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Dynon STC AML expanded to 592 single models


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Dynon Avionics just announced this morning that their SkyView HDX AML has been expanded to include 592 different single engine airplanes, from a Luscombe to a Cessna 210, including Beechcraft, Mooney, Piper, Cessna, Maule, etc. single engine models. The STC price is a flat $2,000 per airplane. The equipment cost is unchanged from their experimental prices. The auto pilot will be added to more models as they do the engineering for them, but everything except the auto pilot is available now for all of these models. For those going to Oshkosh, stop by the Dynon booth to see, and touch these great systems, or go to www.dynoncertified.com for more details. The basic system starts at $9,630 with the STC plus installation. With installation at our shop (a Dynon authorized installation center), a 7” single system starts at $15,500 with installation or $16,800 for a 10” basic system. These are basically out-the-door prices. You can add engine monitor, ads-b out, ads-b in, Com radio and a second or third screen. An auto pilot can be added as it is developed for your model. Drop me an email at jesse@saintaviation.com for a price sheet. 

 
The STC fee is a one-time charge per airplane for whatever options you decide to install, both now and add-ons down the road. The STC has been issued, and the PMA should come in the next few days. 
 
Another affordable glass panel option is now available for your single engine plane.
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The million dollar question now...what is the autopilot rollout schedule? I doubt many (or any) of us will go down this road until that is known.

As an interim step, though, it might be nice to know if a Dynon system can interface with a legacy autopilot.

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It may slow some people down, but not sure why, unless it won't work with their current autopilot.

With this glass panel you get to ditch the gyros, vacuum system, can also add ADS-B out/in and engine monitoring.  Then it will just be a matter of time for the autopilot to be added.  Same as with other autopilots.

Yes, it might be nice to only have the plane down once for all of it, but this is a big improvement for many older GA planes.

 

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The Mooney is close to the top of the Auto Pilot list, but as we have seen with the TruTrak, it never happens as fast as we would like it to. There is a LOT of engineering that goes into an STC for an Auto Pilot. 

Dynon has talked about working out an interface for legacy auto pilots, but there is no information on if or when that will happen. I wouldn't count on it.

I plan to talk to Dynon at Oshkosh. If they have done any preliminary evaluation of different planes for the auto pilot, there is no reason that the wires for the auto pilot couldn't be routed and tied up for future auto pilot servos. That would save time and money when the time comes to install the auto pilot.

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I too plan to take a hard look are their system next week and go to their forum. I did visit them 2 years ago when it first came out, and they told me then they were 6-8 weeks away from the STC. Not quite.

Hopefully getting over this hurdle will allow them to crank thru autopilot work more efficiently. Unless it can connect to my lowly STEC-30 I won't install it until the A/P is ready to go with it. Hopefully they don't sucker someone into committing without an A/P ready and they end up flying for years without one before it finally happens.

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I'm with @KSMooniac on this. The only thing certain about the release of anything new and STC'd for our Mooneys, or any certificated airplane, it that it will take a lot longer than forecast. I'm of the opinion that the autopilot is the most important piece here. For example, if Dynon had announced the release of a full featured 2 or 3 axis autopilot today, and said stay tuned for a glass panel coming in the future, but for now you can drive the autopilot with your steam gauges/GPS. They'd have sold 100 of them by the end of today. As it is, I'm not interested unless it fully drives my KFC150 today, or until the autopilot is approved/released.

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All this waiting is so frustrating. I'm right on the cusp of an upgrade.  I need a GPS, an engine monitor, and autopilot.  Trying to figure out what direction to go is frustrating.  Sure, I can go buy whatever I want and build an incredible frakenstein panel, but integration becomes a concern.  For example, all the Garmin stuff just works together so well.  The interconnects are pre-determined and they all just simply work together.  I imagine it would be the same with the Dynon.  Sure, they probably have ways to integrate non-oem parts, i.e. a avidyne gps or trutrack autopilot, but who supports the connection?  And do they support all functionality, or just parts?  If just parts, what parts do they support? I would hate to go with the Dynon to find out they won't get their approval for the autopilot or vice versa with Garmin and now I'm looking for another part again. 

Sure would be nice if avionics could get as standardized as home PCs where you just plug it in and it just works.  Plug and Play avionics; that's what I want.  I remember thinking Microsoft was crazy when they first introduced Plug and Play with Windows 95 and now it's how we expect everything electronic to work.

