jonhop Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Taking my wife home yesterday I received a traffic annunciation. "Traffic, 11 O'clock, same altitude, 1 mile." The traffic screen popped up on the 650 and the iPad. I looked outside the window and had to take immediate evasive action, so I entered a 60° degree left bank and pulled hard on the yoke. My wife screamed what did you do that for? Apparently she missed the traffic alert. I said I'll show you, as I wanted to get my eyes back on the other airplane that turned out to be another Mooney. Rolled back to 30° right where I saw it rolling back from a bank to the left. I don't know if the other Mooney had ADS-B in but I'm sure the other pilot saw my maneuver considering how close we were. When my wife saw the other Mooney, she was like "OH, that ADS-B in is awesome..." I have to say I am truly impressed with the GTX-345 and GTN-650.... The combo gave me time to "see and avoid" much better than the plain old two sets of eyeballs in the cockpit... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Nice Pirep, Jonh. 1) I noticed on today's flight, without a-out, i could see I was missing a huge part of the picture. 2) My usual flights around NJ, there is so much a-out by others, it is hard for targets to hide. 3) when targets saturate the screen, it would be nice to have their scale and color change based on significance... 4) Who wants to know where all the slow guys are 10,000' below me? 5) there are so many useless radar returns with complete information. So many returns, I can't see details on the chart.... 6) my nearest visitor today was an AWACS radar ship... I couldn't find him using my ADSB. ATC was giving me flight following. What part of your system generated the oral traffic alert? Best regards, -a- 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomR Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 (edited) ADS-B Traffic is amazingly valuable. I've had multiple occasions where it has alerted me to an impending near miss before it happened. Fortunatley, I have a gts-800 as well so can get notified of an aircraft on short final while I'm still on the ground. That's the one minor weakness still present in the ADS-B system. It doesn't provide consistent coverage low altitude around the airport environment. Arguably this is the most important place to have coverage. I wonder if in the future they'll start mounting small short range ADS-B Transceivers to airport beacons to alleviate this weakness. I'd imagine this won't be for quite some time if ever so I'll keep the GTS-800 for now Edited October 3, 2017 by TomR 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob - S50 Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 8 hours ago, carusoam said: 3) when targets saturate the screen, it would be nice to have their scale and color change based on significance... 4) Who wants to know where all the slow guys are 10,000' below me? 5) there are so many useless radar returns with complete information. So many returns, I can't see details on the chart.... 6) my nearest visitor today was an AWACS radar ship... I couldn't find him using my ADSB. ATC was giving me flight following. You can limit what traffic is displayed both in Garmin Pilot and on the GTNXXX. Here is the info from the Garmin Pilot (Android) app: Changing the altitude range: 1) On the Traffic Page, Tap Altitude Filter. 2) Tap one of the following options: • Unrestricted: All available traffic is displayed. • Above: Displays non-threat and proximity traffic from 9000 feet above the aircraft to 2700 feet below the aircraft. Typically used during climb phase of flight. • Normal: Displays non-threat and proximity traffic from 2700 feet above the aircraft to 2700 feet below the aircraft. Typically used during enroute phase of flight. • Below: Displays non-threat and proximity traffic from 2700 feet above the aircraft to 9000 feet below the aircraft. Typically used during descent phase of flight. So if you want to limit how much traffic you see, you could set it to Normal. In spite of how much we love our Mooney's, we just don't climb or descend fast enough that we need to see traffic more than 2700 feet above or below us. However, it is fun to see the airliners go by when we are out in the middle of nowhere at cruise altitude. Also, when there gets to be too much traffic on my screen, I reduce the range so I don't see anybody outside of 6 miles. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob - S50 Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 39 minutes ago, TomR said: ADS-B Traffic is amazingly valuable. I've had multiple occasions where it has alerted me to an impending near miss before it happened. Fortunatley, I have a gts-800 as well so can get notified of an aircraft on short final while I'm still on the ground. That's the one minor weakness still present in the ADS-B system. It doesn't provide consistent coverage low altitude around the airport environment. Arguably this is the most important place to have coverage. I wonder if in the future they'll start mounting small short range ADS-B Transceivers to airport beacons to alleviate this weakness. I'd imagine this won't be for quite some time if ever so I'll keep the GTS-800 for now Once 2020 arrives, that will improve for many of us. If we live and fly within the zones where ADS-B will be required (we are based inside the Seattle Class B area), the only planes that we won't see are those that don't have electrical systems, have a waiver from the FAA, or are operating illegally. If everybody has ADS-B, and we have a dual frequency receiver (GDL39, GTX345, Lynx9000, etc) we will see everybody except as noted earlier. In areas where ADS-B is not required, the problem will still exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 The traffic lady in my IFD550 will never shut up! I'm going to crash hitting the clear button to make her shut up. I'm going to add a switch to cut the audio. I know that I need to change the settings, but I have been spending a lot of time flying in the Stanfield stack trying to figure out how to fly IFR again. there is always a plane maneuvering 500 ft above you and 500 ft below you. It is hard to concentrate on your flying with that lady bitching at you constantly! I find it way harder to keep track of the other planes with that traffic lady constantly yelling at me! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 1 hour ago, TomR said: ADS-B Traffic is amazingly valuable. I've had multiple occasions where it has alerted me to an impending near miss before it happened. Fortunatley, I have a gts-800 as well so can get notified of an aircraft on short final while I'm still on the ground. That's the one minor weakness still present in the ADS-B system. It doesn't provide consistent coverage low altitude around the airport environment. Arguably this is the most important place to have coverage. I wonder if in the future they'll start mounting small short range ADS-B Transceivers to airport beacons to alleviate this weakness. I'd imagine this won't be for quite some time if ever so I'll keep the GTS-800 for now 50 minutes ago, Bob - S50 said: Once 2020 arrives, that will improve for many of us. If we live and fly within the zones where ADS-B will be required (we are based inside the Seattle Class B area), the only planes that we won't see are those that don't have electrical systems, have a waiver from the FAA, or are operating illegally. If everybody has ADS-B, and we have a dual frequency receiver (GDL39, GTX345, Lynx9000, etc) we will see everybody except as noted earlier. In areas where ADS-B is not required, the problem will still exist. I agree with Tom having TAS today makes a difference with respect to the traffic we are seeing and one of the reasons I opted for a TAS capable box. I also agree with Bob that it will get better after 2020. Traffic awareness through TIS-B or TAS by itself can be problematic when you are in a target rich environment and are fixated on looking inside at the display to see which target poses the greatest risk. Garmin has done a nice job of providing some visual guidance with their TargetTrend technology. I also think having some sort of aural and visual alert helps if it is doesn't trigger falsely. My plane has the L-3 9000+ with ATAS. When the lady calls out traffic, she catches my attention since she only speaks when something is really a conflict. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertGary1 Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 4 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said: The traffic lady in my IFD550 will never shut up! I'm going to crash hitting the clear button to make her shut up. I'm going to add a switch to cut the audio. I know that I need to change the settings, but I have been spending a lot of time flying in the Stanfield stack trying to figure out how to fly IFR again. there is always a plane maneuvering 500 ft above you and 500 ft below you. It is hard to concentrate on your flying with that lady bitching at you constantly! I find it way harder to keep track of the other planes with that traffic lady constantly yelling at me! I hadn't thought about that until my installer suggested wiring the 345 to one of the unused channels in my audio panel instead of direct. That way I can turn it off from the audio panel.My Voice Annunciator is wired direct but fortunately she doesn't talk much, mostly when I'm taxiing and the vacuum pressure drops. -Robert 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 12 minutes ago, RobertGary1 said: I hadn't thought about that until my installer suggested wiring the 345 to one of the unused channels in my audio panel instead of direct. That way I can turn it off from the audio panel.My Voice Annunciator is wired direct but fortunately she doesn't talk much, mostly when I'm taxiing and the vacuum pressure drops. -Robert That would be a very good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 I've been a big advocate of ADS-B for years now. Not everyone was on-board and a few years ago and I recall a debate here on MS where some said that the program was going to be a huge federal government debacle and that it would never work. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonhop Posted October 4, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 21 hours ago, carusoam said: Nice Pirep, Jonh. 1) I noticed on today's flight, without a-out, i could see I was missing a huge part of the picture. 2) My usual flights around NJ, there is so much a-out by others, it is hard for targets to hide. 3) when targets saturate the screen, it would be nice to have their scale and color change based on significance... 4) Who wants to know where all the slow guys are 10,000' below me? 5) there are so many useless radar returns with complete information. So many returns, I can't see details on the chart.... 6) my nearest visitor today was an AWACS radar ship... I couldn't find him using my ADSB. ATC was giving me flight following. What part of your system generated the oral traffic alert? Best regards, -a- Thanks Anthony... The GTN-650 provides the annunciation.... wish I would've thought about wiring the GTX-345 direct to the audio panel. Fortunately I've only had a few annoying notifications while taxiing. The system is spot on with the other aircraft in the pattern and I like that awareness here in busy SOCAL. Gillespie is under the San Diego Bravo, so the big sky ain't so big which is why I went with the 345. I see so much more traffic now that I have a reference on the iPad that can direct my eyes outside. My wife stares at my screen and calls out everything, even the airlines. I guess it's time to get a display just for her... ~ Jon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 On 03/10/2017 at 2:41 PM, jonhop said: Taking my wife home yesterday I received a traffic annunciation. "Traffic, 11 O'clock, same altitude, 1 mile." The traffic screen popped up on the 650 and the iPad. I looked outside the window and had to take immediate evasive action, so I entered a 60° degree left bank and pulled hard on the yoke. My wife screamed what did you do that for? Apparently she missed the traffic alert. I said I'll show you, as I wanted to get my eyes back on the other airplane that turned out to be another Mooney. Rolled back to 30° right where I saw it rolling back from a bank to the left. I don't know if the other Mooney had ADS-B in but I'm sure the other pilot saw my maneuver considering how close we were. When my wife saw the other Mooney, she was like "OH, that ADS-B in is awesome..." I have to say I am truly impressed with the GTX-345 and GTN-650.... The combo gave me time to "see and avoid" much better than the plain old two sets of eyeballs in the cockpit... Any way to set the warning a bit earlier? Like 3 miles? It only gives you less than 12 seconds to scan and respond (much less in your wife's case.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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