GPS advise

[Mooney1401]

looking for recommendations on GPS units. I am looking to install an IFR GPS in my 77 J

I would like it to be able to connect with Garmin G5s (to be installed later) 

seeking your advice on best priced and practical unit. (working in a budget) 

thanks 

j

[jetdriven]

2 minutes ago, Mooney1401 said:

looking for recommendations on GPS units. I am looking to install an IFR GPS in my 77 J

I would like it to be able to connect with Garmin G5s (to be installed later) 

seeking your advice on best priced and practical unit. (working in a budget) 

thanks 

j

G430w is pretty much it if on a budget. 

[Mooney1401]

Thanks Byron,

 

[donkaye]

When it comes to the primary navigation in your airplane to be used for many years, it might be worth going off budget a bit.  Because of the many new things it can do (VFR approaches to all runways  of public airports (not sure about Canada), Vertical navigation, Temperature compensated approach altitudes given the temperature of a destination airport, interface capability to all Garmin products, and many more things), you should consider getting the GTN 650, or even better, the GTN 750 that allows for Approach Charts.  You definitely won't be sorry.

P.S. I can't comment on the IFD Avidyne series of GPSs because with all my teaching I've never had a student whose had one.

[M016576]

two choices, really- IFD series. (Avidyne) or GTN series (garmin).

i would not “invest” in the GNS series at this point- you get more for your money with the other two options.  Weigh which features you like, and the cost not only to acquire- but to keep updated and legal (300-700 a year, depending on features, unit and manufacturer).  Then go from there (personally, I recommend avidyne- others like garmin).

[gsxrpilot]

In order... buy the best one you can afford.

• GTN 750 - $15K
• IFD 540 - $14K
• IFD 440 - $10K
• GTN 650 - $10K
• GNS 530W - $9K
• GNS 430W - $7K

It's interesting to me how the values of the GNS series have held up.

In spite of all the cool new features of GTN series that @donkaye mentions, I still think the IFD 440 is an easier to use unit than the GTN 650. None the least of which is the IFD100 free big screen and the Bluetooth keyboard.

[KLRDMD]

8 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

In order... buy the best one you can afford.

• GTN 750 - $15K
• IFD 540 - $14K
• IFD 440 - $10K
• GTN 650 - $10K
• GNS 530W - $9K
• GNS 430W - $7K

It's interesting to me how the values of the GNS series have held up.

In spite of all the cool new features of GTN series that @donkaye mentions, I still think the IFD 440 is an easier to use unit than the GTN 650. None the least of which is the IFD100 free big screen and the Bluetooth keyboard.

Above all the ones you list, the IFD 550 should be first.

[gsxrpilot]

5 minutes ago, KLRDMD said:

Above all the ones you list, the IFD 550 should be first.

I just don't see the benefit of the 550 over the 540. I've got plenty of AHARS already.... don't really need another one. But maybe I'm missing something.

[EricJ]

26 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

I just don't see the benefit of the 550 over the 540. I've got plenty of AHARS already.... don't really need another one. But maybe I'm missing something.

That was my feeling as well.   The 540 still has synthetic vision, too, so I couldn't see the value given the additional cost.  Maybe there's something I'm not seeing, either.

[KLRDMD]

1 hour ago, gsxrpilot said:

I just don't see the benefit of the 550 over the 540. I've got plenty of AHARS already.... don't really need another one. But maybe I'm missing something.

Backups are good. I have an AHRS in my three panel Aspen and another as a portable ADS-B unit for the iPad. Plus the one in the 550.

I upgraded the 540 in my Mooney to a 550 and then later upgraded the 540 in my Baron to a 550 so I guess I see the value in it.

[KLRDMD]

39 minutes ago, EricJ said:

That was my feeling as well.   The 540 still has synthetic vision, too, so I couldn't see the value given the additional cost.  Maybe there's something I'm not seeing, either.

The synthetic vision in the 550 is VERY DIFFERENT than that in the 540. The 540 version is "better than nothing" while the version in the 550 is actually useable and functional. Fly with both and you'll upgrade the 540 to a 550, I'll bet.

[gsxrpilot]

23 minutes ago, KLRDMD said:

The synthetic vision in the 550 is VERY DIFFERENT than that in the 540. The 540 version is "better than nothing" while the version in the 550 is actually useable and functional. Fly with both and you'll upgrade the 540 to a 550, I'll bet.

Guess I should have gone flying with you on Monday 

[Jesse Saint]

39 minutes ago, KLRDMD said:

The synthetic vision in the 550 is VERY DIFFERENT than that in the 540. The 540 version is "better than nothing" while the version in the 550 is actually useable and functional. Fly with both and you'll upgrade the 540 to a 550, I'll bet.

I agree completely. The Syn Vis on the 550 is a world different than the 540. Is the difference in cost worth it? That’s for every individual to decide. 

I would also not recommend a GNS series due to the high cost for an old unit. You could look into a 400W for GPS only or a GTN625. 

For future expansion, I would recommend biting the bullet now and going with an IFD or a GTN. 

[KLRDMD]

44 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

Guess I should have gone flying with you on Monday 

Yes, we should have !

[Mooney in Oz]

20 hours ago, Mooney1401 said:

looking for recommendations on GPS units.

To see the operational differences between the GTNs and IFDs, download the trainers from the manufacturer's website or iTunes.

I don't know a lot about the GTNs as I have two IFDs installed.  The IFD trainer on the iPad can be configured to either a 550, 540 or 440 and exhibits excellent displays of the unit/s capabilities.  

[LANCECASPER]

11 hours ago, Jesse Saint said:

I agree completely. The Syn Vis on the 550 is a world different than the 540. Is the difference in cost worth it? That’s for every individual to decide. 

