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Does anyone have this combo in their Mooney? If so, I'd like to know how you like it and what the benefits are.

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As compared to what?

I don't, but am curious as well as a 530W/430W owner that is considering my future panel. Next up for me will be PFD and autopilot with no immediate desire to change GPS boxes. Currently I think dual panel WAAS units are a bit overkill, but my plane came with them. I might consider trading down to a modern NAV/COM for #2 in the future since we have so many great options for backup/additional GPS screens/data with tablets or Garmin portables. I also hate paying for government nav data, especially twice!

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk

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As compared to a single IFD540 which I have now. My #2 Nav/Com is a KX165a and I've been thinking of replacing it at some point. The top of the line/extravagant option is to add the IFD440 as the #2 Nav/Com. But extravagant isn't out of the question for a forever plane.

The reason I'm asking the question is that I understand that when combined, the 540 and 440 will talk to each other, share data, and run almost as a single unit. I'm just tying to get some real life info on what that functionality is.

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My 430W is synced with the 530W and in turn pushes via hardwire the flight plan down to my 496. My normal setup is Nav1 map screen on the 530 (arc view map) and Nav1 on the 430 (data fields only), and 4 additional data fields in the corner of the 496 along with XM WX. This predates my iPad use, and works well giving me all I need and more.

Nowadays, I think the iPad proliferation makes the second GPS panel mount unnecessary, unless you want extreme redundancy to shoot a GPS approach instead of an ILS or VOR. The iPad or other portable can give you all the data you need, especially with connectivity thru Flightstream or Avidyne native wireless tech.

So, is the extra IFD worth the premium over a NAV/COM? I can't say for sure! I waffle back and forth and want the same answer as Paul... Maybe I'll swap both GNS boxes for IFD down the road, or just the 530/540 and sell my 430 and install a NAV/COM.

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Reading the linked guide, the only real advantage I see over my setup is the other IFD becomes a keyboard for entry into a field. I would think the separate BT keyboard would be superior?

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Just now, KSMooniac said:

Reading the linked guide, the only real advantage I see over my setup is the other IFD becomes a keyboard for entry into a field. I would think the separate BT keyboard would be superior?

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk
 

I do like the idea of having more data blocks or even displaying the Flight Plan on the 440 and the map on the 540. I've also thought about having the NRST always up on the 440. 

My KX165 is not going to last forever. It could be replaced with a Garmin 225 or similar, or for another couple of AMU's I could have a fully redundant GPS system. Anyway, Alan posted one for sale here and I'm trying to decide whether to buy it or not. The one rule I have is never pay retail. So buying avionics from Alan complies with that rule. And the IFD boxes just don't come up for sale very often on the used market.

Oh and the full IFD 540/440 stack looks great in the panel ;)

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It's only money! Better jump on it. Do you use their iPad app already? Keyboard?

FWIW, my 530 is in the center stack, and 430 is on the right. I really wish it was in the center too.

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11 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

Does anyone have this combo in their Mooney? If so, I'd like to know how you like it and what the benefits are.

I had it on a 2000 Ovation (I swapped out the 530/430 for a 540/440).

image.thumb.png.d6c22503424aebcd3c6b46b18df82bb9.png

I hardly ever used the 440 since the screen on the 540 is so much larger, but one thing that I found pretty cool was that it could be set up so that the on screen keyboard on the 440 could input info to the 540.

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I am very happy with my IFD540/440 combo and the functions it all provides that has already been covered above.  One of the limitations is you cannot have is one in GPS mode and the other in OBS mode while the units are synced, although you can operate them as separate units if desired but that removes other advantages.  It is all explained in the POH available on the Avidyne website.

If I had the panel real estate, I would have two IFD540's one underneath the other, a combo you cannot beat.

 

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On 1/9/2019 at 10:56 AM, gsxrpilot said:

As compared to a single IFD540 which I have now. My #2 Nav/Com is a KX165a and I've been thinking of replacing it at some point. The top of the line/extravagant option is to add the IFD440 as the #2 Nav/Com. But extravagant isn't out of the question for a forever plane.

The reason I'm asking the question is that I understand that when combined, the 540 and 440 will talk to each other, share data, and run almost as a single unit. I'm just tying to get some real life info on what that functionality is.

I do not have a double IFD setup... I have just a single ifd440.

You get 3 main advantages to this setup over a single unit in my mind... but I’m not sure if they are “worth it.”

1) the ability to bring up a dedicated keyboard on the second unit while still navigating off the primary unit.

2) 1x new comm radios+ 1x new nav radio (I stress new, as in- auto squelch, digital display, easy tuning and.. well... under warranty).

3) a “backup” waas GPS, backup ils, a backup WiFi/BT terminal, in the event the primary fails, you’re still in business.

i don’t think you will get much “extra,” if anything out of the second screen, honestly.  Particularly if you already use the IFD100 app, or use another MFD as your “sandbox.”  The redundancy is nice piece of mind, though, maybe.

 

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If you look closely ,we use the screen on the 440 in calculator (utilities mode)acting as a “how goes it “taking data from fuel flow,shadin ,it’s own gps and clearly showing fuel at destination etc.Its Bluetooth /WiFi is linked to wife’s iPad so she can quickly type in route amendments that get pushed to 540,which WiFi to pilots iPad mini for snd screen.The little Bluetooth keyboard we got in the mail later which we never use 

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Seems the advantages are there.  Question remains whether you need these advantages front and center or the iPad app suffices aside from the nav/com/redundancy points.  Seems like baron pilot over on the YouTube’s does the iPad method.  To each his own. 

