Clear AvGas?

[RLCarter]

2 hours ago, EricJ said:

Corn squeez'ns...

Alcohol is a terrible fuel engines, but some get that warm and fuzzy feeling when they think they are saving the planet

[XXX]

OK, here's what I found out today. Took a sample to Sheltair and my line guy says this isn't avgas. He smells it and it smells like avgas. We then sump some directly from the truck and it is clear as well. I called AvFuel corporate and talked to the 100ll representative and here is what I learned.

1. Use a large GATS type jar for best results. Volume is important in determining color. I'm using a narrow sump tube.

2. Blue color is directly tied to the lead. Blue hue will vary as the blend changes from summer to winter. 

3. The alkalyd (expensive ingredient) can have differing hues which will cause the blue to change. Someitmes the alkalyd will have a yellow color and when mixed with the blue turns the fuel greenish.

4. The proper way to check for color is to sump a quart and view it in a white porcelain bowl, not plastic. 

5. Avgas, when mixed with jetA does not turn clear, it most likely will turn greenish, a result of blue and yellow.

6. There is a maximum amount of dye permitted in 100 ll but no minimum.

7. UV light exposure will clear the dye.

[RobertGary1]

Excellent follow up Chup. Thanks!

-Robert

[Mark89114]

And modern car gas is a horrible concoction of chemicals that smells worse.  Makes modern avgas feel clean and healthy.......

I read somewhere that you couldn't certify mogas, for cars, as it is too dangerous under the current rules of effin' safety and what not.  This statement may or may not be true but I read it somewhere or learned it at a bar.

[N201MKTurbo]

25 minutes ago, Chupacabra said:

OK, here's what I found out today. Took a sample to Sheltair and my line guy says this isn't avgas. He smells it and it smells like avgas. We then sump some directly from the truck and it is clear as well. I called AvFuel corporate and talked to the 100ll representative and here is what I learned.

1. Use a large GATS type jar for best results. Volume is important in determining color. I'm using a narrow sump tube.

2. Blue color is directly tied to the lead. Blue hue will vary as the blend changes from summer to winter. 

3. The alkalyd (expensive ingredient) can have differing hues which will cause the blue to change. Someitmes the alkalyd will have a yellow color and when mixed with the blue turns the fuel greenish.

4. The proper way to check for color is to sump a quart and view it in a white porcelain bowl, not plastic. 

5. Avgas, when mixed with jetA does not turn clear, it most likely will turn greenish, a result of blue and yellow.

6. There is a maximum amount of dye permitted in 100 ll but no minimum.

When I work on tanks and have to drain the fuel I drain it into a plastic bucket (I know I'm going to burn myself up one of these days) It looks very blue. I don't think you need a Quart of it. An old white coffee cup should do the job. the only problem is opening the tank drain to fill the cup, you could pour a few samplers full in to the cup.

[RobertGary1]

22 minutes ago, Mark89114 said:

And modern car gas is a horrible concoction of chemicals that smells worse.  Makes modern avgas feel clean and healthy.......

I read somewhere that you couldn't certify mogas, for cars, as it is too dangerous under the current rules of effin' safety and what not.  This statement may or may not be true but I read it somewhere or learned it at a bar.

The FAA today prohibits the use of any mogas that contains alcohol fuels. That makes the existing EAA, etc STCs for mogas mostly worthless in most of the country as you cannot buy regular gas at the gas station now.

-Robert

[EricJ]

2 hours ago, Chupacabra said:

OK, here's what I found out today. Took a sample to Sheltair and my line guy says this isn't avgas. He smells it and it smells like avgas. We then sump some directly from the truck and it is clear as well. I called AvFuel corporate and talked to the 100ll representative and here is what I learned.

1. Use a large GATS type jar for best results. Volume is important in determining color. I'm using a narrow sump tube.

2. Blue color is directly tied to the lead. Blue hue will vary as the blend changes from summer to winter. 

3. The alkalyd (expensive ingredient) can have differing hues which will cause the blue to change. Someitmes the alkalyd will have a yellow color and when mixed with the blue turns the fuel greenish.

4. The proper way to check for color is to sump a quart and view it in a white porcelain bowl, not plastic. 

5. Avgas, when mixed with jetA does not turn clear, it most likely will turn greenish, a result of blue and yellow.

6. There is a maximum amount of dye permitted in 100 ll but no minimum.

There's something not right here, as the entire intent of the dye is to provide a means to visually verify that the fuel is the proper grade.   If you have to drain a quart in a white porcelain bowl, rather than a quantity typical for a preflight in a preflight sample tool, then the purpose is defeated.   I think the guy is giving you a bit of a tilted answer, as clearly there couldn't be anything wrong with their fuel (sarcasm alert).

And mixing grades of dyed avgas does result in a clear mix.  This was more useful knowledge in ancient times when red, green, and blue fuel were relatively common.   When i was a lineboy for an American flying club at an Army Airfield overseas in the 70s we bought 115/145 from the Army and it was a beautiful purple color.   You didn't have to worry much about spills, either, as the stuff evaporated almost instantly when it hit the ground.    So knowing the proper color of your desired fuel was a good thing, and if it was clear it either wasn't fuel or you had to worry about whether the blend in the tank was okay or not.

I don't think I'd be happy with the answers you were provided.   Somebody independent of the fuel company might be more objective.

[Raptor05121]

I wonder if we (you) will find out what it was if it wasn't 100LL

[RobertGary1]

23 hours ago, Raptor05121 said:

I wonder if we (you) will find out what it was if it wasn't 100LL

Best test is to taste it. That's what I do if I find some fluid on the garage floor so I know what's leaking from the car.

-Robert