I would also not recommend a GNS series due to the high cost for an old unit. You could look into a 400W for GPS only or a GTN625. 

For future expansion, I would recommend biting the bullet now and going with an IFD or a GTN. 

I was an early adopter of the IFD 540 back in 2014 and got an IFD 440 later to go with it (slid out the 530W and 430W).

Then when I bought another airplane I had to start from scratch on the panel and debated between the GTN750 and the Avidyune IFD 540, but I decided to go with the IFD 540. Later, Avidyne made me a deal I couldn't refuse to pre-order a trade for the IFD550 otherwise I wouldn't have done it. Looking back though I have no regrets.

Competition has been good for the consumer. Garmin's GTN 750 has received some features to keep up with the Avidyne IFD. Avidyne is also continually working on improvements. If there was only one choice we wouldn't get all of these cool features.

[jetdriven]

I think the last feature improvement update was over a year and a half ago, no?

[LANCECASPER]

1 hour ago, jetdriven said:

I think the last feature improvement update was over a year and a half ago, no?

Yes the big one (10.2) was, with the synthetic vision and bluetooth/wi-fi activation:

New Features:

1.   Added support for multiple options on the IFD-series to include:

   a.   WiFi/Bluetooth

   b.    FLTA additions

   c.     TAWS (TSO to follow)

   d.     On-board Digital Radar

   e.     Video Input/Display

   f.      Synthetic Vision

   g.     16W VHF Comm Transmit Power

   h.      SAR/Special Use

   i.       Capstone compliant ADS-B Receivers

2. Added support for European VFR Visual Approach, Landing and Area Charts – this is a new chart option in the chart list for those customers who have elected to add that capability to their Jepp subscription.

3. Added support for Digital Radar (RDR2000/2100) – a new optional RADAR tab has been added to the MAP page and weather radar overlays are supported on the moving map.

4. Added support for TIS traffic display – adds TIS track lines and TIS related “Traffic Not Available” CAS messages

5. Added support for GTX-335/345 – Adds ability to communicate with, and send ADS-B compliant position data to the GTX-335/345.

6. Added support for GTX-330ES – Adds ability to communicate with, and send ADS-B compliant position data to the GTX-330ES

7. Added support for Video input and display – a new optional VIDEO tab has been added to the MAP page which displays input from any RS-170 format camera.  The display can support full-color video input and IR camera input and is pinch zoom-able and pan-able.

8. Added support for TAWS – adds the rest of the TAWS capability to include Premature Descent Alert, Excessive Sink Rate, Negative Climb Rate after Takeoff or Go-Around, TAWS Self Test and associated aurals.   The TSO approval will be a follow-on approval after 10.2.0.0 release.

9. Added Synthetic Vision to all IFDs – a new optional SVS tab has been added to the MAP page which displays an “exocentric” view of your airplane against 3D terrain and obstacles along with flight plan information.

10. Adds support for Search and Rescue and Special Use patterns – provides an option for circular orbits around a point.

11. Added a new “Direct Distance to Active Waypoint” datablock – this datablock provides a constant snap vector including direct distance to the active waypoint.  This does NOT add a buttonhook type of turn toward the waypoint if not already facing it.

12. Added a new “Active Waypoint Direct Info” datablock – Adds a new datablock which displays bearing, distance, time to go to active waypoint using a straight line assumption.

13. Added a new “Designated Waypoint Info” datablock – this is my personal favorite and allows you to designate any waypoint in the system (not just in the flight plan) to be an anchor point and provides bearing, radial, distance, time-to-go data elements.  To change the designated waypoint, just touch on the datablock which pops up a virtual keyboard to type in a new waypoint.  The waypoint selected will survive across power cycles.

14. Adds Demo mode – this feature adds a means in maintenance mode to put the IFD into Demo mode.  Once in demo mode, a special splash screen pops up at each power up and if you accept it, it puts the IFD into demo mode.  The IFD will “fly” the flight plan entered including any altitude constraints.  This mode is entered if a properly configured USB fob is inserted into the USB port prior to power up.  Great for dealers and even useful for in-airplane ground training.

15. Added WX-500 Self Test capability – adds a new WX500 self test page to Maintenance mode for debug and troubleshooting purposes

16.IFD550 Support – Release 10.2.0.0 software fully supports the new IFD550 product which will be released at the same time.  The IFD550 contains an internal Attitude Reference System (a set of TSO’d gyros and accels) that computes and displays a TSO’d attitude indication.  Both Synthetic Vision and a traditional blue/brown ADI depictions are available.  The Synthetic Vision view is an “egocentric” or out-the-window view with 3D traffic, 3D terrain, 3D obstacles, 3D flight plan depiction, Total Velocity Vector (TVV)/Flight Path Marker (FPM) depiction, highlighted airfields and runways, and vertical/lateral deviation indicators.

Of course there have been smaller updates since then.

Thankfully Avidyne wasn't playing catch-up. Unlike Garmin they already had "pinch and zoom" and QWERTY keyboard from day one, plus their original architecture included built-in bluetooth and wi-fi, just waiting to be activated. It wasn't an afterthought where they had to sell you a $1500 bluetooth SD card add-on.

[m20kmooney]

How does the IFD work with the G500txi? I seem to recall they had some major issues with the original G500. 

[LANCECASPER]

1 hour ago, m20kmooney said:

How does the IFD work with the G500txi? I seem to recall they had some major issues with the original G500. 

Fine now, but when Garmin released a software update for the G500 it wasn't compatible with the IFD until a fix came about, Wait to update software until tests have been done. Avidyne has a G500 in their R&D - wait for "all clear" before you update any software when you are working with two different manufacturers.