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What to think about on cross country flight


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Hello All,

I am in the process of completing a PPI on a Mooney M20C in Washington state and live in Virginia.  I know I could have likely found something I wanted more local but I was somewhat intrigued by the adventure of flying my new bird back across the country.  I will be receiving transition training when I fly over there to complete the transaction and likely flying back solo.  For those who have completed a trip across the county, especially navigating across the Rockies, what is something you learned that you think would be great to pass along?  Is there anything you wouldn't typically think about on a long cross country that I should consider?  Should I consider getting a portable O2 setup to catch some of the higher altitudes on my eastward movement and while crossing the mountains?  I'm aware that the density altitudes will keep me from staying much about 12,500 but if the winds are favorable and I can get there I'd like to take advantage.  I know that weather is always a factor in a trip like this and I'm not IFR rated, no need to dive into the challenges of that necessarily.  

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Give yourself plenty of time and use it, if necessary. My bIggest concern would be getting sucked into a leg you should not try weather-wise due to a need to be home in a day or two or three.

Always float the caps and plan to land with 2 hours in the tanks until you get an idea on real world fuel burn. Does your new bird have a modern fuel flow computer? That will be valuable, if so equipped, but I'd still verify it religiously by good old math for the first few flights.

I personally wouldn't bother with O2, but that is more a personal preference. I don't usually fly my C at altitudes where it is required. Will you go faster W-E at altitude? Generally, yes. Again though, we're figuring out a new plane, so time in the seat, even at cruise, is not wasted. Just plan the route to not need it and enjoy the ride. It'll be a long one either way.

Finally, where in Virginia? I grew up in the western mountains.

Keep us posted and congratulations on finding the one for you!

Patrick

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I'm figuring, if I'm the luckiest person when I pick it up, that it'll be at least 2 days to get it home. Around 13-14 flying hours total, not counting stops.  It doesn't have anything that reads fuel flow that I'm aware of.  I personally never fly under about 1.5 hours in the tanks even when I know the airplane well.  

I know this is a relative question due to differences in weather/temperature but typically on a warm to hot day what do you use for your cruising altitude?  What is the highest altitude you've had your C model in the summer?  I plan on enjoying the flight back for sure but with the knowledge that hotels are expensive I'll try to keep the number of days low.  

I live in Bedford County and kept my last aircraft at KLYH.  I went to Virginia Tech so I'm somewhat familiar with some of that country!

Thank you!

Matt

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Give yourself four days and be very pleased if you arrive in three. With no IFR capability, and a new to me plane ( I wouldn’t be flying it at night x-country), give yourself as much time as possible. You might even enjoy the trip a whole lot more. Congrats on the new plane!

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I don’t have a C model, but I’m a fan of oxygen and a pulse oximeter. You’re basically giving yourself more options - topping clouds, higher cruising altitude (smoother air and more tailwinds) and depending on your physiology, it may have a huge effect on your fatigue. I personally think pilots underestimate the effect of prolonged mild hypoxia on their performance.  If it’s a new plane, you’re probably going to be a lot “fresher” after cruising for 3 hours on oxygen than without. Most accidents are caused by pilot error, so oxygen is a cheap way to reduce your chance of making errors.

I see hypoxic people almost every day. I have yet to meet someone who performs better with an SpO2 < 88%. 

But that’s just my opinion. I’m sure others will have their own.

 

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Give yourself four days and be very pleased if you arrive in three. With no IFR capability, and a new to me plane ( I wouldn’t be flying it at night x-country), give yourself as much time as possible. You might even enjoy the trip a whole lot more. Congrats on the new plane!


Thank you. I definitely didn’t want to push any night cross country flights until I built up some trust in the plane. Just being new to me you can’t be too safe!


