RV-8 PIREP

[Joe Zuffoletto]

After posting my Cirrus PIREP,  a couple MS members asked me to provide a PIREP for the RV-8, which I'm more than happy to do. I hope the MS moderators will indulge my posting of this topic, which is decidedly non-Mooney.

I've been flying turbo Mooneys for almost 20 years. I owned an M20K Encore from 2000 until 2011, and I traded it for my Acclaim that year, and I've been flying the Acclaim ever since. I absolutely love it, but these planes are meant to be flown long distances high and fast on autopilot, and I was yearning for something that I could hand fly on Saturday mornings for a couple of hours or so, low and fast.

I discovered RVs quite by accident. The fellow I bought my Acclaim from had an RV-8 and he took me up in it. I had never heard of them before, but I was hooked. I resolved to buy one someday.

Two years later I did. I didn't build my RV; I bought it from the gentleman who did. He did a professional builder assist and spared no expense. He sold me an exceptional airplane.

RVs spoke to me for many of the same reasons Mooneys did. They are stone simple and very well engineered. The ailerons and elevator employ push rods. The rudder is driven by cables. Control feel in pitch, bank and yaw is solid and very responsive. Not to mention reliable.

My RV-8 is a taildragger. I didn't even have a tailwheel endorsement when I bought it, but I got that done and solved that problem.

On to the PIREP.

My RV-8 is a joy to fly. It is small, light, overpowered, and simply a blast.

It has the Lycoming O-360 A1A engine (180 hp), and a constant speed prop. Empty weight is 1,165 lbs. Very light. My first airplane was a 1980 Piper Archer II with pretty much the same engine, and it weighed more than twice as much.

BOARDING

You, and maybe your passenger, climb up on the wing, then lower yourselves into the seats. And then you fasten your five-point Hooker harnesses. You pretty much strap the airplane on.

TAXIING

It's a taildragger, so you have to be quick on your feet, especially in gusty conditions. But it doesn't take long to master. Its ground handling characteristics are very docile.

TAKEOFF

Line up, put the stick in neutral position, and give her the guns. After about 600 feet or so the tail will rise, and the plane will fly very soon after that. 

CLIMBOUT

Full throttle, pull the stick full aft, and it climbs like a bat out of hell. 1,500fpm at Denver Centennial, 5,800' MSL.

CRUISE

My plane has elevator and aileron trim. Doesn't take much to trim the airplane. Mine flies straight and, true.

AUTOPILOT

It has one, but I never use it. Too much fun to hand fly.

FLYING

What I love about the RV is that it's a very light touch aircraft. I put my thumb and two fingers on the stick and that's all it needs. Think about where you want to go, move the stick gently in that direction, and off you go.

I love the bubble canopy. Visibility is amazing.

AEROBATICS

I've not done any except for aileron rolls (very easy), because I haven't gotten around to have training yet. My RV doesn't have an inverted oil system, so if and when I learn aerobatics I can only do positive-G maneuvers.

LANDING

Most RV-8 pilots will tell you that wheel landings are the way to go, especially on pavement. I agree, and that's the only way I land mine. Wheel landings in this airplane are very easy if you've had the proper instruction. Nothing more satisfying than pulling one off perfectly, which isn't hard to do after a little bit of practice.

Three-pointers are difficult on pavement because the flaps block airflow to the elevators, which stalls the tailwheel and leads to a hobby horse landing. I've heard that it's no problem on grass, but I've never tried that.

CONCLUSION

The RV-8 is an amazing airplane, one that all Mooney pilots would love. Great looks, great flying, great engineering. I feel very fortunate to have one.

Cheers,

JZ

 

 

[MB65E]

Nice! Your -8 looks well planned and thought out. 

How was the pitch? Did the ailerons match the pitch authority. 

I’d like to finish one one day!! 

Wouldnt mind a t-18 or RV4 either!!

-Matt

[Joe Zuffoletto]

Pitch is strong. It does whatever you want it to do. 

The ailerons are VERY responsive  

I’ve never flown a -4, but I imagine they are also fun!

[carusoam]

I could see this Pirep coming... 

The  Cirrus one is pretty easy to take in, then leave... I already have the best plane for that mission...

But a two seater, a huge power to weight ratio, and with a bubble canopy.... that thought is going to be with me for a while...

Side thought... do you know what company built the canopy for your RV8? we had an MSer that built canopies. Unfortunately, we lost @Canopyman a while ago...

Thanks for sharing the details, Joe.

Now where’s that turbine plastic plane today... Florida or Michigan?

Its getting harder to maintain my focus. 

Best regards,

-a-

 

[Joe Zuffoletto]

Anthony,

No turbines in my future. I’ll retire from flying a piston guy. Don’t have the money or the mission for a turbine. 

