Well this couldn't have been good for my engine.

[ragedracer1977]

Kinda disappointed it wasn't caught at annual.  No way it deteriorated this much in 5 months.  There's silicone globbed in places, obviously very very old.  I feel pretty lucky that ripped off chunk didn't get sucked into the carb.  How this wasn't noticed when the filter was replaced I honestly have no idea.

[ragedracer1977]

All better

[ragedracer1977]

And sorry for the rotated pictures. I still dont understand why the site does that (or how to fix it) 

Edited March 26, 2018 by ragedracer1977

[Marauder]

And sorry for the rotated pictures. I still dont understand why the site does that (or how to fix it) 

They aren’t rotated on my iPad. Glad you got the issue resolved.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[kmyfm20s]

I’m sure an oil analysis would show high silica on that one:) Regardless you found it and that’s good! That’s why I like doing my own oil changes. No one cares more about your plane/saftey than yourself. How did you find it? 

[MIm20c]

31 minutes ago, ragedracer1977 said:

All better

I’ve heard those are pretty expensive?

Thanks for the pictures, my intake does not have a full length ramp. Instead it has a flapper valve at an angle to allow the TN to override the ambient. 

[ragedracer1977]

1 hour ago, kmyfm20s said:

I’m sure an oil analysis would show high silica on that one:) Regardless you found it and that’s good! That’s why I like doing my own oil changes. No one cares more about your plane/saftey than yourself. How did you find it? 

It was showing elevated silica and aluminum, not hugely elevated, but above the norm for their ‘average’ engine.  They (Black Stone) weren’t concerned about it yet, but wanted to keep monitoring to see what happened (I’ve only done 2 analyses since I’ve owned the plane). I believe the elevated aluminum was also a result of the less than stellar annual.  The doghouse was not put back together correctly and was rubbing a LOT.  There was powdered aluminum all over the bottom cowling right in the area of the intake boot.  

 I knew it was worn, but I hadn’t realized how bad.  This is my first plane and I assumed it was fine that way since a “big” shop had done a thorough annual. I’m learning it wasn’t that thorough at all.  Anyhow, it was getting dark in the hangar and I had a halogen light set up next to the cowl to replace the landing light.  I had both sides of the cowl off as I was just inspecting stuff.  When I walked to the other side of the plane, I realized I could clearly see light through the boot.  So I started digging deeper.  You can imagine my dismay....   It wasn’t even installed correctly, not to mention the terrible condition.

i changed the oil today and I’m sending off a sample.  I’ll pull another sample in 25 hours.  Interested to see what it shows.

Edited March 26, 2018 by ragedracer1977

[ragedracer1977]

46 minutes ago, MIm20c said:

I’ve heard those are pretty expensive?

Thanks for the pictures, my intake does not have a full length ramp. Instead it has a flapper valve at an angle to allow the TN to override the ambient. 

Close to $300.  Pretty pricey for what it is. 

 

[Jim Peace]

just curious if your annuals were done like most people want by a guy in a van or were they done at reputable places?

[Jim Peace]

3 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

 

He says right above that his annual was done by a big shop.

I’m with @kmyfm20s. No one cares more about your plane and safety than you do. Nice catch.

Jim

I see that now....thanks

I would like to know the shop

[MIm20c]

It’s a pain to take off the lower cowling but my guess is they failed to do that the past couple of times. 

[Skates97]

17 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

 

He says above that his annual was done by a big shop.

I’m with @kmyfm20s. No one cares more about your plane and safety than you do. Nice catch.

Jim

I imagine some may disagree strongly with this, but...

I fall into the camp of wanting to be very involved in the maintenance and annuals on my plane. I would rather open the whole thing up myself and go through it with an AP/IA than just drop it off at a shop and hope that it is all done up to the standards that I would want. I don't have the experience of a big shop, but I do think that working with someone experienced that together we will have the plane maintained as well as if it just got dropped off somewhere.

It makes me think of something my dad (who spent 20 years in the Air Force working for the government) would always say when we would be working on some project together. He would say "That's close enough for government work, but we aren't doing government work" so we would work on whatever it was a bit more and make sure it was to tighter tolerances, more precise, stronger, etc...

[ragedracer1977]

28 minutes ago, Jim Peace said:

I see that now....thanks

I would like to know the shop

I’m still trying to work through the situation.  I know “blame the shop”, but I feel like this is a mechanic that screwed up.  I’m not totally 100% ready to throw them under the bus, but I might have mentioned their name in another thread.  

[Andy95W]

You should definitely let the shop know.  Not in order to get someone in trouble or fired, but so a more experienced mechanic can pass along the knowledge to the more junior one.

If nothing else, the shop will be glad to know.  They're missing out on a fairly lucrative profit stream with their mechanic not knowing to check the air intake rubber boot.

