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LOP video


Bob_Belville

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1) Greatest part of this video...

  • Facts per minute.  
  • Martin really delivers.
  • Very dense, complete, nugget rich video.
  • Be ready to pay attention, to avoid skipping or rewinding.

2) Second Best part of this video...

  • Graphical explanation of the topics being discussed...
  • Martin has some strong video skills...
  • The video is well organized from step1 to stepN...

3) Most unique mixture knob scene...

  • Mixture knob moving out on its own.
  • Some camera trickery?
  • Or is that one those fancy auto mixture things...

4) Some distractions...

  • It isn’t a Mooney instrument panel
  • some gauges and knobs are different, taking extra, important seconds, to take in.

5) Not really covered...  NA Mooney topics...

  • Target EGT for Best power at high DA airports...
  • ROP climb, very rich, but not too rich... blue box technique.
  • JPI, two button push, to flip from leaning ROP to LOP...
  • Carbureted challenges. They get a mention and a hint. Would need a good M20C for a good follow up.
  • Left out the words Big Pull when describing moving to LOP quickly based on prior experience and knowledge of FF data.

6) If you are new to LOP...

  • Take your time absorbing what this video has to offer.
  • The benefits are real.  Lower temps, lower peak pressures, higher efficiency.
  • The cost savings are real.
  • Avoiding the red box is important, and isn't hard.
  • Once you know your plane, the big pull is pretty quick, and painless.

7) I am a fan of getting all cylinders LOP, barely...

  • Maximum conversion of fuel to Ground Speed, at altitude, where %bhp is below 65% already.
  • Essentialy Running at peak EGT.
  • oil cleanliness is also a positive by-product Of LOP.

 

Note to @takair A great follow-up to this video would be a shorter part two: Safe LOP at the touch of a button...  :)

Best regards,

-a-

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Martin Pauly flies his Bonanza into very large commercial airports, DFW, ATL, Kennedy, O'Hare etc....  If you want to see what it is like to fly a small GA airplane into a major international airport, check out his other videos as well.  They are very well done.

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Come on though he starts out the video saying it was for Beech fans......:) I gave him a hard time about that on his YouTube channel and asked him if I could watch it if I was a Mooney owner.

I’ve watched all of his videos and has helped me a lot with my instrument training. Nice guy. Today I went up and did some Beta testing with a new carbon monoxide tester and put his instructions to use.

I use Savvy and know my #2 cylinder is always my coldest one and will be the last one to peak. That made the testing much easier and faster. I didn’t have to set up the edm in Lean Find mode.

I have a 77’ J with the quadrant. I’ve read it’s very hard to tune it to lop with the levers. So I’ve never really tried it. I normally watch my cht‘s on my JPI830 keeping them below 380. And figure it’s about 50 degrees ROP.

Spending the time this afternoon I was able to pull my plane back to about 50 degrees lop and it was still running really well. In the hour long flight I was able to run there at anytime I wanted. but I mainly let it run at 25 degrees lop. Cht’s were really low at that setting. Is there any harm in running it at 50 lop, or should it be around 25 like Martin described?

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There is nothing wrong with running as far LOP as you like. If your engine runs smooth, you can pull it back as far as you like. At some point it will just die as there just isn't enough fuel. Of course, HP drops off quickly once LOP. So 50 LOP will be pretty low HP. The recommendation for 25 LOP is that it's a good cross between power and fuel burn. But nothing on the LOP side will hurt your engine, so lean away.

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There is nothing wrong with running as far LOP as you like. If your engine runs smooth, you can pull it back as far as you like. At some point it will just die as there just isn't enough fuel. Of course, HP drops off quickly once LOP. So 50 LOP will be pretty low HP. The recommendation for 25 LOP is that it's a good cross between power and fuel burn. But nothing on the LOP side will hurt your engine, so lean away.

Unless, your fuel flow isn’t balanced, so you have a cylinder(s) that are running peak and you are over 65% HP. Search for previous discussions about red box/fin. I think those with 25° timing can run very lean, I lost the ability to run way lean after having my mags retimed.
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1 minute ago, NJMac said:

How critical are GAMI injectors to running LOP?

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Gami's aren't but a gami spread of 0.5 GPH or less is! But if your OEM injectors don't provide you with 0.5 GPH or better spread, then GAMI's are your solution. Don't know what you fly, but most Lyc io-360's don't need them but many to most Continentals do. Measure your gami spread and go from there. See this for more on what it is  https://www.savvyanalysis.com/articles/in-flight-diagnostics and this for how to collect the data http://content.savvyanalysis.com/static/pdf/SavvyAnalysisFlightTestProfiles.pdf 

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On ‎2‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 8:27 PM, gsxrpilot said:

There is nothing wrong with running as far LOP as you like. If your engine runs smooth, you can pull it back as far as you like. At some point it will just die as there just isn't enough fuel. Of course, HP drops off quickly once LOP. So 50 LOP will be pretty low HP. The recommendation for 25 LOP is that it's a good cross between power and fuel burn. But nothing on the LOP side will hurt your engine, so lean away.

There is a problem running far LOP which is kind of unrelated.  If you're ignition system is not up to snuff, you can run lean enough that one of the spark plug fails to ignite the mixture in one or more cylinders.  You'll see this as a double-peak, where your EGT starts dropping as you lean, then starts rising again.  Since a weak spark might ignite the mixture some of the time (instead of none of the time like shutting off a mag), it can fool you into thinking you're still ROP, and you end up leaning the mixture further and further, while the EGT refuses to drop down.  This happens, unfortunately, to my richest cylinder, which is the one I have selected on my EDM-711

While not a major safety issue, it can give you confusing readings and cause you to run much farther LOP than you were planning, which means less power and rough running.  I've sometimes thought I was maybe 10deg LOP until I notice the fuel flow looks funny. 

 

5 minutes ago, NJMac said:

How critical are GAMI injectors to running LOP?

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+1 to @kortopates post above.  Of course, my GAMI spread is exactly 0.6 gph

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Is anyone able to successfully run LOP with a carb'd engine?

Definitely yes but it's pretty rare and from what I see, pretty limited to lower power settings like in the 60-65% and less range. The experimental guys do better since they have better options such as the cloned Ellison throttle bodies which are almost like fuel injection. But there are some tricks we find that help carbureted aircraft fly LOP by improving mixture distribution. Such as with a touch of carb heat and/or just a slight reduction in the throttle - not to really reduce MAP but to cause some added turbulence in throat to improve mixture distribution. Of course the problem is that the typical carbureted engine has a gami spread of 1.0 to 1.8 which kills running LOP. But with some experimenting you might find the sweet spot to make it work at lower power settings where you don't need to be very LOP at all.

 

 

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I used to get my M20C to run LOP about half the time. It always required cocking the throttle, (pull the throttle back but not enough to move the MP needle more than a needle width). I would only do this when above 8000 ft or so. So I was pretty low power already but at the cost of just a few knots, I could get fuel flows down to 6.5 GPH. And at that burn, 52 gal will let you fly for a long time.

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