JZ

[Guest]

I own an RV4 as well as the Comanche and it is a blast to fly.  The RV 8 is a pumped up version of the 4, expanded for what Van called the “bubba factor”.

They are a delight to fly as Joe reports, light and nimble, great on grass and short strips. Down at lower elevations and solo mine will fly in 3-400 feet.  I land mine in the 3 point attitude for shorter slower touch downs.

If you’re looking for a second fun plane RV4’s and RV6’s are older versions and generally cheaper.

Clarence

[steingar]

I've flown in two RV's.  I'd be flying one now except Mrs. Steingar doesn't like the canopy and needs someplace to put all her shit.  They're truly awesome airplanes, though I'd not want ot be doing an IFR approach to minimums in one, unless I had one hell of an autopilot.  Nothing better for the mission of getting out and having some fun.

[Johnnybgoode]

1 hour ago, steingar said:

I've flown in two RV's.  I'd be flying one now except Mrs. Steingar doesn't like the canopy and needs someplace to put all her shit.  They're truly awesome airplanes, though I'd not want ot be doing an IFR approach to minimums in one, unless I had one hell of an autopilot.  Nothing better for the mission of getting out and having some fun.

Is she always with you? There's your mission - fun solo VFR flying!

I also fly a -4.

Patrick

Edited March 20, 2018 by Johnnybgoode

[1964-M20E]

In the early 80s i read a flying magazine article on the RV-6 and fell in love.  I've always wanted to build one but never seem to have he time. I did get a chance to fly an RV-6 before I bought my current Mooney.

Glad you like the Rv8.

 

 

[jaylw314]

10 hours ago, carusoam said:

Side thought... do you know what company built the canopy for your RV8?

Van's provides the canopy with the kit, although I'm not sure if they make it in house or if use an outside manufacturer.  I got a tour of the Van's factory when I started on my RV-10, and they have a pretty big operation, so I wouldn't be surprised if they do make it in house

[WilliamR]

I can certainly attest to the hobby horse ride you get from trying a 3-point cement runway landing.  Not fun.  Unfortunately, I didn't know any better at the time and the "check pilot" was more clueless than me.

To the OP; surprised you didn't mention aileron buffet in the roll.  Does yours not do that?  I've rolled a couple of 8a's that had a pretty good buffet when rolling somewhat aggressively. 

Oh, and that's a terrific looking 4 above.  I wonder how rudder authority is.  I found the 6 with a similar tail setup heavy and a little lacking.  Maybe, because the 6 is wider obviously than the 4.  The 7 (same fuselage as the 6) I've flown had better rudder authority given it's larger size and was lighter.

I think the 8 is the best compromise of traveling machine and "gentleman's aerobatics" plane. 

William

[Joe Zuffoletto]

11 hours ago, carusoam said:

Side thought... do you know what company built the canopy for your RV8? we had an MSer that built canopies. Unfortunately, we lost @Canopyman a while ago...

Mine is a Todd's canopy, and Todd passed a couple years ago, so I'm sure it's the same person.

[Joe Zuffoletto]

32 minutes ago, WilliamR said:

To the OP; surprised you didn't mention aileron buffet in the roll.  Does yours not do that?  I've rolled a couple of 8a's that had a pretty good buffet when rolling somewhat aggressively.

I've done a lot of rolling around and I've not noticed the buffet you mention.

[carusoam]

Sorry for the distraction to this fine thread....

 

Yep,

Todd is our Canopyman.

Like a few other MSers... Todd reminds us to know our minimum altitude to make the power-off turn back to the airport...

land straight ahead.  Resist the impossible turn....

RIP Todd,

-a-

 

[thinwing]

Thanks for the Pirep...I think a good Topic section for MS would be flying reports of other aircraft besides Mooneys...a lot of us have or used to own other makes and models..my own list is Stinson,Maule,Lake,Baron,Bell 47,Husky,Pitts S1S...what say we start a regular feature of flight reports like Joe has done?

[steingar]

3 hours ago, Johnnybgoode said:

Is she always with you? There's your mission - fun solo VFR flying!

I also fly a -4.

Patrick

That is one gorgeous airplane.  Might buy one some day.  I do like flying solo.  Might get an RV-3.  I've always wanted a one seater.

[bradp]

My hangar neighbor has some Jurassic Park mutated Dino DNA version of an RV. Definitely a race  plane (? Clipped wing RV-4 with 300 HP 6-c continental).  Not quite an F1 and not quite a Harmon rocket.   Something in its own world. That thing is a beast.  

[DaV8or]

I have been thinking seriously about trading my Mooney for a Vans RV-9/A. It better fits my mission which is mostly me flying around by myself in good weather with no particular place I need to go. I think it would save me a bit of money in fuel burn, replacement parts and upgrades and it would be newer with not so much history, mechanics, repairs, annuals and the like on it. 