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3 hours ago, bob865 said:

All this waiting is so frustrating. I'm right on the cusp of an upgrade.  I need a GPS, an engine monitor, and autopilot.  Trying to figure out what direction to go is frustrating.  Sure, I can go buy whatever I want and build an incredible frakenstein panel, but integration becomes a concern.  For example, all the Garmin stuff just works together so well.  The interconnects are pre-determined and they all just simply work together.  I imagine it would be the same with the Dynon.  Sure, they probably have ways to integrate non-oem parts, i.e. a avidyne gps or trutrack autopilot, but who supports the connection?  And do they support all functionality, or just parts?  If just parts, what parts do they support? I would hate to go with the Dynon to find out they won't get their approval for the autopilot or vice versa with Garmin and now I'm looking for another part again. 

Sure would be nice if avionics could get as standardized as home PCs where you just plug it in and it just works.  Plug and Play avionics; that's what I want.  I remember thinking Microsoft was crazy when they first introduced Plug and Play with Windows 95 and now it's how we expect everything electronic to work.

I understand the frustration, Bob. The nice thing is that you are frustrated about the best way to upgrade your panel to synthetic vision, moving map, weather, traffic, engine monitor and auto pilot, and not on whether it is worth putting in an HSI or a new CDI. If you continue to wait a little bit, then you could possibly get everything at once. If you trust the history of a company of making good on their promises (yet possibly not quite hitting the estimated release date), then you can start to build a system with plans to add the rest later. This is basically the Auto Pilot at this point. The TruTrak will get some data from the Dynon, but it isn't available quite yet for your Mooney. It will probably be the next one released, however. 

2 minutes ago, DustinNwind said:

What's the difference between HDX and G3X? 

The are a lot of differences and very few differences, depending on how you look at it. They both offer 10" and 7" displays, while Garmin's 7" is portrait and Dynon's is landscape. As for features, they both offer ADS-B in and out, both offer engine monitor, both offer auto pilot on some but not all airplane models, both have synthetic vision and moving map. They are both excellent systems. I have yet to hear of someone installing either and not being happy with it. The Garmin is a little bit more expensive with some options, and similar in price with other options. Their wiring philosophy is substantially different, but both work well and are robust and have certain redundancies built into the wiring architecture. In short, the G3X is made by Garmin and the HDX is made by Dynon. The fact that there are 2 systems like these available for our certified singles is a win for airplane owners.

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4 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

I'm with @KSMooniac on this. The only thing certain about the release of anything new and STC'd for our Mooneys, or any certificated airplane, it that it will take a lot longer than forecast. I'm of the opinion that the autopilot is the most important piece here. For example, if Dynon had announced the release of a full featured 2 or 3 axis autopilot today, and said stay tuned for a glass panel coming in the future, but for now you can drive the autopilot with your steam gauges/GPS. They'd have sold 100 of them by the end of today. As it is, I'm not interested unless it fully drives my KFC150 today, or until the autopilot is approved/released.

I agree - the possibility of getting cornered into buying a partial solution for 20k hoping for the rest later that never comes - is too great.

If either Garmin, or Dynon had certified their panels with the possibility to allow it to interact with our legacy autopilots, and then the possibility to upgrade to their autopilots later, that would have been a real winner since then it allows to upgrade incrementally.  40-50k cost for an all in complete panel plus autopilot is a reasonable cost perhaps for all that, but still a lot of money and they would be even more successful if they marketed to real people with real people budget considerations.

I think upgrading the Dynon panel as it is now means flying without any autopilot at all for several years until you can get their autopilot.

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1 hour ago, aviatoreb said:

40-50k cost for an all in complete panel plus autopilot is a reasonable cost perhaps for all that, but still a lot of money and they would be even more successful if they marketed to real people with real people budget considerations.

I think upgrading the Dynon panel as it is now means flying without any autopilot at all for several years until you can get their autopilot.

$40 to $50k???  What happened to the advertised $25k all-in installed price we all heard 2 years ago?

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7 minutes ago, NotarPilot said:

$40 to $50k???  What happened to the advertised $25k all-in installed price we all heard 2 years ago?

I dunno.

