Monroy tanks

[peevee]

So, we've been wondering...

 

How exactly did monroy get his tanks approved?

 

91.205 says you have to have a fuel gauge. The old wives tale is that they have to be accurate when empty and full, which the monroy tanks aren't.

 

However: how do they comply with 23.1337 exactly?

http://www.aviationlawmonitor.com/2011/06/articles/general-aviation/aircraft-fuel-gauges-are-supposed-to-actually-work/

 

§ 23.1337 Powerplant instruments installation.

     Fuel quantity indication. There must be a means to indicate to the flightcrew members the quantity of usable fuel in each tank during flight. An indicator calibrated in appropriate units and clearly marked to indicate those units must be used. In addition: [] Each fuel quantity indicator must be calibrated to read "zero" during level flight when the quantity of fuel remaining in the tank is equal to the unusable fuel supply. . . 

[carusoam]

@Piloto, can you help my friend..? ^^^. 

José knows a thing or two about these Monroy Tanks...

The OWT called for accuracy when the tanks were empty.

But realistically, that was an OWT...

Best regards,

-a-

[Piloto]

Unlike other planes with separate extended tanks the Monroy long range tanks are an extension of the main tanks. There is no separate valves or pumps to operate the long range tanks. The tanks feed by gravity continuously the main tanks. Thus the fuel indicated by the mains gauges is a combination of the mains and extended tanks fuel quantity. The FMS indicates how  to determine the total fuel onboard before flight and inflight. Digital Fuel Totalizers provides an accurate mean for determining total fuel onboard.

José Monroy

[Danb]

Jose arguably the best investment I've made to the Bravo, had them installed during my first yr of ownership, they've paid for themselves more than once..

[peevee]

1 hour ago, Danb said:

Jose arguably the best investment I've made to the Bravo, had them installed during my first yr of ownership, they've paid for themselves more than once..

It doesn't bother you that above about 20 gallons a side you have no earthly idea how much fuel you have unless you have made a calibrated dip stick?

[steingar]

41 minutes ago, peevee said:

It doesn't bother you that above about 20 gallons a side you have no earthly idea how much fuel you have unless you have made a calibrated dip stick?

I honestly don’t mean to be snarky, but making one of those things isn’t what my ignorant ham-handed self would call difficult.

[LANCECASPER]

2 hours ago, Danb said:

Jose arguably the best investment I've made to the Bravo, had them installed during my first yr of ownership, they've paid for themselves more than once..

I bought a Bravo in 1996 and in the fall of 1997 I flew the airplane to Fort Lauderdale. Jose flew me back to Orlando where I had to be and a week later I picked up the airplane. For the money, long range Monroy tanks are the best upgrade for a Mooney, period. It's the difference between nonstop and a fuel stop on long cross country flights. Someone will probably chime in with useful load, etc - but most long trips are made with one or two people. I have owned three Mooneys with Monroy tanks. In practical terms if you've had Monroy long range tanks on a Mooney, you will never want another Mooney without them. As far as knowing your fuel quantity, after I top off my tanks, I set the fuel totalizer to full and throughout the flight I know exactly how much I've burned and how much is left.

The original gauges are placarded with the new calibrated readings as part of the STC.

 

[LANCECASPER]

8 hours ago, peevee said:

It doesn't bother you that above about 20 gallons a side you have no earthly idea how much fuel you have unless you have made a calibrated dip stick?

With factory gauges whether you have Monroy tanks or not you have no earthly idea how much fuel you have unless you use a stick or use the totalizer the way it's made to be used. Honestly though, the fuel above 20 gallons a tank is not what causes people to land with dry tanks, it's thinking that they know by the factory gauges how much fuel they have left when they get down to 10 or less gallons per tank that gets them in trouble.

[Piloto]

For full enjoyment of your long range trips get the pilot relief tube. No need to find a place or container to relief yourself. And for even greater enjoyment add a cup holder.

José

[peevee]

30 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

With factory gauges whether you have Monroy tanks or not you have no earthly idea how much fuel you have unless you use a stick or use the totalizer the way it's made to be used. Honestly though, the fuel over 20 gallons a tank is not what causes people to land with dry tanks, it's thinking that they know by the factory gauges how much fuel they have left when they get down to 10 or less gallons per tank that gets them in trouble.

I find the wing gauges to be reasonably accurate if not sticking 

Probably more accurate than the fill a little and wait and fill some more dance it takes to get the long range tanks filled up. There's a pretty solid 5 gallons you can leave behind if you're not careful.

[peevee]

1 hour ago, steingar said:

I honestly don’t mean to be snarky, but making one of those things isn’t what my ignorant ham-handed self would call difficult.

All you need is r2d2 to hop out there in flight and dip the tanks for you

[gsxrpilot]

So... I'm wondering what the whole point of this thread is?  You're not a Mooney owner much less a Mooney owner of a plane that's a candidate for @Piloto STC? So what's the point in the negativity on this upgrade?