My ideal Vans would be the 9/A with an IO-320, CS prop and either a tip up, or slider, I haven't decided. It would also have to have a nice, standard layout panel with at least two axis auto pilot, dual coms, WAAS GPS, engine monitoring and a good audio panel. ADS-B in and out and a 406 ELT would be great too. Unfortunately there are four serious things preventing me from pursuing this plan. In order of seriousness-

1. Safety. I like the 9 because it has the lowest stall speed and that means the slowest touch down in an off field landing scenario, but it seems that if you land a Vans on anything that isn't hard and prepared, you end up upside down, hanging from your harness and most times trapped by a stuck canopy. Ditching a Vans in water sounds like suicide, or at least very, very slim chances of a good outcome. I feel much more confident in the Mooney's ability to land off field and in water. I also feel very confident of the Mooney's strength in the airframe. I'm not so sure about the Vans.
2. The wife. I mentioned in passing that I was thinking of trading the Mooney and she was ho-hum about that... until I told her I was thinking of an experimental! She was pretty strongly against that idea! It will take a lot of convincing that it is just as safe and I first have to convince myself.
3. The wife. The cabin in the Mooney is tight, but I think the Vans cabin is even tighter. It feels very narrow to me. As we get older, neither of us is getting any skinnier. There is also poor baggage area access, or capacity. While it has only occurred three or four times in the last seven years, it would be nice to keep the ability to take the wife along for a weekend. I'm not so sure how well the Vans can handle this job.
4. Money. I don't think I can get anywhere near enough money for my Mooney to get a nice clean, well built RV-9 configured the way I want it and then do all the things that will need to be done to make it mine. I will have to sell my Mooney and then likely pony up even more money. While I have the money and could do this, right now is not a financially great time for me to do it.

What do you guys think? Maybe this is thread hijacking? I can make my own thread if it's annoying here.

[gsxrpilot]

My wife has been to Oshkosh one time and she was very impressed by all the RV's on the field. I always wanted an RV 6 or 7. Of course she decided she really liked the RV10's. 

I scored quite a few brownie points when she learned that the reason we have a Mooney rather than an RV7 is because we need space for her dog.  Without the dog, I'd be flying an RV.

The RV10 would allow for the dog, but it's a bit more expensive than my 252 and it has fixed tricycle gear. That's the deal breaker for me. I'll only own a retract or tailwheel.

BTW... the only RV I've ever flown was an RV9A. A very nice airplane, but if I had one it would have to be fully aerobatic so a 6 or 7. The 8 is appealing but I love taking friends flying and side by side seems just so much more fun than tandem.

[Joe Zuffoletto]

37 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

The 8 is appealing but I love taking friends flying and side by side seems just so much more fun than tandem.

Don't buy an 8 if you want to fly passengers. The back seat is very cramped. I only bought mine because I knew I would be flying it solo.

[Joe Zuffoletto]

10 hours ago, thinwing said:

Thanks for the Pirep...I think a good Topic section for MS would be flying reports of other aircraft besides Mooneys...a lot of us have or used to own other makes and models..my own list is Stinson,Maule,Lake,Baron,Bell 47,Husky,Pitts S1S...what say we start a regular feature of flight reports like Joe has done?

I love this idea!

[Johnnybgoode]

5 hours ago, Joe Zuffoletto said:

Don't buy an 8 if you want to fly passengers. The back seat is very cramped. I only bought mine because I knew I would be flying it solo.

Or a -4. Back seats are good for children and small wives/girlfriends (please don't try to have both or the wife will surely have someone else flying it around for her)

[Guest]

The back seat of a 4 or 8 are snug but not impossible.  I’m 6’2” and 200 lbs. I learned to fly mine from the back seat before transitioning to the front.

Clarence

[Johnnybgoode]

10 hours ago, M20Doc said:

The back seat of a 4 or 8 are snug but not impossible.  I’m 6’2” and 200 lbs. I learned to fly mine from the back seat before transitioning to the front.

Clarence

There are some variables also. My -4 was built for a taller front seater by sliding the seatback aft an inch or two before fastening in place. Clarence, do you have a -4 or an -8? I've been in the back of a couple of different -8's and they are definitely more roomy back there than my -4.

Patrick

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Johnnybgoode said:

There are some variables also. My -4 was built for a taller front seater by sliding the seatback aft an inch or two before fastening in place. Clarence, do you have a -4 or an -8? I've been in the back of a couple of different -8's and they are definitely more roomy back there than my -4.

Patrick

Patrick,

I own an RV4, I too moved the pilot’s seat back one inch for my longer legs, but have flown from both seats.

Clarence