mike_elliott Posted September 19, 2017 Report Share Posted September 19, 2017 17 minutes ago, Mooneymite said: If you drink very much Chinese tea, you wil definitely need a relief tube. I think Jose' is referring to the usefulness of these "look good wingtips" as opposed to other, more utilitarian options for your AMU's. But isnt that why Exxon Elite made the large opening Oil quarts? Re purposing at its finest... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 4 hours ago, Mooneymite said: If you drink very much Chinese tea, you wil definitely need a relief tube. Indeed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 4 hours ago, Mooneymite said: If you drink very much Chinese tea, you wil definitely need a relief tube. Indeed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 Usefulness of wingtips and winglets... 1) The raw end of the wing has some turbulence caused by the high pressure air passing to where the low pressure air is... 2) This turbulence interrupts the air flow over the last few inches of the wing. Making those last few inches innefective at producing lift. 3) the last few inches are full thickness and generate full drag.... 4) Adding a proper winglet, the high pressure air is blocked from passing to the low pressure side. The thin winglet has much less drag... 5) The end result is the wing produces more lift at the cost of adding minimal drag... more lift could equate to more UL... 6) how much more UL could you gain by adding a few inches of length to each wing? 7) the cost of getting anything useful out of this mod would require an STC like any other lift or UL increasing device.... Sounds good... It is probably easier and less costly to get a set of known wingtips from an existing Mooney design... PP ideas only, not An aerodynamicist... Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinerunner Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 If I bought these for my 64 E Model it would make the rest of the plane look old. So I would have to upgrade the cowling to a LoPresti (gotta have an Italian name in there) so i would have a balanced self image. Probably glass panel would follow and a Ferrari (or maybe a Bugatti, which sounds Italian but is actually made in France, or to be a bit more frugal a Guzzi motorcycle). Wake me up if I start drooling. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kris_adams Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 I really like them. Hoping to paint in the next year or so and still trying to decide if I should get wing tips. I likely will keep 79H for many many more years... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 20 minutes ago, pinerunner said: If I bought these for my 64 E Model it would make the rest of the plane look old. So I would have to upgrade the cowling to a LoPresti (gotta have an Italian name in there) so i would have a balanced self image. Probably glass panel would follow and a Ferrari (or maybe a Bugatti, which sounds Italian but is actually made in France, or to be a bit more frugal a Guzzi motorcycle). Wake me up if I start drooling. Hah - and a super model girl friend to drive around with you in your Bugatti on the way to the airport to visit your Mooney. your string of logic is like the old adage about not cleaning a pizza stain off the rug since then that spot is too clean! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 21 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said: I like these wingtips but agree that they would look out of place on an otherwise stock vintage Mooney. I wonder how they would look in place of my current fiberglass wingtips with weak red & green bulbs but no strobes? Price them right and i may find out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyNameIsNobody Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 This will be the test of "new" performance requirements. They will definitely provide better than stock lighting. Price point is the key. The tips are really nice looking, but they will not make your plane faster. They will make it "look faster". If these are under a grand for set and lighting is improved...Why not? If they are a grand a piece plus installation? NOPE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradp Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 23 hours ago, Piloto said: I still think I would rather go for the $50 pilot relief tube, I don't fly that much at night but pee day and night. José Jose with all the use of the relief tube, do you need to talk to a urologist about your prostate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HRM Posted September 20, 2017 Report Share Posted September 20, 2017 6 hours ago, bluehighwayflyer said: i like these wingtips but agree that they would look out of place on an otherwise stock vintage Mooney. Not for those of us that kept the swept antennae. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 16 hours ago, MyNameIsNobody said: This will be the test of "new" performance requirements. They will definitely provide better than stock lighting. Price point is the key. The tips are really nice looking, but they will not make your plane faster. They will make it "look faster". If these are under a grand for set and lighting is improved...Why not? If they are a grand a piece plus installation? NOPE. I'd think they'd sell a ton of those for a grand. Unfortunately I don't see that happening. The lasar tips are over 3k without the lights. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N6758N Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 18 hours ago, MyNameIsNobody said: This will be the test of "new" performance requirements. They will definitely provide better than stock lighting. Price point is the key. The tips are really nice looking, but they will not make your plane faster. They will make it "look faster". If these are under a grand for set and lighting is improved...Why not? If they are a grand a piece plus installation? NOPE. Keep dreaming Scott, I don't see these selling for less than 4 AMUs plus installation and paint. Sure hope I am wrong though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSMooniac Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 I think the Aveo lights are around $500 each...in an assembly line. Hand-laid composite products in a low volume shop won't be cheap...Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piloto Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 20 hours ago, bradp said: Jose with all the use of the relief tube, do you need to talk to a urologist about your prostate? The doctor recommended the relief tube, he has one on his Baron. José Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 (edited) I'm in touch with Aveo to see if they can display them at Mooney Summitt while at the same time becoming a sponsor. -Seth Edited September 21, 2017 by Seth 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennett Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 Seth, While you are at it, perhaps you could suggest they have an option of adding recognition/taxi/landing light in the forward section of the wingtip. I use the MAXX combination LED lights in the clear section of the regular Mooney “sculptured” wing tip. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooneymite Posted September 21, 2017 Report Share Posted September 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Bennett said: Seth, While you are at it, perhaps you could suggest they have an option of adding recognition/taxi/landing light in the forward section of the wingtip. I use the MAXX combination LED lights in the clear section of the regular Mooney “sculptured” wing tip. And also ask them if they will be offering a "JATO" adapter to promote speeds commiserate with their speedy look. Function follows form....or do I have that backwards? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kortopates Posted September 22, 2017 Report Share Posted September 22, 2017 I Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted September 22, 2017 Report Share Posted September 22, 2017 On 9/22/2017 at 12:08 PM, Bennett said: Seth, While you are at it, perhaps you could suggest they have an option of adding recognition/taxi/landing light in the forward section of the wingtip. I use the MAXX combination LED lights in the clear section of the regular Mooney “sculptured” wing tip. Those look great! Do you have a model number/link/etc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennett Posted September 23, 2017 Report Share Posted September 23, 2017 I had these installed via a 337 form. If you send me your email address I will send you copies of the 337 forms that include model numbers. I do have to say that others who have tried to have their local FISDO approve the installation of these non-TSIOed landing/taxi/recognition lights have not been successful. I have mine set to alternate via a switch in the circuit. VERY bright! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garryowen Posted September 23, 2017 Report Share Posted September 23, 2017 A quick search of aircraft spruce shows $2990 for a non-TSO'd pair of tips for VANS RV-4, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 and the F-1/Harmon Rockets. How much does TSO increase the price? Double maybe?? Seems my 4.5 amu estimate for mooney wing tips might be a tad on the low side. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradp Posted September 23, 2017 Report Share Posted September 23, 2017 What goes into an STC for something like this? Load analysis involved for winglets? Given our carry though spar and short wingspan I wouldn’t think there would be too much additional loading but some of the fancy winglets for corporate jets have active anti-loading control surfaces. Their data suggests climb gains and fuel flow/ range gains in the double digits :wow: I’m not sure that any small GA aircraft have had winglets be shown to provide significant efficiency gains. If I were to save say 3-5% on fuel efficiency you could make an economic gymnasts argument that they would pay for themselves over maybe 2500 flight hours if you’re lucky. They do look nice, however. I’m sure they’d look good on that E model in the other thread. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted September 23, 2017 Report Share Posted September 23, 2017 2 hours ago, bradp said: What goes into an STC for something like this? Load analysis involved for winglets? Given our carry though spar and short wingspan I wouldn’t think there would be too much additional loading but some of the fancy winglets for corporate jets have active anti-loading control surfaces. Their data suggests climb gains and fuel flow/ range gains in the double digits :wow: I’m not sure that any small GA aircraft have had winglets be shown to provide significant efficiency gains. If I were to save say 3-5% on fuel efficiency you could make an economic gymnasts argument that they would pay for themselves over maybe 2500 flight hours if you’re lucky. They do look nice, however. I’m sure they’d look good on that E model in the other thread. That never works for me - I just go faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted September 23, 2017 Report Share Posted September 23, 2017 16 hours ago, Bennett said: I had these installed via a 337 form. If you send me your email address I will send you copies of the 337 forms that include model numbers. I do have to say that others who have tried to have their local FISDO approve the installation of these non-TSIOed landing/taxi/recognition lights have not been successful. I have mine set to alternate via a switch in the circuit. VERY bright! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Bennett kindly sent me a copy of his 337 for this a few years ago, and that is the message I got locally from FISDO - no way. But that was before what seems to be a bit of lightening on blocking certain kinds of upgrades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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