 

 

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I have been considering the same thing. I have  GNS430W that I was going to slip into Nav/Com 2 to replace a KX165 and put an IFD540 in position 1. The intent being to swap the Garmin to a 440 in the future.

Like others have noted, the extra screens and current radio is nice, but not sure it is worth the extra costs.

I am getting ADSB in/out installed end of the month and will see how the traffic looks on the small Garmin screen first.

 

Has anybody setup a switch/relay scheme to allow using Nav 1 or Nav 2 to drive the autopilot or primary nav display?

 

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Milo,

Mooneys in the 90s got a switch that would swap Nav1 and a KLN90 (GPS)...to feed the Bk HSI...

Consider this as proof that such a switch exists....  Single throw, multiple poles.

Avionics shops will be familiar...

The switch came with a blue light... blue light on, meant the GPS was the source... blue light off,  meant .... the bulb burned out... :) or Nav1 was the source...

This complex switch was not used after a while because a single nav/com/GPS did all the switching internal to the box...

Hmmmmm.... we might be coming up on the age where having two HSIs in the panel is quite ordinary...:)

Best regards,

-a-

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1 hour ago, carusoam said:

Milo,

Mooneys in the 90s got a switch that would swap Nav1 and a KLN90 (GPS)...to feed the Bk HSI...

Consider this as proof that such a switch exists....  Single throw, multiple poles.

Avionics shops will be familiar...

The switch came with a blue light... blue light on, meant the GPS was the source... blue light off,  meant .... the bulb burned out... :) or Nav1 was the source...

This complex switch was not used after a while because a single nav/com/GPS did all the switching internal to the box...

Hmmmmm.... we might be coming up on the age where having two HSIs in the panel is quite ordinary...:)

Best regards,

-a-

Ha! I HAVE one of those lights and a switch beside it. It just changes the color of the lights so far as I can tell as it does nothing else. Previous owner didn't know what it did either.  Definitely does not change the Nav input to the HSI, nor the autopilot.

I'll have my tech investigate this when the panel is open for the xponder install; now I am curious about it.

 

iain

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8 hours ago, milotron said:

Has anybody setup a switch/relay scheme to allow using Nav 1 or Nav 2 to drive the autopilot or primary nav display?

When I bought my airplane it had a switch to select between LORAN/NAV1/NAV2 to drive the autopilot.  The LORAN had been deleted, but it did work to switch between NAV1/NAV2 to drive the autopilot.    I used it frequently until the autopilot died.

4 hours ago, carusoam said:

Mooneys in the 90s got a switch that would swap Nav1 and a KLN90 (GPS)...to feed the Bk HSI...

Consider this as proof that such a switch exists....  Single throw, multiple poles.

Avionics shops will be familiar...

When I paid up for a large, reputable, more expensive avionics shop to do my panel rebuild, install my IFD540, audio panel, EDM-900, etc., etc., the time came to layout the panel and decide where all the switches went.   They didn't have a spot for the NAV1/NAV2 switch so I suggested one.   They said they were deleting my NAV1/NAV2 switch and refused to replace it.   This led to some significant discussions since they hadn't indicated that they'd be deprecating functionality that my airplane had when it entered their shop, and particularly regarding waiting until my airplane was already disassembled in their hangar to inform me of this.

I told my AI this story the other day and he was incredulous, since adding that switch is a minor modification, and my airplane already had it when it went into their shop.

They cited safety concerns (You could select the wrong radio!) and pointed to the Avidyne STC since it did not show such a switch.

I could go on, but you get the idea.   If you want that switch, which I think is useful, and you hand your airplane to somebody to change the avionics around, make sure they're not going to delete it.  Many airplanes have such a switch.

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Thanks for all the comments and advice. I think ultimately I'll add the 440 to replace the KX165 that is my #2 nav/com. But it's just too far down the list of priorities to do it now. 

I would certainly install a switch to allow either Nav1 or Nav2 to drive the autopilot. So I guess I'd have to make sure I had the right shop before we start the work. For this and other reasons, it's good to ask these questions before selecting the shop. 

I had a similar situation where I wanted a G5 to back up my Aspen. I just had to find the right shop to do it. It actually wasn't very hard. There were several shops here in Texas who were very happy to do it.

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Check What Alan Fox is selling as he has the pair listed recently... in the event that changes the strategy any...

Best regards,

-a-

 

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On 1/9/2019 at 10:21 AM, gsxrpilot said:

Does anyone have this combo in their Mooney? If so, I'd like to know how you like it and what the benefits are.

I had it in my Mooney, then swapped the 540 for a 550. It is a nice setup but I would upgrade the 540 to a 550 before adding a 440.

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On 1/12/2019 at 11:30 PM, carusoam said:

Check What Alan Fox is selling as he has the pair listed recently... in the event that changes the strategy any...

That was the post that got me thinking about it in the first place. I don't ever pay retail and those Avidynes don't come up for sale very often on the used market.

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I don’t know how he does it...

But, when stuff like that shows up, I start studying things I may want to have in the future...

His home base is a short hop away for me.

I bought a device from him once, it was perfect, a slide in replacement, I needed to get home from Mooney Summit a year ago...

Alan, like many NJ Mooney pilots, has become a great friend, so my thoughts and opinions are somewhat possibly biased...

Best regards,

-a-

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