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As others have mentioned, give yourself plenty of time and search for 5000 ft runways.  I bought my Mooney in Virginia and flew it back to Texas (via Ohio to visit family).  As I transitioned out of the 172 world into the Mooney life the “float” was one of the biggest new challenges to overcome. You’ll appreciate the extra asphalt especially at unfamiliar fields.  Cruising is a dream, and getting used to the subtle movements of flying a Mooney over handling a 172 will come quickly at cruise.  Take off’s will be surprisingly quick, and you’ll find you need less pressure to get to 500fpm.  Do you have a Johnson bar or electric gear?  Your CFI will explain and demonstrate the Johnson Bar effect on take off, if you have one.  It will surprise you at first, but after a few turns around the pattern it will be come a natural movement and it will feel normal.  The only other suggestion is plan 3 to 3.5 hour legs.  Sure, the plane can go longer but you’ll find that’s biologically about as long as you’ll want to go (especially if you are drinking lots of coffee).  My solo cross country back in my plane is one of my greatest memories. Keep your camera ready!  Good Luck.
6CFA5D2C-5414-46CA-8484-2EB14B53D073.thumb.jpeg.805ed61d010f196fab68590f2109253c.jpeg

That’s an awesome picture! This one has the Johnson bar. As for the legs, that’s definitely true! I’m planning on having a few empty bottles in the cockpit just in case! I’m really looking forward to it!


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I don’t have a C model, but I’m a fan of oxygen and a pulse oximeter. You’re basically giving yourself more options - topping clouds, higher cruising altitude (smoother air and more tailwinds) and depending on your physiology, it may have a huge effect on your fatigue. I personally think pilots underestimate the effect of prolonged mild hypoxia on their performance.  If it’s a new plane, you’re probably going to be a lot “fresher” after cruising for 3 hours on oxygen than without. Most accidents are caused by pilot error, so oxygen is a cheap way to reduce your chance of making errors.
I see hypoxic people almost every day. I have yet to meet someone who performs better with an SpO2 But that’s just my opinion. I’m sure others will have their own.
 

Do you have any experience with the portable tank/ nasal cannula setup? I would assume there’s a market in which a used tank would be available?


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You won't need oxygen.  Just follow Interstate 90 until you get close to Billings then head any direction you like.  I recommend you stay out of the MOA's along the way.  You can do the entire route at 9500' and most of it at 7500'.  The highest pass is just easy of Butte, MT (KBTM).  There are several airports along the way, most of which have reasonable (at least for the left coast) fuel prices.

The ride will be smoother in the morning than the afternoon.  If the winds are greater than about 20 knots, expect to get bounced around by them too.

Have fun, don't press the weather, enjoy your new airplane.

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30 minutes ago, Huitt3106 said:


Do you have any experience with the portable tank/ nasal cannula setup? I would assume there’s a market in which a used tank would be available?


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I bought an aerox system to use with the mountain high O2D2 but there are many options (craigslist, eBay, Amazon). If you send me a PM I can give you more info.

Others will argue you don’t NEED oxygen and according to the FARs that’s true. I will argue that it is still a good idea. No one can tell you how your body will respond to altitude until you actually try it, so unless this person has gone flying with you at altitude with a pulse ox, they are unqualified to make that assertion.

If you have foreflight, look at how the glide range changes with altitude. Altitude is your friend. The flight you are proposing is high risk (new plane, new avionics for you, low time in type, inhospitable terrain, etc). It sounds like it will be a really fun flight, but I think you’re on the right track to ask questions and do everything you can to make the trip safer. If a good CFI could accompany you that might even make it more fun (and safer) but that is sometimes hard to schedule.

Congratulations on the plane! Make sure to post some pictures when you get home.

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I did a very similar thing not too many months ago, when I picked up our '66 E in Lynchburg VA and flew it to Flagstaff AZ. I really enjoyed the opportunity to cruise and get to know the plane very well. It was a great trip.  

Bottles or Travel Johns are a must!

As a couple people have mentioned, be cautious about getting fatigued or distracted. I had a bonus landing opportunity... extra practice... when I took off without having latched the baggage door and it popped open, forcing me to do a slow lap in the pattern. No harm done, but it added a learning moment in a new plane.

Ross

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5 hours ago, Huitt3106 said:

I will be receiving transition training when I fly over there to complete the transaction and likely flying back solo.  For those who have completed a trip across the county, especially navigating across the Rockies, what is something you learned that you think would be great to pass along?

How much transition training are you planning and what's your aviation background ? Do you have a Mooney specific and knowledgable CFI lined up or just some guy that says he is an expert since he sat in a Mooney once ?

