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G5 HSI installation with GNX375


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Hi All, Kyle here.

Long time reader but first time posting.

I have been going back and forth the last month with my recent upgrades. I had a Garmin G5 HSI put in with my Garmin SL30. Love the G5!

The issue I'm having now is the RS-232.

I have a shop installing the Garmin GNX375 next week. However they tell me the RS232 from my SL30 will have to be removed from the G5 so the GNX375 can couple to it. This will leave my SL30 Nav worthless unless I purchase a stand alone indicator.

Not that I don't trust the shop (I kind of don't) but to me there as to be work around by Garmin.

Any tips or ideas would be greatly appreciative.

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Welcome aboard, Kyle.

Great question.

There are always going to be limitations... especially when it comes to number of I/Os available...

Standby to see if anyone has an answer...

 

My ship uses a complex switch to control two different NAV resources feeding the HSI...

It adds some complexity to the operation to make sure you have tuned the right box and connected it to the HSI...

It can easily lead to a nav mistake in low IMC when changing from GPS enroute to the ILS...

 

keep searching for an answer that meets your needs...

Best regards,

-a-

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G5 in certified applications can only connect to one nav unit. It is a limitation of the STC from what I remember with my installation. I believe the experimental installations can connect to two though. Maybe with enough feedback Garmin would change this.

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Welcome aboard, Kyle.
Great question.
There are always going to be limitations... especially when it comes to number of I/Os available...
Standby to see if anyone has an answer...
 
My ship uses a complex switch to control two different NAV resources feeding the HSI...
It adds some complexity to the operation to make sure you have tuned the right box and connected it to the HSI...
It can easily lead to a nav mistake in low IMC when changing from GPS enroute to the ILS...
 
keep searching for an answer that meets your needs...
Best regards,
-a-

My plane has a similar switch. It does take a little bit of getting used to press the button to switch NAV sources but it becomes second nature after a while. That being said in a stressful situation I can easily see this being forgotten introducing some confusion. Been there, but quickly realized the problem.


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Thanks for all the replies.

What kind of switch do you guys use? I would think the shop would be willing to interface this for me.

I have the GAD29B, and wonder why Garmin doesn't have the GNX375 point to that to drive/interface with the G5 HSI.

I also have an area 660 I wanted to couple to my SL30 but my locale A&P AI said it would cause the same issue. Would need to disconnect the SL30 from the G5 just so I could run the SL30 from the touch screen of the 660.

This is a little frustrating.

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Expect that your avionics guy may be challenged by the desire to mix the portable Aera, with the panel mount G5.

It won’t be very challenging for him to find a proper switch to handle the various input devices... you aren’t the only pilot needing s like a 16pole, single throw switch... and it may be activated by a relay..?

Instrument installers have interesting rules they need to be aware of and follow sometimes...  I have a blue light that has to be there by regulation.  The blue light is on, when the switch is on for GPS being fed to the HSI... when the light is out... either the VOR/ILS is active or the blue light is dead.... :)

It was a goofy FAA rule of the day, that didn’t make a lot of sense, and wasn’t written very well as if GPS was a special case compared to any other nav device...

For your own use, make sure you have a way to know what is providing guidance to the display...  flying in IMC and accidentally not knowing what is supplying data to the  display is bad...

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic or CFII...

Best regards,

-a-

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The STC only allow some one Nav source to be connected to the G5. The G5 only has 1 serial port, and the STC required both the ARINC429 connection (via the GAD29) and the RS232 MapMX connection (directly to the G5). If you want the GNX375 connected to the G5 HSI, your SL30 becomes a com with a Nav and built-in CDI, or it requires a separate Nav display (CDI/Glideslope). 

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On 6/4/2019 at 6:39 PM, Jesse Saint said:

The STC only allow some one Nav source to be connected to the G5. The G5 only has 1 serial port, and the STC required both the ARINC429 connection (via the GAD29) and the RS232 MapMX connection (directly to the G5). If you want the GNX375 connected to the G5 HSI, your SL30 becomes a com with a Nav and built-in CDI, or it requires a separate Nav display (CDI/Glideslope). 

Thanks Jesse,

I spoke with Garmin and they said the same thing. 

I'm a bit confused as the fellow at Garmin said the newer GNC255 has both ports out, the RS232 and the ARINC429 which would allow the G5 to play fair with both. I'm not sure I understand how that would work exactly but I'm leading toward having the GNX375 coupled to the G5 and leave the SL30 by its self.

The SL30 does have it's own navigation information on the unit display so a separate Nav display I feel is not worth the money.

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With the new G5 and G3X installations we might finally see prices come down on the GI-106 indicators...they have really held their value.

If it were me, I'd want a separate, full-time CDI for the SL30, especially as an ILS backup.

Garmin has all of their installation manuals available so you can read the details and limitations. They also have great participation on Beechtalk with lots of helpful diagrams of various panel goodies.