[N6758N]

8 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

So... I'm wondering what the whole point of this thread is?  You're not a Mooney owner much less a Mooney owner of a plane that's a candidate for @Piloto STC? So what's the point in the negativity on this upgrade?

It's for when you buy a Cirrus and realize you have to make 3 times the amount of fuel stops to go the same distance you could go with your old Rocket with Monroy Tanks...

[peevee]

30 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

So... I'm wondering what the whole point of this thread is?  You're not a Mooney owner much less a Mooney owner of a plane that's a candidate for @Piloto STC? So what's the point in the negativity on this upgrade?

Except that I did own a Mooney (two, actually) and it did have the mad pisser's tanks. I just want to k ow how they satisfy the above reg. That's all. 

I know it's not a corroded out 50 year old plane but it'll have to do.

Plus it's fun to watch you guys bitch. You take yourselves way too seriously.

[peevee]

16 minutes ago, N6758N said:

It's for when you buy a Cirrus and realize you have to make 3 times the amount of fuel stops to go the same distance you could go with your old Rocket with Monroy Tanks...

Range is basically the same

Except it's actually comfortable for 4 to 5 hours.

[DonMuncy]

10 minutes ago, peevee said:

Range is basically the same

What are the numbers?

[peevee]

22 minutes ago, DonMuncy said:

What are the numbers?

Book max ifr range is 886 for the g3.

The rocket is a bit harder to figure. I could true about 186 at 15.5 gph at fl180 for economy but I wouldn't push it beyond 5 hours, personally. It held 108 max but I never figured I had more than 100. If I wanted to do better than 200 it needed nearly 20gph, I ran 1550tit, many would probably run 1600 and save a few pennies. Rocket suggests no higher than 1600 continuous but cmi says 1650, I'm betting if you could shave some more range off at the expense of maintenance cost. I think you could run lop at 1650 and save enough fuel to cover the cost of a turbo overhaul. Our plane with gamis was not a happy camper lop.

Useful load is within 50ish pounds but the g3 holds a little less gas, 92gal.

[Guest]

36 minutes ago, peevee said:

Except that I did own a Mooney (two, actually) and it did have the mad pisser's tanks. I just want to k ow how they satisfy the above reg. That's all. 

I know it's not a corroded out 50 year old plane but it'll have to do.

Plus it's fun to watch you guys bitch. You take yourselves way too seriously.

Standby, you'll soon be accused of being a troll, then you'll get an up grade to a few blocked lists.

Clarence

[peevee]

3 minutes ago, M20Doc said:

Standby, you'll soon be accused of being a troll, then you'll get an up grade to a few blocked lists.

Clarence

That's ok 

I think it's pretty funny when it gets personal because I went to a different brand airplane. 

I even like Comanches

Actually, I have a lot of piper time so they always feel like home.

 

Hey in another thread that I can't find you recommend a starter that doesn't eat up the adapter on the cirrus, which one was it again?

[DonMuncy]

Just now, peevee said:

Book max ifr range is 886 for the g3.

The rocket is a bit harder to figure. I could true about 186 at 15.5 gph at fl180 for economy but I wouldn't push it beyond 5 hours, personally. It held 108 max but I never figured I had more than 100. If I wanted to do better than 200 be it needed nearly 20gph

So the Rocket at 100 gal and 186kph is 6.45 hrs  or 5.7 with ifr reserve, or 1060. 

[Guest]

Just now, peevee said:

That's ok 

I think it's pretty funny when it gets personal because I went to a different brand airplane. 

I even like Comanches

Actually, I have a lot of piper time so they always feel like home.

The Cirrus is a fine airplane as well.  We take care of more than 30 of them, they keep my Comanche fuelled.

Clarence

[peevee]

Just now, DonMuncy said:

So the Rocket at 100 gal and 186kph is 6.45 hrs  or 5.7 with ifr reserve, or 1060. 

Ish, sure. It's a bit more of a sliding scale with the rocket.

Though with 2 people up front the rocket needs a lot of ballast to not go fwd cg. Like 100lbs. 

[jkhirsch]

30 minutes ago, peevee said:

Though with 2 people up front the rocket needs a lot of ballast to not go fwd cg. Like 100lbs. 

I fail to see a problem here...

 

 

Edited October 31, 2017 by jkhirsch

[MIm20c]

IMO comparing 92 gals to 130 gals and complaining that you cannot accurately measure the initial 20-30 percent is crazy. That added utility of 38 extra gallons on an airframe that is just as efficient is massive.  With 310 hp even if you mistakenly added a little too much fuel it will not be a problem unless you’re on fire.   Even 200 lbs over gross would probably takeoff and climb better than 80% of the non turbine aircraft out there. 

[Danb]

4 hours ago, peevee said:

It doesn't bother you that above about 20 gallons a side you have no earthly idea how much fuel you have unless you have made a calibrated dip stick?

Absolutely not., I don't even need fuel fuel gauges to know how much I have, used and have left. The next time in over 30 years I have to rely on the gauges will be the first. There is NO excuse for fuel exhaustion accidents.