak on his red bird...  the beak was sourced through grimmy, the reaper... if the rumors hold water...

6) Lopresti makes an awesome updated cowl for the 201... if the name sounds familiar... Roy was the engineer at Mooney that created the 201’s cowl originally... Have your 401k readied to make payments... it may take reaching retirement age earlier than planned... it will be so worth it...  :)

7) Now... looking forwards... hmmmmmmm.... reworking an old cowl, with modern looks, updated to the newest cooling arrangements, proven to work on M20Es and Fs, And comes with STC writing skills... and getting the latest air intake... that would have to take some asking... if I were going to ask somebody... I would start with @Sabremech 

8) For really out of the box thinking... a cowl for an Ovation made out of carbon fiber can really save a ton of weight... well not really... a lot of weight... tens of pounds of weight... Check with Kevin K... at Mooney.   Mooney may be adding various projects not related to new plane production... picture carbon fiber based parts to enhance the speed and looks of your favorite Mooney.... expect the 401K will need to be tapped twice.... I made this stuff up, off the top of my head... i did talk with Kevin at KOSH, and I lifted the O cowling off the ground... that part was true... proof that the product could work... and Mooney could make it... if they wanted too...  :)

 

Blaine, Is that what you had in mind?

PP thoughts only, not a plane parts sales guy... yet.

Best regards,

-a-

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A one off 337 would be the way to go for any significant cowl improvements.  Look at the list of what counts as a major modification though - changing the hinge design with another easterner type without appreciably affecting XYZ and Q seems like the definition of a minor mod.  

There are a number for homebuilder YouTube videos out there or just this type of hinge system. It’s simple and works.  

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A one off 337 would be the way to go for any significant cowl improvements.  Look at the list of what counts as a major modification though - changing the hinge design with another easterner type without appreciably affecting XYZ and Q seems like the definition of a minor mod.  
There are a number for homebuilder YouTube videos out there or just this type of hinge system. It’s simple and works.  


Unfortunately up here in Canada, there is no ability to go one off with a 337.


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To enrich the thought process... for 201 upgrades...
1) The 201 was the first aerodynamically improved and fiberglass cowl that Mooney produced...
2) The cowl was so good, any extras are sought after by people with M20Fs....
3) The cowls have been in circulation for so long, they have a tendency to wear in... 40+ years and their called modern Mooneys... 
4) There is a great MSer thread that outlined what it takes to get a worn cowl up to like/better than new condition... that included strengthening, hardware resetting, surface refinishing, and final painting... Find Byron...
5) Another 201 That is slowly converting from aged beauty to like new, just got a different cowl... see 201er’s yellow beak on his red bird...  the beak was sourced through grimmy, the reaper... if the rumors hold water...
6) Lopresti makes an awesome updated cowl for the 201... if the name sounds familiar... Roy was the engineer at Mooney that created the 201’s cowl originally... Have your 401k readied to make payments... it may take reaching retirement age earlier than planned... it will be so worth it...  
7) Now... looking forwards... hmmmmmmm.... reworking an old cowl, with modern looks, updated to the newest cooling arrangements, proven to work on M20Es and Fs, And comes with STC writing skills... and getting the latest air intake... that would have to take some asking... if I were going to ask somebody... I would start with [mention=7497]Sabremech[/mention] 
8) For really out of the box thinking... a cowl for an Ovation made out of carbon fiber can really save a ton of weight... well not really... a lot of weight... tens of pounds of weight... Check with Kevin K... at Mooney.   Mooney may be adding various projects not related to new plane production... picture carbon fiber based parts to enhance the speed and looks of your favorite Mooney.... expect the 401K will need to be tapped twice.... I made this stuff up, off the top of my head... i did talk with Kevin at KOSH, and I lifted the O cowling off the ground... that part was true... proof that the product could work... and Mooney could make it... if they wanted too...  
 
Blaine, Is that what you had in mind?
PP thoughts only, not a plane parts sales guy... yet.
Best regards,
-a-


Very good thoughts on it. Carbon Fiber could be the way to go; my stepfather just got new CF cowls for his C185... I think that was a $20k price tag.

I’d like to get rid of as many fasteners as I can... perhaps I need to do a one of STC. You know, because I’m crazy like that


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I believe a standard J cowl is right around 20 lbs and it would be reasonable to expect it go down to ~12-13 if re-made intelligently in carbon fiber. I don't know how much the LoPresti cowl weighs, but I'm curious. Getting weight off the nose is a very good thing in most Mooneys too.

