Guest Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 (edited) Do not crank the engine until you raise oil pressure! Buy yourself an engine pre Oiler pressure pot, or even a brake bleeder pot, remove the front right oil gallery plug. Connect the pressure pot to this gallery and pressurize the oil system until you see a reading on the gage. Now when you do start the engine you will have instant oil pressure. Your camshaft relies on oil thrown from the crankshaft for lubrication. Clarence Edited May 15, 2018 by M20Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradp Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 Anyone ever make a STC for an electric preoiler for Lycoming Engines? Seems like a no brainer. To the OP - be very patient with a project like this. Expect not to fly it for many months and that things will not work out as planned. Think of yourself more like an RV builder than a pilot at this point I don’t want to bust any bubbles but your learning curve is going to be super steep. Usually a project like this is reserved for folks that fall into particular categories - availability of idle time (retired / not a regular 9-5 schedule), are either very young or very old in aviation terms, or have a lot of mechanical experience / are handy. I’ve owned an aircraft for 7 years, have done most of the mechanical work supervised, now and I don’t think I’d be ready for a project plane ala John Breda, Alan Fox or Alex (Raptor). If you do hands off with an AP it’s usually best reserved for one you have a longstanding relationship with. Else you may be paying for multiple college tuitions in labor costs and the project may or may not move along your anticipated time frame. Unfortunately there are no true barn finds or steals- everything saved up front is paid back later in maintenance costs to the fleet average value. When you have it opened up for annual perform 208B service bulletin and inspect the spar under the seats for corrosion Now with that disclaimer out of the way.... please consider putting an engine monitor in the thing. Best investment you can make in pretty much any airframe. There were two recently on the list for sale very reasonably priced. @Aerodon also has them up for sale frequently . Grab one and get it in there. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 +1 on the engine monitor and FF... Something that will give you a hint that there are problems coming.... before they arrive. Best regards, -a- 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 6 hours ago, bradp said: I don’t want to bust any bubbles but your learning curve is going to be super steep. Usually a project like this is reserved for folks that fall into particular categories - availability of idle time (retired / not a regular 9-5 schedule), are either very young or very old in aviation terms, or have a lot of mechanical experience / are handy. I’ve owned an aircraft for 7 years, have done most of the mechanical work supervised, now and I don’t think I’d be ready for a project plane ala John Breda, Alan Fox or Alex (Raptor). If you do hands off with an AP it’s usually best reserved for one you have a longstanding relationship with. Else you may be paying for multiple college tuitions in labor costs and the project may or may not move along your anticipated time frame. Unfortunately there are no true barn finds or steals- everything saved up front is paid back later in maintenance costs to the fleet average value A whole lotta truth here. If you need motivation, inspiration or commiseration reach out to @Raptor05121, @Dream to fly, or @Fookz92. But it's best not to ask them about the spending between purchase and airworthiness. Just know we'll all be cheering for you. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdflysurf Posted May 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 7 hours ago, EricJ said: Don't wash it until you replace the o-rings in the fuel caps or you'll wind up with a bunch of new water in the fuel system. If it's been sitting outside it probably already has a bunch. Very good advice thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdflysurf Posted May 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 7 hours ago, M20Doc said: Do not crank the engine until you raise oil pressure! Buy yourself an engine pre Oiler pressure pot, or even a brake bleeder pot, remove the front right oil gallery plug. Connect the pressure pot to this gallery and pressurize the oil system until you see a reading on the gage. Now when you do start the engine you will have instant oil pressure. Your camshaft relies on oil thrown from the crankshaft for lubrication. Clarence Ok - I'll bring this up to the A&P, he mentioned getting the oil moving around before starting. He seems to be on it - but all of these nuggets of help are awesome and I'll compare notes with him prior to us heading out and touching the plane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdflysurf Posted May 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 6 hours ago, carusoam said: +1 on the engine monitor and FF... Something that will give you a hint that there are problems coming.... before they arrive. Best regards, -a- I noticed in the logs that the EGT is inop (the only instrument that is), I don't see that it was fixed. How extensive is it to add a basic JPI or other engine monitor? I''m assuming it includes EGT in the monitors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdflysurf Posted May 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 9 hours ago, Kris_Adams said: Congrats on the purchase. We are all glad to hear about another mooney being rescued. Hopefully you won't have to do major engine work but it's great to hear you are going into the with open eyes and are willing to do that if needed. Any pics of the exterior you can share? Thank you. I will make sure to take a lot of pictures and document this whole endeavor. Here is a teaser pic. Anyone want to help me clean it? :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted May 15, 2018 Report Share Posted May 15, 2018 3 minutes ago, sdflysurf said: I noticed in the logs that the EGT is inop (the only instrument that is), I don't see that it was fixed. How extensive is it to add a basic JPI or other engine monitor? I''m assuming it includes EGT in the monitors? I always recommend the GEM G2 as the best budget engine monitor if you are going brand new. It will be Primary for EGT and CHT. It will also include a very nice Fuel Flow option as well. It has dead simple data logging and has a much better screen than either the JPI or EI offerings. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliffy Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 Just guessing Barstow-Dagget ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdflysurf Posted May 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 23 minutes ago, cliffy said: Just guessing Barstow-Dagget ? Yes. Interesting little "hangar". Do you know this plane? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 43 minutes ago, sdflysurf said: I noticed in the logs that the EGT is inop (the only instrument that is), I don't see that it was fixed. How extensive is it to add a basic JPI or other engine monitor? I''m assuming it includes EGT in the monitors? If you have the original EGT... it is a funny instrument... it has no power and works solely off the micro-volts of the thermocouple... Just a little dirt or oxidation keeps the needle from moving... there is a screw that sets the calibration/moves the needle... give it some exercise to see if you can free up the needle... Realistically, you want to get on to the next level of instrumentation... new starts in the few AMU range. Foreverplane instruments are in the 6 AMU range... If you are eating ramen noodles a few times per week... we have a guy that sells used engine monitors... The latest wave of updates has people removing some pretty nice monitors... If your financial advisor approves your instrument purchases... there are three good manufacturers to select from... the certified instruments cost 2X what the advisory instruments do... for Essentially the same information... Use caution, the installation cost can be astronomical... work with your mechanic if you have good wiring skills.... PP thoughts, not a mechanic... best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliffy Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 No, I just know a lot of out of the way airports and hangars. Actually haven't been to DAG in several years. This hangar just came up out of the history banks of the mind! :-) :-) My mind is full of minuscule, junk information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 Thank you. I will make sure to take a lot of pictures and document this whole endeavor. Here is a teaser pic. Anyone want to help me clean it? That is some serious bird droppings on the tail. I would pull the interior completely to look for critters. Also check the rat socks in the gear wells. If they are destroyed, critters can get into the wings. That is one dirty bird!Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1964-M20E Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 glad to see you are rescuing this fine plane. Fly it well and often once you get it where you want it and while getting it there 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliffy Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 A little soap and water, a little wax and it would probably look pretty good for a while. You'll probably get 10 more knots out of it waxed than in its present condition :-) :-) Lube all the controls (everything that moves) per the AD before flight. 100% silicone on the rod ends so as not to attract dirt On all the rest I use Tri-Flow. I would suggest that unless you have jacks and can test the gear I'd fly it gear down to home base and then jack it there to test and lube the gear. Watch the max gear down speed if you do but that's what I would do to avoid any surprises on the first flight. I'd also do a good "in the pattern" test flight for 20-30 mins and then pull the filter and cut it open. Just me but it would give one peace of mind on the way south. Pick your route to allow easy landing if needed (even off airport). Think ahead You might also look at disassembly and lube of the gear transmission (when you get home) per the SB as it hasn't been run in a long time and the grease will be dried out and solid. This is what kills the gear transmissions. No periodic lube change out. Looks like a fun project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean S Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 I have recent experience on applying for a ferry permit from A&P/IA side. Your A&P can fill out the permit, but the owner of the aircraft is the one who signs the permit and deals with the FAA. I just recently did a permit for Mooney with leaky fuel tanks. I filled out all the details and limitations, turned the form over to the owner and the FAA signed off no problem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdflysurf Posted May 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 I am buying replacement parts from Aircraft Spruce today for our first trip - I saw a thread about tires and wanted to confirm that the Flight Custom III tires for both mains (6.00-6) and Nose (5.00-5) are good and have no clearance issues. Anyone able to confirm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LANCECASPER Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 17 minutes ago, sdflysurf said: I am buying replacement parts from Aircraft Spruce today for our first trip - I saw a thread about tires and wanted to confirm that the Flight Custom III tires for both mains (6.00-6) and Nose (5.00-5) are good and have no clearance issues. Anyone able to confirm? Here are the common Mooney parts by model at Aircraft Spruce: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/stpages/mooneyM20standardreplacementparts.php?clickkey=3028256 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1964-M20E Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 1 hour ago, sdflysurf said: I am buying replacement parts from