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk

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2 hours ago, KyleG said:

Thanks Jesse,

I spoke with Garmin and they said the same thing. 

I'm a bit confused as the fellow at Garmin said the newer GNC255 has both ports out, the RS232 and the ARINC429 which would allow the G5 to play fair with both. I'm not sure I understand how that would work exactly but I'm leading toward having the GNX375 coupled to the G5 and leave the SL30 by its self.

The SL30 does have it's own navigation information on the unit display so a separate Nav display I feel is not worth the money.

An IFR GPS with ARINC429 out also needs to send RS232 to the G5. I suppose it might be possible to have the Sl30 send RS232 and the GNC255 send ARINC429, but the STC doesn't allow that.

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Huh.  Similar issue here.  I am having a GNX-375 installed.  I have a GX-60 and an SL-30 that are both connected to an indicator through a push button that selects which one displays.  I was hoping/presuming to use the same indicator for all three.  The shop told me the 375 will not connect to the present indicator, so I could either install another indicator for $2900, or get a G5 for $3200.  Easy choice, even if hard to swallow.

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8 hours ago, Jesse Saint said:

An IFR GPS with ARINC429 out also needs to send RS232 to the G5. I suppose it might be possible to have the Sl30 send RS232 and the GNC255 send ARINC429, but the STC doesn't allow that.

I forgot about the STC. I was thinking maybe Garmin or some other manufacturing would have a RS232 to ARINC429 Converter that would be able to send the secondary data to the instrument. 

I'm still trying to learning all these bells and whistle and thought the data selected could be made right on the G5. However over the last few days I see the data needs to be driven directly from the unit and not the G5, hence the STC makes perfect sense for not allowing more than 1 coupled navigator.

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On 5/28/2019 at 10:56 PM, KyleG said:

Thanks for all the replies.

What kind of switch do you guys use? I would think the shop would be willing to interface this for me.

I have the GAD29B, and wonder why Garmin doesn't have the GNX375 point to that to drive/interface with the G5 HSI.

I also have an area 660 I wanted to couple to my SL30 but my locale A&P AI said it would cause the same issue. Would need to disconnect the SL30 from the G5 just so I could run the SL30 from the touch screen of the 660.

This is a little frustrating.

It sounds like you don’t have a choice but to disconnect the SL30 from your G5 in order to allow the gnx375 to drive it. You also mentioned hooking up an aera660. What are you plans for this?

The aera660 has two rs232 ports,  I believe you can have the gnx375 drive one of the rs232 ports (in/output) with mapmx data to get flight plan/magenta lines directly on your aera660 without having to load them manually (like you would via Bluetooth). The input of the second rs232 port could be driven by the gnx375 with adsb data (weather/traffic) and the output of this second rs232 port could be going to your sl30 with nmea data in order to select/load frequencies from your aera660 to the standby on your sl30. 

That is my understanding of how the aera660 could be interfaced from reading the manual so I’m really interested in knowing how you will actually hook yours up.

Oscar

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On 6/11/2019 at 12:07 AM, OR75 said:

Why don’t you connect the SL30 to a simple King indicator ? 

I had the installer leave the SL30 on its own. It gives me a to/from reading with the bearing right on the unit which is pretty nice. I still have a King KX155 with a KI-209 glide slope for Radio #2.

The installer called me today and said he wired the GNX 375 direct to the G5 via the rs232 and now he just needs to do the ARINC 429 to the Gad29B. I asked him why the GNX needs to use ARINC?

He just said thats' what the manual displays. 

I'm pretty frustrated with this process. I like to understand my equipment in the plane and how it's interfaced and working. Yet I feel the industry of Certified G.A. has a kiss and don't tell attitude. 

Guess I'll have a learning curve here next week.

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On 6/10/2019 at 9:01 PM, Oscar M20E said:

It sounds like you don’t have a choice but to disconnect the SL30 from your G5 in order to allow the gnx375 to drive it. You also mentioned hooking up an aera660. What are you plans for this?

The aera660 has two rs232 ports,  I believe you can have the gnx375 drive one of the rs232 ports (in/output) with mapmx data to get flight plan/magenta lines directly on your aera660 without having to load them manually (like you would via Bluetooth). The input of the second rs232 port could be driven by the gnx375 with adsb data (weather/traffic) and the output of this second rs232 port could be going to your sl30 with nmea data in order to select/load frequencies from your aera660 to the standby on your sl30. 

That is my understanding of how the aera660 could be interfaced from reading the manual so I’m really interested in knowing how you will actually hook yours up.

Oscar

Thanks Oscar.

You are correct that was my original goal.

My hopes were to have the Area 660 interface with the SL30 and the G5 HSI and then have the GNX375 interface this the G5 HSI as well as the 660.

It seems I'm getting conflicting information from my Installer on what I can and cannot do. I asked him how long they have been doing installs and he said for almost 2 years now. I also asked what it took to be a Garmin partner. He said a one week course down in Kansas and some money and he was good to go. Been doing this for 2 years now!

