Garmin TXi Flight Displays, GTN Navigators, GFC Autopilots and G5 Updates

[gacoon]

14 hours ago, M016576 said:

~12K for the baseline G500Txi

~2500 for G5

-7990 for Aspen pro w/Synthetic vision from Chief right now (through 7/31).

Excluding the backup- the Garmin Txi is 50% more expensive and doesn’t have synthetic vision.

But the screen is big enough to read

[Niko182]

how does the G5 compare against the L3 esi-500 and the MC S.A.M.

 

[PTK]

On 7/21/2018 at 11:28 PM, gacoon said:

But the screen is big enough to read

+1 and that's not all! Some people wouldn’t recognize value if they ran into it! Look at all the innovation coming from Garmin. In contrast there's "zero" innovation from Aspen or Avidyne for that matter. Aspen is stuck on an archaic 13 year old display. They can’t even update their freakin’ display! Avidyne on an 8 year old box. Trying to latch on to the GNS success didn't work too well for them. 

The way I see it Aspen's and Avidyne's days are numbered. Once the new Garmin autopilots are out they're both going to be ancient history. Just like their boxes. Garmin owns the navigator and display market right now as we speak, and about to own the autopilot one as well. A and A better get off their proverbial and literal asses and do something... now. For the sake of their survival and for their customers'. Values of airplanes with their equipment will plummet and that can’t be good. The writing is on the wall. But unfortunately, as they have demonstrated, they just can’t compete. Cutting price can only go so far. Soon they won't be able to give them away. 

[LANCECASPER]

On 7/22/2018 at 7:29 AM, PTK said:

The way I see it Aspen's and Avidyne's days are numbered. 

Someone is going to have to inform Aspen and Avidyne that their days are numbered since they are way too busy waiting on customers to notice it. By the looks of the hordes of people in both of their booths today at Oshkosh they aren't having any problems whatsoever. I had a question to ask Aspen about their new products and it took over an hour to be able to talk to one of the many Aspen reps since there were more people than their large display booth could possibly hold. Avidyne also was packed today. Their niche market started out to be slide-in replacements for the old GNS 430/530 technology, but one of the reps said today that over half of their business is now coming from those who are re-doing legacy panels are planning them around the IFD platform. It's great to see competition in the market! Everyone wins.

When I walked by Bendix King's stand-alone building it looked like there were a lot of people there until I realized when I walked in that they all had light blue Bendix King shirts on. Very sad. If anyone's days are numbered, it's Bendix King's.

[Marauder]

I had the same experience at Sun N Fun.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[Bob_Belville]

I've slept since then... but I think I was told in the Aspen booth yesterday that the new screen on display side by side with the current 1000Pro would be out in Nov. New, faster processor and much higher res, brighter display.

[Steve W]

I have to expect we'll be seeing more partnerships or maybe even acquisitions in the space.

Right now the only provider of what we in IT would call a "full stack solution" is Garmin(full panel solution?) Avidyne has a GPS Navigator, used to have a glass panel, and definitely has the tech for an autopilot, even if they never did ship servos. Aspen has glass but no GPS Navigator. Dynon has glass and an autopilot but also no GPS Navigator. And King, well, whatever.

I'm still leaning towards a dual G5 and GFC500... maybe...

 

 

[Marauder]

I have to expect we'll be seeing more partnerships or maybe even acquisitions in the space.
Right now the only provider of what we in IT would call a "full stack solution" is Garmin(full panel solution?) Avidyne has a GPS Navigator, used to have a glass panel, and definitely has the tech for an autopilot, even if they never did ship servos. Aspen has glass but no GPS Navigator. Dynon has glass and an autopilot but also no GPS Navigator. And King, well, whatever.
I'm still leaning towards a dual G5 and GFC500... maybe...
 
 

Hey! Let’s be fair. King almost has a KI-300 and they do make fine Swiss watches according to one guy here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[DXB]

The QWERTY keyboard and audible terrain alerts are nice enhancements to my GTN650.  It's still a dang shame the G5 can only be a standby for the G500s and not my Aspen pfd.  I keep hoping for another low cost glass standby alternative to the Sandia and L3 units before I do tear out my vac system this fall. Sadly I now doubt one will emerge.

[Oldguy]

55 minutes ago, DXB said:

The QWERTY keyboard and audible terrain alerts are nice enhancements to my GTN650.  It's still a dang shame the G5 can only be a standby for the G500s and not my Aspen pfd.  I keep hoping for another low cost glass standby alternative to the Sandia and L3 units before I do tear out my vac system this fall. Sadly I now doubt one will emerge.

