Autopilot avionics update.

[tigers2007]

Will this King/Sandia EFIS drive the Century IIB thus allowing complete removal of the old RC Allen AI? My holdback right now is the G5 being unable to do this. I can live with retaining a vacuum DG but installing a G5 and being forced to keep the old RC Allen AI is nonsense. The Century works great and I don’t see a need to replace it.


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[Bob - S50]

I don't think very many (if any) of us plan to pull a fully functional autopilot to replace it with something new.  However, with my KFC200, there are SO many parts that are getting old and expensive to repair.  KI256 ($1800), KI525 ($1750), KG102 ($1550), KC295 ($2150), servos (not in stock and no price listed - prices from the Southeast Aerospace website) and a few other components that are not likely to fail.  At some point it's time to cut my losses.  How much and how many times am I willing to take the plane down and pay to have those old components repaired?  And that's for a system that does not have GPSS or altitude capture let alone not being all that great at flying an approach.

As for the "new" autopilots being new.  TruTrak, Trio, and Dynon have been making systems for experimental aircraft for years.  Those good folks have been testing the systems and finding the bugs for us.  There is nothing magical about a certified airplane.  It obeys the same laws of physics as experimental aircraft.

Once I have other options, and parts start failing on my plane, I'll consider replacing the entire system and sell off the usable parts to those of you who don't want to trust the new systems.

As for the KI300, I don't think I'd ever get one of those.  They will cost half the price of an entire new autopilot.  If I buy one because my KI256 quits, I'm still stuck with all those other old parts.  And when they fail, what am I supposed to do with that $6500 part?  If my KI256 dies, I think I might be inclined to replace it with either a Garmin G5 or a Dynon D10A and live without an autopilot while I wait for one of the new breed to be approved for my Mooney.  If I'm leaning toward the GFC500 I'll get the G5 since I'd need it anyway.  If I'm leaning toward the Dynon, I'd get the D10A since I'd need it anyway.  I'd simply be buying one of the components that would be required for the new system I'd eventually (hopefully) get.

[PTK]

On 2/25/2018 at 8:06 PM, jetdriven said:

IF that 12,000$ pitch board goes bad you may be in the market sooner than later. But I wouldn’t rip out a functioning autopilot now for sure.

If you’re referring to the altitude transducer, as I think you are, it’s an expensive proposition and a lot more a potential issue...for the 200, not the 150. No where near. Reason is the way the alt transducer couples to the static system in the 150 is different from the 200. I bet you the beers this can be confirmed with autopilot repair shops if you ask them when was the last time they saw a 150 alt transducer go bad. The answer may be next to never!

The 150 is a very capable, solid and proven autopilot. With the exception of giving it digital attitude reference by removing it’s vacuum dependancy there is nothing else pressing that can improve on it. 

[aviatoreb]

Looks like Dynon HDX is now certified for the C172.  This is a major milestone for GA.  How long until it comes to the M20?  And how much.

I am trying to find what their actual installed costs will be even for the C172 if it is now available - where it is done. For me I will either be going Dynon HDX or GFC500 depending on when, how much actual, and so forth.  I like different features of each, and price is a factor.

 

Got this in the email today.

DYNON CERTIFIED UPDATE
SkyView HDX is now STC Approved!
We're excited to share that we've just received our first Supplemental Type Certificate (STC) for our flagship SkyView HDX system. The STC’s Approved Model List (AML), which initially covers many Cessna 172 models, ushers in a new era of truly affordable, safety-enhancing integrated avionics systems for type certificated aircraft.

The initial STC is for the installation of a full suite of Dynon avionics, allowing pilots to remove the vast majority of their legacy instrumentation, including their vacuum pump. The SkyView HDX system provides complete primary flight instrumentation, including synthetic vision and angle of attack, and complete engine monitoring with CHTs, EGTs, fuel flow, fuel computer, and lean assist. Also approved is Dynon’s fully-integrated two axis autopilot, which features IFR approach capability when SkyView is integrated with a compatible navigator. The approved installation also includes a Mode S Transponder with 2020-compliant ADS-B Out, Navigation and Mapping with Flight Planning ADS-B Traffic and Weather display, and Electronic Flight Bag features. Backup primary flight instruments are provided by a Dynon EFIS-D10A.