Things I think about in cruise . . . mostly just one. How is this son of a bitch planning to kill me today and where can I put it on the ground quickly if I need to. But that's just me :wacko:

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51 minutes ago, Huitt3106 said:


Do you have any experience with the portable tank/ nasal cannula setup? I would assume there’s a market in which a used tank would be available?


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Portable oxygen tanks are cheap.  A new "D" size cylinder costs about $70-90 at medical supply shops, and should last you at least 25 hours.  I ordered mine with CGA-540 valves and fill them at a local welding supply shop for $24.

There are plenty of prior threads on oxygen setups.

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My C performs quite well at 9500msl; with oxygen, I climbed to 15,000msl one August afternoon, but the controls were mushy. My highest sustained cruise has been 11,000msl with no oxygen, in somewhat less turbulence over the TN/NC border than lower would have been.

Just plan your route carefully. ABQ will be well out of your way, but there's a Northern Route you can follow at decent altitudes (along I-90?).

Just be sure to get some quality Mooney training, and get good & accurate with speed on final (an absolute requirement for good landings).

Have fun, stop every 3 hours or so and take lots of pictures. The Northern Rockies are beautiful . . . . .

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I did a very similar thing not too many months ago, when I picked up our '66 E in Lynchburg VA and flew it to Flagstaff AZ. I really enjoyed the opportunity to cruise and get to know the plane very well. It was a great trip.  
Bottles or Travel Johns are a must!
As a couple people have mentioned, be cautious about getting fatigued or distracted. I had a bonus landing opportunity... extra practice... when I took off without having latched the baggage door and it popped open, forcing me to do a slow lap in the pattern. No harm done, but it added a learning moment in a new plane.
Ross

You’re the one that bought that E! That went on the market about a month or so before I had the funds to buy. I’m based in Lynchburg! I hope it worked out for you!


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I bought an aerox system to use with the mountain high O2D2 but there are many options (craigslist, eBay, Amazon). If you send me a PM I can give you more info.
Others will argue you don’t NEED oxygen and according to the FARs that’s true. I will argue that it is still a good idea. No one can tell you how your body will respond to altitude until you actually try it, so unless this person has gone flying with you at altitude with a pulse ox, they are unqualified to make that assertion.
If you have foreflight, look at how the glide range changes with altitude. Altitude is your friend. The flight you are proposing is high risk (new plane, new avionics for you, low time in type, inhospitable terrain, etc). It sounds like it will be a really fun flight, but I think you’re on the right track to ask questions and do everything you can to make the trip safer. If a good CFI could accompany you that might even make it more fun (and safer) but that is sometimes hard to schedule.
Congratulations on the plane! Make sure to post some pictures when you get home.

Thank you for all of the information! I’m going to continue to look around. When I’d fly my Cherokee on longer cross countries I preferred to get the most altitude that made sense (at least as high as it would reasonably climb with a favorable tail wind). The glide ratio is a big one!


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How much transition training are you planning and what's your aviation background ? Do you have a Mooney specific and knowledgable CFI lined up or just some guy that says he is an expert since he sat in a Mooney once ?
Things I think about in cruise . . . mostly just one. How is this son of a bitch planning to kill me today and where can I put it on the ground quickly if I need to. But that's just me :wacko:

I’m planning on two things:
1. Meet my insurance requirements
2. Feel comfortable in the airplane that I’ll be safe and proficient to fly it home.

I’m still working on nailing down the particular CFI over there.


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20 minutes ago, Huitt3106 said:

I’m planning on two things:
1. Meet my insurance requirements
2. Feel comfortable in the airplane that I’ll be safe and proficient to fly it home.
I’m still working on nailing down the particular CFI over there.

This would be a good start: https://themooneyflyer.com/cfi.html

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Regarding the question whether you should have O2 with you, I would say yes.  Long flights like this, even with the best of avionics and autopilots can be tiring.

The use of O2 above 8,000 or 9,000 feet will help hold off fatigue and will help with night vision.  Go onto e-bay and buy a used 2 person system.  Get it checked and filled.  The cost will be negligible compared to the costs of the rest of the trip, you will feel better after longer legs, and if you want to go higher to avoid weather or rocks you will be able to.

John Breda

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