There are several folks who have gotten field approval of a G5 as backup for their Aspen PFD. I know @gsxrpilot is one of them. You might see how he and others have approached it.

[DXB]

30 minutes ago, Oldguy said:

There are several folks who have gotten field approval of a G5 as backup for their Aspen PFD. I know @gsxrpilot is one of them. You might see how he and others have approached it.

Yes several installs like this are indeed out there. I do know a shop in my area that has done these installs as a minor deviation from the STC and I've got nothing against it, but I am personally too chicken to live in that gray regulatory area.  Unfortunately the explicit approval now for the G500 only underscores the lack of approval for the Aspen.  There are also folks who have gotten one off field approvals, but I think my local FSDO has a reputation for such paperwork.  If anyone has gotten one  approved through the Philly FSDO, I certainly would be interested in replicating their paperwork.

[smccray]

17 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

Someone is going to have to inform Aspen and Avidyne that their days are numbered since they are way too busy waiting on customers to notice it. By the looks of the hordes of people in both of their booths today at Oshkosh they aren't having any problems whatsoever. I had a question to ask Aspen about their new products and it took over an hour to be able to talk to one of the many Aspen reps since there were more people than their large display booth could possibly hold. Avidyne also was packed today. Their niche market started out to be slide-in replacements for the old GNS 430/530 technology, but one of the reps said today that over half of their business is now coming from those who are re-doing legacy panels are planning them around the IFD platform. It's great to see competition in the market! Everyone wins.

 When I walked by Bendix King's stand-alone building it looked like there were a lot of people there until I realized when I walked in that they all had light blue Bendix King shirts on. Very sad. If anyone's days are numbered, it's Bendix King's.

I hope they're successful.  Aspen is, in my opinion, responsible for the introduction of the G500 from Garmin.  We need competition in the avionics market.

However- I don't believe either company is doing what it takes to be a viable competitor to Garmin.  I hope I'm wrong, but I've been saying it for a couple years- Aspen will not survive; Avidyne will end up swallowed up by Dynon or will disappear altogether.  I hope I'm wrong, but stand alone avionics are going to be a tough sell next to an integrated system.  Dynon is still in the best position to compete with Garmin, but there hasn't been much progress over the last year.  I hope they're able to get installs under their belt over the next 12 months.

Me?  I'm putting my money where my mouth is- I can't stand how Garmin has positioned their autopilots milking A36 owners for GFC600 $ instead of GFC500 $, but you won't catch me putting money in any stand alone panel box other than PS Engineering.  I'm torn between the Garmin EIS and the JPI, but I'm leaning towards the integrated option from the evil empire rather than the stand alone equipment.

[MIm20c]

3 hours ago, DXB said:

Yes several installs like this are indeed out there. I do know a shop in my area that has done these installs as a minor deviation from the STC and I've got nothing against it, but I am personally too chicken to live in that gray regulatory area.  Unfortunately the explicit approval now for the G500 only underscores the lack of approval for the Aspen.  There are also folks who have gotten one off field approvals, but I think my local FSDO has a reputation for such paperwork.  If anyone has gotten one  approved through the Philly FSDO, I certainly would be interested in replicating their paperwork.

The big difference IMO is that before the announcement the G5 was not certified to be a backup for anything. In fact the airspeed and altitude was not to be used for anything beyond secondary information. 

This is why all the g5’s that were field approved were used as an AI only. Some used the original ASI / encoding altimeter while others used the mfd1000 w/external battery that allowed the removal of ASI and altimeter. 

Now the G5 is certified for all three functions AI/ASI/altimeter to a screen that doesn’t even have a battery backup. This is a huge deal to me because there are a lot of planes out in the wild with only one battery, one alternator, and probably really old wiring. 

I think the G5 (and gad 29 for backup cdi) is a slam dunk for getting approved next to an aspen now. 

[ArtVandelay]

If G5 is certified for airspeed and altimeter, does that mean steam gauges can be removed for a dual G5 installation?

[MIm20c]

2 hours ago, teejayevans said:

If G5 is certified for airspeed and altimeter, does that mean steam gauges can be removed for a dual G5 installation?

Good question. I think similar to the L3 and Sandia it cannot replace those instruments in a primary role.  The Aspen engineer that I talked to said both the E5 and G5 certification required the remaining 6 pack to remain. However, the pfd1000 does not.