Approved Model List

The initial Approved Model List (AML) covers Cessna 172F, 172G, 172H, 172I, 172K, 172L, 172M, 172N, 172P, 172Q, 172R, and 172S models. Approval does not restrict the operational use of the aircraft, and allows for flight in both IFR and VFR. Dynon will be seeking additional approvals for both single and twin-engine aircraft in the coming months.

Pricing and Availability

Pricing for the certified/PMA versions of approved Dynon products will be the same as existing experimental/light sport products. The STC for Cessna 172 aircraft is priced at $2,000. The first installations will be available in the coming weeks via US Sport Aircraft + Thrust Flight in Texas, Merrill Field Instruments in Alaska, and a Dynon-affiliated facility in the Pacific Northwest.
Additional Information

For more information about Dynon Certified and our SkyView HDX system, visit our website at www.dynon.aero/certified.

[KSMooniac]

Hopefully expanding the AML goes quickly and smoothly. And hopefully Mooney is near the front of the pack...

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[NJMac]

Hopefully expanding the AML goes quickly and smoothly. And hopefully Mooney is near the front of the pack...

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I just posted on their facebook congrating them and bugging them for our mooneys. Maybe we can show force on the social media and get to the top of their attention?

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[anonymouse]

Dynon got their 172 STC approved today. Very exciting news, and with luck they will be able to quickly expand it to our birds now that they have their foot in the door.

[aviatoreb]

Anyone any idea what the installed cost will be - at least for the C172 that is now available (so we can then try and backward engineer what it might be for a Mooney).  There should be specific true installed numbers available now for C172?

[MIm20c]

12 minutes ago, aviatoreb said:

Anyone any idea what the installed cost will be - at least for the C172 that is now available (so we can then try and backward engineer what it might be for a Mooney).  There should be specific true installed numbers available now for C172?

Call up us sport aircraft and get a written quote for a full install on a 172m. My guess is 50 percent parts 50 percent labor including a new panel. Add on a waas gps if not already installed.  Still a lot cheaper for the full blown system it is but not ideal if you already have a nice engine monitor, AP, and adsb out. 

[anonymouse]

Here is availability info straight from an email I sent to Dynon:

"No one here at Dynon has any guess as to when the Mooneys will happen. We will not start selling the STC for the 172 until the 2nd QTR. After our dedicated shops provide feedback on the installations, and we learn how to make their lives easier, we can then start tackling other makes and models. Conservatively, it could be anywhere between 6-18 months after we start selling the 172 STC. "

[mike_elliott]

21 hours ago, anonymouse said:

Conservatively, it could be anywhere between 6-18 months after we start selling the 172 STC. "

It will still be years ahead of the KI300

[thinwing]

On 2/26/2018 at 7:38 AM, PTK said:

If you’re referring to the altitude transducer, as I think you are, it’s an expensive proposition and a lot more a potential issue...for the 200, not the 150. No where near. Reason is the way the alt transducer couples to the static system in the 150 is different from the 200. I bet you the beers this can be confirmed with autopilot repair shops if you ask them when was the last time they saw a 150 alt transducer go bad. The answer may be next to never!

The 150 is a very capable, solid and proven autopilot. With the exception of giving it digital attitude reference by removing it’s vacuum dependancy there is nothing else pressing that can improve on it. 

Well actually there is..kfd 225 ,first truely digital offering and still in production by BK.Of course it's 20 years old also ,but well tested and offers roll steering,altitude select,vertical speed select and is truely attitude based.The best autopilot I've ever flown with!!Unfortunately it's servos do not use brushless "stepper" moters rthat provide there own motion,rate,direction and force feedback.They use little moters wired in reverse to provide square wave feedback and strain gauges for heavens sake!That being said...a well tuned kfd225 flying a GPS sourced DME ARC is a thing of beauty!