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Don't be like this guy


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I knew that voice was coming...  :)

Something that I may have heard while in the neighborhood of Fisk.... there was an artful exchange broadcast on the radio...

The Notam could be a bit more specific regarding the approach procedure closing time...

the pilot on the radio was referring to the approach being closed when a Mooney is more than capable of being on the ground a few minutes prior to the airport being closed... even at 90kias as everyone is following by procedure...

He (and several others) got locked out, when his plane was more than capable of arriving at the airport, safely in a timely fashion.

OK, no points awarded for the ‘planned’ outburst... ATC gave their equally ready response... it was a beautiful exchange... :)  seen/heard a few times before at KOSH ... probably every evening and every day before the airshow...

There were many aviators in the air heading for KOSH at the time... must be a common challenge every evening... they want to shut down before daylight ends... giving everyone a chance to get to Appleton or others before sunset...

We were on the ground and had tents set up long before dark, at Fon du Lac...

The Notam can benefit from the additional piece of data... (Fisk Arrival closure time...)

There are so many pieces of data in the Notam... this is the one I have seen missing for a decade or so of SnF and KOSH experience... I have been the first to be locked out of SnF before the afternoon airshow....

Did I miss something? Is there a closing time for the procedure somewhere? A way to back calculate the arrival procedure closing down...?

I’m not condoning the behavior, but pointing out that there is a detail missing in the Notam. This ATC recording is an excellent tool for pointing out the missing detail. A little colorful, but useful...

Best regards,

-a-

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On 7/30/2018 at 12:59 PM, carusoam said:

I knew that voice was coming...  :)

Something that I may have heard while in the neighborhood of Fisk.... there was an artful exchange broadcast on the radio...

The Notam could be a bit more specific regarding the approach procedure closing time...

the pilot on the radio was referring to the approach being closed when a Mooney is more than capable of being on the ground a few minutes prior to the airport being closed... even at 90kias as everyone is following by procedure...

He (and several others) got locked out, when his plane was more than capable of arriving at the airport, safely in a timely fashion.

HAHA, I thought I recognized that voice!

I departed OSH on Wednesday before you came in. Looking forward to seeing you guys at the Summit.

Cheers,

Dan

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2 minutes ago, Alan Fox said:

Com'on Paul....Gotta give the guy credit for having the balls to admit he didn't have a clue......Ballsy , even for a Jersey guy...

Hahahahah.... some people are just to ignorant to even know to be embarrassed.

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I actually loved 53A, the balls to admit he didn't have the NOTAM, ask for directions. He did so pretty respectfully and kindly and the controllers were pretty helpful.

It was educational to listen to for someone who has never arrived VFR into OSH (I was a pax for someone flying in IFR once but that seemed pretty straightforward as if just doing an IFR approach).

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21 minutes ago, AlexLev said:

I actually loved 53A, the balls to admit he didn't have the NOTAM, ask for directions. He did so pretty respectfully and kindly and the controllers were pretty helpful.

It was educational to listen to for someone who has never arrived VFR into OSH (I was a pax for someone flying in IFR once but that seemed pretty straightforward as if just doing an IFR approach).

I would think, though, that knowing I'd be flying into the busiest and most crowded airspace known to man, I would be respectful and kind to the controllers by:

1 - be super paranoid about having a copy of the NOTAM and

2 - have read the NOTAM cover to cover and

3 - rehearsed my expected approach before the flight

and if somehow the NOTAM got eaten by the dog or the 3 year old (or both) in the back seat, I'd tell ATC on my initial callup I forgot the NOTA--er, that the NOTAM was eaten, and ask if they had the ability to help me out, rather than hemming and hawing and admitting later that I didn't have it.

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15 minutes ago, jaylw314 said:

I would think, though, that knowing I'd be flying into the busiest and most crowded airspace known to man, I would be respectful and kind to the controllers by:

1 - be super paranoid about having a copy of the NOTAM and

2 - have read the NOTAM cover to cover and

3 - rehearsed my expected approach before the flight

and if somehow the NOTAM got eaten by the dog or the 3 year old (or both) in the back seat, I'd tell ATC on my initial callup I forgot the NOTA--er, that the NOTAM was eaten, and ask if they had the ability to help me out, rather than hemming and hawing and admitting later that I didn't have it.

I completely agree. Needless to say, it was interesting to hear how it went down and educational for those of who have never flown VFR into OSH.

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I was always under the impression that "flight planning"   included how to get from point a to point b.  and it was generally done before getting up in the air.   I do think I was berated once in flight training for not knowing key information about the airport we were going to.  Point and go is not for everyone.

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Also keep in mind the Notam has about 10 pages that apply to GA flights... of which any one of them can apply to your flight as ATC can give you personalized instructions... how’s your memory?

The Fisk arrival will be called/spelled Fiske in your database...

all frequencies are on a page at the back... a few are also printed on the procedure you are following...

If you are single pilot VFR... 

  • you are super busy
  • Always looking for traffic
  • No time for being heads down
  • your partner/ATC May even forget you momentarily...
  • Going missed is an actual probability...

Inbound from Fiske, we confirmed our position with the wing rock, it was approved on the radio...

Didn’t hear anything until the moment we discussed going missed (internal discussion in the Mooney). 

We were cleared to land while being advised of a pair of tri-motors a few hundred feet below us...

Staying aware of a pair of tri-motors, identifying the colored dot we were cleared for, while looking for the unknown unknowns is kind of taxing...

Sitting right seat is much easier, and less stressful....:)

When on the ground, you are not done yet... Got your sign? VAC, GAC, or other.... communicate your desire to park with your Mooney friends in the North 40 by flashing your VAC sign to everyone who approaches your running plane....

VAC... Vintage Air Craft parking...

Fun stuff,

-a-

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My favorite was when I was landing out at Y50.  Not parallel taxiway, so I had to back taxi on the runway after landing.  As I'm getting ready to do that I hear and older fellow inbound in a  Cub.  I offer to stand by until he's done his landing, but tell him I'm going to tell everyone he landed on the asphalt and not the grass runway.

 

He responds: "there's a grass runway?"

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 8/1/2018 at 1:56 PM, carusoam said:

When on the ground, you are not done yet... Got your sign? VAC, GAC, or other.... communicate your desire to park with your Mooney friends in the North 40 by flashing your VAC sign to everyone who approaches your running plane....

VAC... Vintage Air Craft parking...

LOL - VAC - complete opposite end of the airport - I was VAC and wound up parked "just a bit north of Chicago" on row 174 in the south 40. My journey to the gatherings took 4 commuter connections (bus and or tram) and about 40 minutes.  Next time will be different, I'll either be trained up for the mass arrival - or get a bit closer by parking in the North 40.

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To make KOSH seem a lot smaller than it really is... train for a 5k.  :)

It makes walking to Target really easy.  Coming back with a few items helps build your grip strength...

To really go the distance... use the Uber.

Ran the 5k on the Sunday after we got back... 25 min.

Got lucky as far as location goes... mid-week, somebody left early and a nice space at the end of the runway opened up...

Best regards,

-a-

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