[Sean S]

Your boot was really bad! Your engine has been sucking partially unfiltered air for years. I recently finished two annuals. One on a 75F, and one on a 76F. Both of them had holes in the boots and elevated silica in the oil. Just sent the post repair 25 hour oil sample to Blackstone on the 75F. Still waiting for the results. Your boot looks like it was easy to find with the lower cowl on. On the two I did, one might not have noticed the the boot with the cowl still installed.

[Guest]

That falls under gross negligence.  I would take it back and ask the shop manager to come along for a flight with you.  If he hesitates ask him to re do the annual until he would be willing to go.

Clarence

[tigers2007]

I would like you to post the name of the shop and/or the name of the A&P that signed off on this. Something so simple like this to be overlooked is an indicator of something worse. Does this guy do field overhauls too?

Just take a photo of the annual logbook notation and post it here.

[MyNameIsNobody]

1 hour ago, tigers2007 said:

I would like you to post the name of the shop and/or the name of the A&P that signed off on this. Something so simple like this to be overlooked is an indicator of something worse. Does this guy do field overhauls too?

Just take a photo of the annual logbook notation and post it here.

Me too.  I have never understood the reluctance to do so.  It is an example of their work.  If others know they will either improve or they will go out of business.  Not all misses are created equal.  This is a major fail by NOT just the mechanic, but the individual that oversees the work and signs the logbook.  Glad you caught it and “made her right”.  Nice job.

[DXB]

9 hours ago, MIm20c said:

It’s a pain to take off the lower cowling but my guess is they failed to do that the past couple of times. 

Is it necessary to drop the bottom cowl for an annual?  Doing so is certainly a pain on a C model.  I would only want it done if necessary for another reason. I imagine the bottom of that boot can be adequately inspected by one's hand and/or maybe a mirror?  I can't say I've tried but will now give it a shot next time I open then cowl based on this thread. Then again, the OP says he could see light across the boot with just the side cheeks off, so really there's no excuse at all for the shop.  

I think stuff like this is why I like doing my own oil changes  and cleaning/gapping my own plugs - not because I need to save a few bucks but it serves as an opportunity to give everything under the cowl a close look every few months.  

[MIm20c]

1 minute ago, DXB said:

Is it necessary to drop the bottom cowl for an annual?  Doing so is certainly a pain on a C model.  I would only want it done if necessary for another reason. I imagine the bottom of that boot can be adequately inspected by one's hand and/or maybe a mirror?  I can't say I've tried but will now give it a shot next time I open then cowl based on this thread. Then again, the OP says he could see light across the boot with just the side cheeks off, so really there's no excuse at all for the shop.  

I think stuff like this is why I like doing my own oil changes  and cleaning/gapping my own plugs - not because I need to save a few bucks but it serves as an opportunity to give everything under the cowl a close look every few months.  

For my plane I do feel it’s necessary. It would be impossible to check the heat exchanger portion of the exhaust without doing so.  It also helped to identify a broken oil cooler flange last year.  Overall it adds about 2 hours to the annual and well worth it in my case. 

[DXB]

37 minutes ago, MIm20c said:

For my plane I do feel it’s necessary. It would be impossible to check the heat exchanger portion of the exhaust without doing so.  It also helped to identify a broken oil cooler flange last year.  Overall it adds about 2 hours to the annual and well worth it in my case. 

I see your point - the exhaust is critical.  I think it's standard to pull the exchanger shroud, which I think can be done without dropping the bottom cowl? However, I've never considered if there's adequate clearance to then examine the muffler adequately. I'll look into this further. 

[tigers2007]

Seems like complacent A&P’s (or their poorly-supervised trainees) give birth to hangar fairies. Almost makes me want to be an A&P.


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[MIm20c]

3 minutes ago, tigers2007 said:

Seems like complacent A&P’s (or their poorly-supervised trainees) give birth to hangar fairies. Almost makes me want to be an A&P.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Just become an internet A&P like the rest of us. Alan recently nominated me to the position of chief aircraft appraiser and supervisor so anything can happen. 

[Guest]

I personally remove the lower cowl at annual inspection, its part of doing an engine inspection.  That being said, if one simply opened their eyes while the air filter was off they should have spotted this.  Its not even a matter of Mooney knowledge.

Clarence

[madjano]

3 hours ago, DXB said:

I see your point - the exhaust is critical.  I think it's standard to pull the exchanger shroud, which I think can be done without dropping the bottom cowl? However, I've never considered if there's adequate clearance to then examine the muffler adequately. I'll look into this further. 

I've replaced the entire exhaust without pulling the entire bottom cowl.  You can get the shroud off too.  I got the scars to prove it.