But here is Dynon's example pricing installed for a complete system in a Bonanza, which I think is likely comparable, if not even a bit cheaper than a Mooney since I bit the labor in a mooney will be a tad bit harder due to tighter spaces.

https://www.dynoncertified.com/pdfs/Bonanza-sheet.pdf

Bottom line - $45k installed for an all bells and whistles system installed complete. Skip some options - yes a bit less.  It includes $15k labor that seems actually reasonable considering they are talking autopilot also - and from what I have seen on the GFC500 discussion - that alone is more so I am wondering if the $45k they quote is actually doable even.

And I think the same from Garmin Gfc500+g3x complete will be a bit more. And not including all bells and whistles like ADSB, radio, etc.

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It all depends on what options you want. A full-in price for a single 10" system in a 172 with Engine, ADS-B and auto pilot is $27,838. The $40-50,000 number is with new IFD navigator, Audio Panel, etc. The price will be similar for the Mooney as it is for the 172 once the Auto pilot is available. Without the auto pilot it's $23,678.When you add a Navigator and harnesses and installation, you can add $12-15,000 or more to the price. Add an Audio Panel and backup COM or Dynon COM and you add another $4,000 or more with harnesses and installation. Those that already have adequate radio stacks are in the 20's. Those that already have an engine monitor and ADS-B, they'll be under right around or under $20,000. You can get the basic 7" system, installed, for under $16,000, 10" for under $17,000.

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Just now, Jesse Saint said:

It all depends on what options you want. A full-in price for a single 10" system in a 172 with Engine, ADS-B and auto pilot is $27,838. The $40-50,000 number is with new IFD navigator, Audio Panel, etc. The price will be similar for the Mooney as it is for the 172 once the Auto pilot is available. Without the auto pilot it's $23,678.When you add a Navigator and harnesses and installation, you can add $12-15,000 or more to the price. Add an Audio Panel and backup COM or Dynon COM and you add another $4,000 or more with harnesses and installation. Those that already have adequate radio stacks are in the 20's. Those that already have an engine monitor and ADS-B, they'll be under right around or under $20,000.

How much you figure for just the panel, and the autopilot, assuming one already has adsb, and a radio they like and a primary gps and engine monitor, to keep installed?  Installed cost - incl remove the old stuff.

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1 minute ago, Jesse Saint said:

$16,790 for the basic system. $4,160 for a 2-servo auto pilot. You can trim a little off of this if you don't want a Knob Panel or new Panel Overlay. $1,200 to add ADS-B In.

How much you figure for the install on that, incl removing the old autopilot? (I have a King KFC200).  Actually I see generally the price list but I am not fully understanding how to interpret the install costs.  E.g. I would want electric trim, 3-servo, and plus "basic system," which includes ?  10'' display plus required backup? Or could I keep my old-style (but still recently overhauled) electric gyro life-saver instead - if that is allowed as backup.

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6 minutes ago, ArtVandelay said:

The G3x 7” is $8000 for hardware, not including G5 I think with is required, so hardware prices are pretty close, comes down to labor costs. You can’t mix and match, so if already have a G5 you probably stick with Garmin .


Tom

I think Garmin ends up more expensive in the end.  But not by a lot as install prices are dominating.

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Dynon has previously announced the willingness to work with independent installers and not funnel everything into a dealer/shop/bottleneck. That could be a huge differentiator and advantage for potential customers like myself that prefer DIY & owner-assist when possible. That could reduce installation costs tremendously if you're willing to do some easy work...such as removing all that old stuff!

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk

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44 minutes ago, ArtVandelay said:

The G3x 7” is $8000 for hardware, not including G5 I think with is required, so hardware prices are pretty close, comes down to labor costs. You can’t mix and match, so if already have a G5 you probably stick with Garmin .


Tom

Skyview 7” is $7,400 including the D10A for equipment only, including ADAHRS, magnetometer, backup battery and wiring harness. 

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I was considering the Dynon in my Bonanza , I spoke to Dynon last year at Sun n Fun , and they said as an IA that they would Give me a 10% discount on the hardware , When I called them last month , the 10% was not happening , So I am probably going with the Garmin setup....  The Garmin is about 20% more , But the autopilot is supposed to be a lot better ,  and the Garmin will add more value to the aircraft...  If you consider the Dynon install , you should definitely check out Jesse's shop down in Fla. ,  I was really impressed when I stopped in last year , and as busy as Jesse is , he still took time to spend with me , and we did some business...  Keep in mind that Jesse has been in the experimental business for quite some time , and is more than familiar with the Dynon products...  There is always something "interesting" happening down there ...

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