Aircraft Spruce today for our first trip - I saw a thread about tires and wanted to confirm that the Flight Custom III tires for both mains (6.00-6) and Nose (5.00-5) are good and have no clearance issues. Anyone able to confirm? Those are the sizes you should not have any issues. I have the FC II on my nose. I can't remember what I have on the mains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fookz92 Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 Thanks @gsxrpilot for the shoutout. @sdflysurf congrats on the find! It is very rewarding to be able to find such a bird in such a co diction and then be able to build it up to make it your own. Mine sat for 11 years. The thread on my find on here is "Resurrecting a J". To answer some questions of what I did: -Get yourself a buffer and buff, wash, & wax it. -yes replace the tires with those sizes (don't be cheap with your tires) -boroscope for sure and send the Cylinder you take off to get an IRAN done. -overhaul the prop since it may have AD's and you can see if parts are still good best of luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DXB Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 23 hours ago, bradp said: Anyone ever make a STC for an electric preoiler for Lycoming Engines? Seems like a no brainer. To the OP - be very patient with a project like this. Expect not to fly it for many months and that things will not work out as planned. Think of yourself more like an RV builder than a pilot at this point I don’t want to bust any bubbles but your learning curve is going to be super steep. Usually a project like this is reserved for folks that fall into particular categories - availability of idle time (retired / not a regular 9-5 schedule), are either very young or very old in aviation terms, or have a lot of mechanical experience / are handy. I’ve owned an aircraft for 7 years, have done most of the mechanical work supervised, now and I don’t think I’d be ready for a project plane ala John Breda, Alan Fox or Alex (Raptor). If you do hands off with an AP it’s usually best reserved for one you have a longstanding relationship with. Else you may be paying for multiple college tuitions in labor costs and the project may or may not move along your anticipated time frame. Unfortunately there are no true barn finds or steals- everything saved up front is paid back later in maintenance costs to the fleet average value. When you have it opened up for annual perform 208B service bulletin and inspect the spar under the seats for corrosion Now with that disclaimer out of the way.... please consider putting an engine monitor in the thing. Best investment you can make in pretty much any airframe. There were two recently on the list for sale very reasonably priced. @Aerodon also has them up for sale frequently . Grab one and get it in there. @sdflysurfWhat bradp said. You have made a gutsy acquisition to say the least. I bought a plane at roughly your level of aviation experience 3.5 years ago, but it was flying and in pretty good condition except for the panel. Still the challenges in dealing with maintenance issues and getting a 50 year old bird into a reliable state have been substantial. Despite access to helpful resources like this particular site, the repair and maintenance challenges have been compounded by my lack of time, experience, and mentorship in this area. Inevitably there will be lots of unexpected problems, expenses, and a steep learning curve in the first couple of years. Also I was not born with the judgement to know when some new problem is an urgent safety issue or not - this learning has built up over time and continues to do so. In absence of such judgement, early on I was hyper-conservative about maintenance concerns and might have gotten taken for a ride a couple of times. The upside here is that if you are able to get this plane in good shape over a couple of years, you will know the bird intimately and it will truly be your own. As challenges go, learning to fly it and leaving your C172 behind will be infinitely more fun than getting this plane in shape. P.S. Definitely get an engine monitor - JPI, EI, or Insight. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted May 16, 2018 Report Share Posted May 16, 2018 3 hours ago, sdflysurf said: I am buying replacement parts from Aircraft Spruce today for our first trip - I saw a thread about tires and wanted to confirm that the Flight Custom III tires for both mains (6.00-6) and Nose (5.00-5) are good and have no clearance issues. Anyone able to confirm? I put plane Flight Customs on mine. The only benefit I saw for the FCII and FCIII is higher and higher ground speed allowances, right up there above my Gear Speed and as high as my cruise speed! My C will never run 140 knots on the ground . . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliffy Posted May 17, 2018 Report Share Posted May 17, 2018 Make sure you get 6 ply rating tires for all 3 as called for in the TCDS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdflysurf Posted May 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2018 (edited) 40 minutes ago, cliffy said: Make sure you get 6 ply rating tires for all 3 as called for in the TCDS Done - Got the Flight Custom III for front and main tires - both 6 ply. Got a mobile detailer. Got the A&P scheduled with his trailer full of parts: Here's our parts list to bring: Logs / Keys Cleaning Supplies Jacks / Tires/Tubes Fuel Cap Gaskets Main Battery ELT Batteries New Spark Plugs THREE new oil filters (so we can cut it open and look for metal at several phases) New Air Filter Screws Oil Grease Prop Lube Borescope Tank Sealant Engine Pre-Oiler Pressure Pot?? (for instant oil pressure prior to start) Brake Bleeder Pot?? Thanks for all your help guys - all I need is a ferry permit and a mooney experienced pilot to bring it back to French Valley (F70) or Carlsbad (KCRQ) I'll be documenting as much as I possibly can and will report back. Edited May 17, 2018 by sdflysurf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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