He is not a pilot so I understand why the things I ask don't make sense to him yet. My current A&P AI friend that helped with the G5 install seems to know more and has also fixed other issues from 3 avionic shops in the midwest. I guess no one is perfect. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 6/10/2019 at 9:01 PM, Oscar M20E said:

It sounds like you don’t have a choice but to disconnect the SL30 from your G5 in order to allow the gnx375 to drive it. You also mentioned hooking up an aera660. What are you plans for this?

The aera660 has two rs232 ports,  I believe you can have the gnx375 drive one of the rs232 ports (in/output) with mapmx data to get flight plan/magenta lines directly on your aera660 without having to load them manually (like you would via Bluetooth). The input of the second rs232 port could be driven by the gnx375 with adsb data (weather/traffic) and the output of this second rs232 port could be going to your sl30 with nmea data in order to select/load frequencies from your aera660 to the standby on your sl30. 

That is my understanding of how the aera660 could be interfaced from reading the manual so I’m really interested in knowing how you will actually hook yours up.

Oscar

Thanks Oscar!

After 2 weeks and 10 hours of flying i'm re-visiting your post. 

I have been flying with Music on the GMA345 from my phone via bluetooth which has been great. The down side is in order to get AHRS, Traffic, weather to my 660 I need Blue tooth from the GNX375 which I cannot get because I'm trying to bluetooth the 660 to the GMA345 for the audible alerts.

I have found out in the last few weeks the GNX375 does not give audible alerts. I find it crazy that the aera 660 has more functions than the GNX375. Although the GNX does give display alerts.

The other side of the coin is I like to bluetooth data to my phone with garmin pilot which gives me full flight data logging with attitude and altitude via the GNX375.

Somewhere along the way I need to pick which is the most important. I'm leaning on the GMA345 to my phone for music and phone calls and then having everything else hard wired like you say.

The other issue I have is in the Aera 660 manual, the barewire connector displays a left audio, right audio and common audio. on the GMA345 there is a Music Left/right pins but this would mean overriding my Bluetooth music/phone selection, picking Music 1 or Music 2 on the select button on the GMA345. I'm think maybe I have to take the common Audio and pin it to AUX1 HI pin or wire it to an Alert pin. The only down side to the alert pin is I cannot select it on or off on the audio panel. 

I left and email with Garmin to see if the unit GNX 375 can output frequency data to my SL30. No reply yet, but I would feel more comfortable with the information coming from my certified product other than the portable 660.

I'll keep you posted

Kyle

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Here is want I received back today

"

Thank you for contacting Garmin Aviation Support.

In regards to any interaction between the GNX 375 and the SL 30 per the installation guide there is no interaction between the two units.

Kind Regards,"

 

Looks like I will be running a RS232 out from the area 660 to the SL30 then. Shoot!

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Hi Kyle,

Thanks for the update. I also saw your video on YouTube, very cool!

With all the hurdles Garmin keeps putting on their equipment I’m really second guessing the idea of getting a GNX375+G5-hsi. Pretty absurd that you can’t have the gnx and the sl30 both drive the g5 when their original release (experimental) supports this. Not being able to load frequencies from the gnx375 to the sl30 when the aera660 can do it is just the cherry on top...

As far as your audio situation, you could just have the audio from the aera660 go directly to your headset via Bluetooth, I doubt your passengers want to hear “Terrain! Terrain!” anyways. Now that you have Bluetooth on your panel nothing is connected to your headset Bluetooth right?

Alternatively, since your sl30 has built-in vor Morse code identification and without a cdi (slaved to it) you’re not using it for primary navigation, then you don’t really need to listen to its nav audio so your nav1 input in your gma345 could be driven by your aera660 audio. If you want to listen to an FSS you got your kx155 (but who talks to them anyway if you got adsb). This way your aera660 alerts would override the Bluetooth music instead of having to pick one over the other and they could be easily disabled with the push of a button on your gma345. If I remember correctly, @Bob_Belville has his angle of attack audio alerts routed to the (unused) DME audio input of his gma340 so you would need to label/placard it like he has.

Would definitely like to hear how it goes with the rs232 connections between your aera660 and your sl30/gnx375. Keep us posted!

Oscar

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2 hours ago, Oscar M20E said:

Hi Kyle,

. If I remember correctly, @Bob_Belville has his angle of attack audio alerts routed to the (unused) DME audio input of his gma340 so you would need to label/placard it like he has.

 

Oscar

True. This makes it perfect in that SiriusXM is muted with any other input to the audio panel and I can turn off the alert when you're on the ground and the audio panel lights tells you the status off the alert.

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If it makes you feel any better, I was looking into the G3X (instead of G5), and they have a similar restriction on a single nav input if they are interfaced with a nonGarmin autopilot.

 I’m sure there’s a reason for these limitations, but I have no idea what it is.

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