ragedracer1977 Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 This seems to be something new. I put in 2 pumps of flaps for take off. The flap handle is down against the nose well. I noticed on the last couple flights when I go to raise the gear, the flap handle is 'up' and no longer down against the well. Is this something that needs to be addressed or is it 'normal'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 Flap handle is directly connected to a valve. If the handle is up, the flaps will follow... if the handle is down, the flaps will go down when the pump applies pressure... The valve is under the belly. Many systems get refreshed over time. Pumps, seals and valves are pretty easy. Control cables too. Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragedracer1977 Posted August 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 So you think the flaps are coming up? I'll have to watch them on takeoff or test in flight. My annual is scheduled for just under 3 weeks, so I'll be sure to add it to the squawk list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 Flaps are connected via a spring. The spring is trying to pull them up. Unless it is old or missing... The flap shaped valve handle, when up, releases the pressure... If the handle is up without releasing the pressure, that leads to a different problem... The flap handle is either up or down to match the valve that is open or closed... It would not be normal for the flaps to change position without the request of the pilot. Losing lift at a critical time can be bad. Losing lift without even knowing it would be worse. PP thoughts only, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragedracer1977 Posted August 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 OK, it seems like we might be talking about 2 different systems. I have the manual flaps. Long steel bar that you pump next to the johnson bar. There is a little knob that you either pull out or push in to engage the valve. The knob is staying closed, but the handle itself is coming up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 (edited) There are two one way valves. One for sucking fluid into the pump and one for pushing fluid out of the pump. There is another valve that lets the fluid flow back through the pump so the flaps retract. If the outlet one way valve gets dirty it can let pressure flow back through and pressurize the pump pushing the handle up. I have also seen instances where air in the flap system can cause this to happen. You can tell if you have air in the system because the handle will not hit a hard stop on the last stroke and may spring back slightly. You can sometimes get the air out by operating the flaps a few times at high altitude. The two one way valves have teflon seats. The relief valve has an aluminum seat. Edited August 22, 2017 by N201MKTurbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragedracer1977 Posted August 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 Handle definitely hits a hard stop. No sponginess at all at full flaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 15 minutes ago, ragedracer1977 said: Handle definitely hits a hard stop. No sponginess at all at full flaps. Ok, it is probably just some crud in the pump. I would just live with it until the next time you have the belly panels off. It may clear up by itself. bleeding the flaps is a PITA. It is good to change the fluid out every decade or so. The pump is easy to take apart and put back together. Don't modify or change any of the springs. The teflon seals don't go bad but crud can get in there. You can replace the o-rings. If the flaps creep up without thee handle rising then the release valve ball is leaking. It needs to be re-coined by whacking it real hard with a hammer and a punch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRBENNETT Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 Could be a stuck open outlet check valve that is allowing fluid back to the pump valve. When you take off the spring return force in the flaps plus the force produced by airflow is pushing the handle back. you might test it by putting in two pumps on the ground and watching it for several minutes to see if the handle moves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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