steingar Posted October 6, 2017 Report Share Posted October 6, 2017 On 10/6/2017 at 11:18 AM, gsxrpilot said: Interesting... this seems like a lot of opportunity to lose track, mess up the sequence, mis-calculate, along with a lot of work on the tank selector. I'm carrying 35 gal per side and only ever switch tanks twice, if that much. I used to change tanks on my Cherokee every half hour, had a little timer to remind me. But I had fuel switch that I could operate without unbelting myself and giving myself a blow job. Now I burn for an hour on one side and lots more on the other. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob - S50 Posted October 6, 2017 Report Share Posted October 6, 2017 3 hours ago, gsxrpilot said: Interesting... this seems like a lot of opportunity to lose track, mess up the sequence, mis-calculate, along with a lot of work on the tank selector. I'm carrying 35 gal per side and only ever switch tanks twice, if that much. Pretty hard to mess it up with Cies floats and a digital fuel gauge though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder Posted October 6, 2017 Report Share Posted October 6, 2017 8 minutes ago, steingar said: I used to change tanks on my Cherokee every half hour, had a little timer to remind me. But I had full switch that I could operate without unbelting myself and giving myself a blow job. Now I burn for an hour on one said and lots more on the other. Ah, the infamous fuel switch BJ. Dr. Ron built me a fuel switcher gizmo out of PVC. Works great. I just want to know what ergonomic engineer came up with the selection of the location for the selector valve on these older Mooneys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted October 6, 2017 Report Share Posted October 6, 2017 2 minutes ago, Marauder said: Ah, the infamous fuel switch BJ. Dr. Ron built me a fuel switcher gizmo out of PVC. Works great. I just want to know what ergonomic engineer came up with the selection of the location for the selector valve on these older Mooneys. It is the simplest place to put it. Anywhere else will be more complex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder Posted October 6, 2017 Report Share Posted October 6, 2017 1 minute ago, N201MKTurbo said: It is the simplest place to put it. Anywhere else will be more complex. Well, they fixed it on the Js. Right smack between the seats. I'd pay for complex in this case. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted October 6, 2017 Report Share Posted October 6, 2017 Huh, I'm a tall skinny guy with long arms. I have no trouble seeing it or switching it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skates97 Posted October 6, 2017 Report Share Posted October 6, 2017 5 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said: Huh, I'm a tall skinny guy with long arms. I have no trouble seeing it or switching it. Only problem I have with the location is if it's the end of a long flight, I really need to use the restroom, and I have to reach down to switch it at the top of my descent... Maybe I need one of those relief tubes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted October 6, 2017 Report Share Posted October 6, 2017 Just get the 1 inch PVC tube with a notch cut it no bending over Required at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooney in Oz Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 Maybe it is in part reference to the following 'Warning' from the M20J POH, which I am sure is the same as the M20C POH: "Takeoff maneuvers, prolonged sideslips or steep descents when the selected fuel tank contains less than 8 gallons (48.0 lbs., 30.3 litres, 6.7 IMP. Gal.) of fuel have not been demonstrated and may cause loss of power" I couldn't figure out how to display the exact page, so I just typed the info as written. In the absence of a stall, low fuel below 8 gallons in the selected tank was found to be the most likely causal factor in a fatal Mooney accident in Western Australia some years ago when the pilot did a steep bank in the circuit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 If the steep bank is coordinated, then why would it matter to the fuel in the tank? What changes? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooney in Oz Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 5 minutes ago, jetdriven said: If the steep bank is coordinated, then why would it matter to the fuel in the tank? What changes? Good question Byron. An unqualified guess; maybe it has to do with possible unporting of fuel in the tank due to an uncoordinated steep bank and Mooney are simply catering to that scenario? However, the wording does not imply either coordinated or uncoordinated. I'm sure there a technical answer out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragedracer1977 Posted October 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 2 hours ago, Mooney in Oz said: Maybe it is in part reference to the following 'Warning' from the M20J POH, which I am sure is the same as the M20C POH: "Takeoff maneuvers, prolonged sideslips or steep descents when the selected fuel tank contains less than 8 gallons (48.0 lbs., 30.3 litres, 6.7 IMP. Gal.) of fuel have not been demonstrated and may cause loss of power" I couldn't figure out how to display the exact page, so I just typed the info as written. In the absence of a stall, low fuel below 8 gallons in the selected tank was found to be the most likely causal factor in a fatal Mooney accident in Western Australia some years ago when the pilot did a steep bank in the circuit. Seems kind of worrisome that they never tested whether or not it was safe to fly the plane with an hour of fuel remaining. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 There are two ways to unport the fuel from the pick-up... 1) lower the nose... (fuel runs forwards, away from the pick-up) 2) use uncoordinated flight... (fuel runs towards the wing tip, away from the pick-up) 3) If you can visualize where your fuel pick up is, you probably won't fall victim to unporting... 4) If you maintain coordinated flight, you probably won't fall victim to unporting... 4.1) If you can keep the fuel in the uphill wing while slipping, you probably won't fall victim to unporting... 5) If you want to test out your unporting flying skills, use minimum fuel on a post maintenance flight. When you point the Nose towards the numbers, it may get a little quieter....outside. Inside, it may get a little louder depending on who you brought with you and what you told them in advance... 6) roughly speaking.... a good side slip with a strongly lowered wing, will have the fuel running toward the wing tip. 7) if you are carrying minimum fuel, expect to have the fuel in the uphill wing... 8) you can either use g-forces or gravity to encourage fuel to leave the tank in an orderly fashion... 9) Keep the flight coordinated to use the g-forces in an expected way. Or keep the wing that is supplying fuel, above the fuel pick-up... 10) if flying around with eight gallons in one tank, you would have to try pretty hard to unport the fuel without knowing it. You have lowered the wing without intending to turn... 11) when planning a deep slip, make sure the fuel is being drawn from the uphill wing... 12) If the fuel isn't in the uphill wing... Crab and kick is going to be your friend... Just An ordinary PP's way of looking at this challenge... Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midlifeflyer Posted October 8, 2017 Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 On 10/5/2017 at 1:41 AM, Skates97 said: This is a great point. When I am switching tanks prior to landing I do it before beginning my descent. I was taught that you want to switch while flying straight and level so that's what I do. Maybe that's just an OWT, I I don't know. I've actually removed the fuel item from my before landing checklist and moved it back to descent. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragedracer1977 Posted October 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 2 hours ago, midlifeflyer said: I've actually removed the fuel item from my before landing checklist and moved it back to descent. I like that idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nels Posted October 8, 2017 Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 Is the pickup at the rear of the tank in all Mooneys?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 21 minutes ago, daver328 said: Anyone bought this? https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/mooney05-15255.php?clickkey=4574581 You can make one for $5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted October 10, 2017 Report Share Posted October 10, 2017 Or paint it and sell it $25! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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