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On 8/7/2019 at 4:58 PM, blaine beaven said:

Seeing the posts on Facebook about the CAFE M20E and its cool cowl got me thinking.
 
My cowls on my 201 definitely could use some work, both in fiberglass and paint. I was looking at a friend’s RV4 (or 6?) that he built, and his engine cowls split top to bottom below the inlet, but there were no cam locks holding the top and bottom together. Instead there was an internal hinge with a piece of wire that he pulled out from the rear.
 
It seems the main wear points on mine would be eliminated with such a mod.
 
Could this be done on a 201 cowl? Would the fastening system require an STC to be created? Has anyone tried this? I’m guessing Sabermech might have some insight given his cowl work...
 
Thanks!
 
 
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I would look for the thread where Byron, @jetdriven rebuild his J model cowl.  This is work that your AME can supervise and sign off for you.  Doing the hinge style like an RV would require a DER to sign it off and they aren’t as bulletproof as you’d thing.  My RV4 and other RV’s that I’ve worked on have had hinge eyes break off requiring repair.

Clarence

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I would look for the thread where Byron, [mention=7887]jetdriven[/mention] rebuild his J model cowl.  This is work that your AME can supervise and sign off for you.  Doing the hinge style like an RV would require a DER to sign it off and they aren’t as bulletproof as you’d thing.  My RV4 and other RV’s that I’ve worked on have had hinge eyes break off requiring repair.
Clarence


Clarence,

You’ve likely seen more cowl styles on different planes than I have - what’s your take on the best set-up for longevity?


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8 hours ago, blaine beaven said:

I would look for the thread where Byron, [mention=7887]jetdriven[/mention] rebuild his J model cowl.  This is work that your AME can supervise and sign off for you.  Doing the hinge style like an RV would require a DER to sign it off and they aren’t as bulletproof as you’d thing.  My RV4 and other RV’s that I’ve worked on have had hinge eyes break off requiring repair.
Clarence


Clarence,

You’ve likely seen more cowl styles on different planes than I have - what’s your take on the best set-up for longevity?


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Blaine,

Each one is different, I’ve done repairs to worn Camloc holes, replaced the cowl flap supports etc.  The repair which Byron did on his cowl corrected everything.  If you have a local EAA chapter look for someone who has built a composite airplane and ask for some advise/ help.

Alternatively you could wait on the cowl David @Sabremech is working on.

Clarence

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@Sabremech David how’d you do your V1/2 cowls? DER or did you have another source for approved data? 

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7 minutes ago, bradp said:

@Sabremech David how’d you do your V1/2 cowls? DER or did you have another source for approved data? 

Hi Brad, version 1 cowls were all done via 337 field approvals. Version 2 will be STC’d with some of the first installations being done via 337 field approvals to validate the STC for pre-J models. 

The version 2 cowl will also be an FAA/PMA replacement part for the J model and just require a log book entry. 

Thanks,

David

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Great documentation details, David!

Thanks for sharing the inside edge of what it takes...

Best regards,

-a-

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11 hours ago, Sabremech said:

Hi Brad, version 1 cowls were all done via 337 field approvals. Version 2 will be STC’d with some of the first installations being done via 337 field approvals to validate the STC for pre-J models. 

The version 2 cowl will also be an FAA/PMA replacement part for the J model and just require a log book entry. 

Thanks,

David

David that’s great news. Glad to see the project progressing.  

What kind of data did you need to provide to support the first major/337?  If, say like the OP, he wants to build or modify a cowl with an extra access door and a piano hinge securement device - does he need to go DER? Is that what you needed to do for 337 data for Bobs etc...? 

Creating and validating your STC data with initial 337s seems like a unique and smart idea to keep the process from stalling.  

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1 hour ago, bradp said:

David that’s great news. Glad to see the project progressing.  

What kind of data did you need to provide to support the first major/337?  If, say like the OP, he wants to build or modify a cowl with an extra access door and a piano hinge securement device - does he need to go DER? Is that what you needed to do for 337 data for Bobs etc...? 

Creating and validating your STC data with initial 337s seems like a unique and smart idea to keep the process from stalling.  

I went straight to the FAA and submitted a 337 to ACO for pre-approval for each cowling modification I completed. ACO determined from my drawings and detail that I wasn’t changing anything significant and the parts I used were used on other aircraft. No issues with any of my approvals. 

I did not use a DER as that was going to cost an undetermined amount of money that I didn’t want to spend especially when the FAA said they would work with me. 

You can use a DER to make the modifications you’d like, but I don’t think you would have any issues going through the FAA as the changes you want to make are very minor and on other aircraft. 

Thanks,

David

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