Tmart Posted June 16, 2017 Report Share Posted June 16, 2017 Has anyone looked at the one yet 1969 MOONEY M20C • $49,900 • AVAILABLE FOR SALE • 180 hp, 3869 TTAF&E, 1695 SMOH, 633 Since Bottom End Overhaul. 633 TTSN 2 Blade Hartzell Prop (no recur AD), Annual due 8/17, One Piece Belly Pan, Complete Logs, 201 Style Speed Mods; Windshield, Cowling/Baffling, Wingtips, Spinner, Instrument Panel, Control Yokes. GNS-530W, 796 GPS, GDL-39, GTX-327, STEC 30 With Alt Hold, ST-901 GPS Steering, KX-155 With GS, KMA-24, Pilot's Bose Headset With Hardwired Power Plug, (3) DC Headsets, Standby Vac, JPI 830 With Fuel Flow, Standby Elec AI, Portable O2 System, Tanis Preheat, Pilot/Copilot Shoulder Harness, Light Weight Starter. Its up in Maine Its on Barnstormers http://www.barnstormers.com/cat.php?mode=search Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steingar Posted June 16, 2017 Report Share Posted June 16, 2017 Looks really nice. I'd want to own when the tanks were last resealed. At that price I would also worry a bit about the somewhat high time engine. That said, you don't see many that nicely appointed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy95W Posted June 16, 2017 Report Share Posted June 16, 2017 Since it was 633 hours since a bottom end 'overhaul' and ALSO 633 hours from getting a new, non-AD prop, I will guarantee this had a prop strike (probably gear up landing) 633 hours ago. I'll bet the one-piece belly was done at the same time. That being said, if there's no corrosion, it's probably worth about $40k or so. Too bad they didn't just get the whole engine overhauled after the prop strike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 16, 2017 Report Share Posted June 16, 2017 I really like my 1970 C model. The difference between it and do '69 is all on the data plate. If it's in good shape, you'll really like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tmart Posted June 16, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2017 RH 9/02/2004 LH 8/10/2015 thats when the tanks were done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted June 16, 2017 Report Share Posted June 16, 2017 I'm not a fan of the throttle quadrant, but otherwise I think this would be at the top of my list if I were shopping for a C. Assuming it would pass a proper Pre-Buy and is corrosion free, regularly flown, good compression, oil analysis, good logs, and everything works properly, etc. I think anything under $45K would be a good deal on this one. I'd rather have this with the high time engine than any of the others with shotgun panel, old radios, no WAAS GPS, no autopilot, no speed mods, etc. An engine can go at any time, but a bad panel is a bad panel from day one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tmart Posted June 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2017 I like the throttle quadrant! It's what I'm used to lol. Makes me feel like I'm at work. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabremech Posted June 17, 2017 Report Share Posted June 17, 2017 5 hours ago, Andy95W said: Since it was 633 hours since a bottom end 'overhaul' and ALSO 633 hours from getting a new, non-AD prop, I will guarantee this had a prop strike (probably gear up landing) 633 hours ago. I'll bet the one-piece belly was done at the same time. That being said, if there's no corrosion, it's probably worth about $40k or so. Too bad they didn't just get the whole engine overhauled after the prop strike. This is similar to mine. After the gear up landing, the insurance company only paid for the minimum amount of work necessary for the engine and airframe repair. Overhaul cost would have been on the owner. Hence why I have a 600 hour bottom end and prop and 1850 tsmoh. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raptor05121 Posted June 17, 2017 Report Share Posted June 17, 2017 24 minutes ago, Sabremech said: This is similar to mine. After the gear up landing, the insurance company only paid for the minimum amount of work necessary for the engine and airframe repair. Overhaul cost would have been on the owner. Hence why I have a 600 hour bottom end and prop and 1850 tsmoh. Same for mine. The previous owner said it would've been $3k out of pocket to make it a major. That cost him about $10k when I bought it. (1900SMOH, 600 bottom) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron McBride Posted June 17, 2017 Report Share Posted June 17, 2017 8 minutes ago, Raptor05121 said: Same for mine. The previous owner said it would've been $3k out of pocket to make it a major. That cost him about $10k when I bought it. (1900SMOH, 600 bottom) You can top it much easier than a recent top, but an old bottom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob_Belville Posted June 17, 2017 Report Share Posted June 17, 2017 23 hours ago, Andy95W said: Since it was 633 hours since a bottom end 'overhaul' and ALSO 633 hours from getting a new, non-AD prop, I will guarantee this had a prop strike (probably gear up landing) 633 hours ago. I'll bet the one-piece belly was done at the same time. That being said, if there's no corrosion, it's probably worth about $40k or so. Too bad they didn't just get the whole engine overhauled after the prop strike. I just decided that when I sell my old E I will not be listing it here. Who needs the armchair experts telling me, and everyone else, that sight unseen, my plane was overpriced by 25%. And these are my friends. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted June 17, 2017 Report Share Posted June 17, 2017 @Bob_Belville we all know that you're never selling your E anyway. And Mrs. Belville will never have to worry about it as she's got a long list of names waiting to bid on that E of yours. It will likely be the highest value ever awarded an M20 Echo. Your estate will be proud ;-) Just don't bend it between now and then 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy95W Posted June 17, 2017 Report Share Posted June 17, 2017 On 6/16/2017 at 4:26 PM, Andy95W said: Since it was 633 hours since a bottom end 'overhaul' and ALSO 633 hours from getting a new, non-AD prop, I will guarantee this had a prop strike (probably gear up landing) 633 hours ago. I'll bet the one-piece belly was done at the same time. That being said, if there's no corrosion, it's probably worth about $40k or so. Too bad they didn't just get the whole engine overhauled after the prop strike. 3 hours ago, Bob_Belville said: I just decided that when I sell my old E I will not be listing it here. Who needs the armchair experts telling me, and everyone else, that sight unseen, my plane was overpriced by 25%. And these are my friends. Geez, I never meant any offense to anyone. And I kinda agree with Paul's analysis- $45K would be reasonable. My point was that it would be worthwhile checking the logbooks for any "damage history", and maybe use it as a (minor) bargaining point. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 I assume every C will have damage history. This one certainly has at least one gear up. A NDH C would be very suspect. And I'd be very concerned about lack of use. I would use the runout engine as a bargaining chip. And anything under $45K would be good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry 5TJ Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 4 hours ago, Bob_Belville said: I just decided that when I sell my old E I will not be listing it here. Who needs the armchair experts telling me, and everyone else, that sight unseen, my plane was overpriced by 25%. And these are my friends. Yep, it's a tough crowd at the Mooneyspace bar. I'm not listing my Ovation here, either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 The one and only Mooney I've sold, sold here on MooneySpace for a fair price. This is just a knowledgeable group. Which is good if you're selling a good bird. If not, and you're trying to pawn shit off on someone, then Ebay might be better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMuncy Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 If you are going to sell your plane, I suspect the clamor from the crowd here won't make much difference. I would bet that 98% of the real buyers will read all the MSers have to say about value, to get an idea about what prices to expect. Then they will start looking at the real market. They will then pick the best cost/value available, consistent with their preferences and budget. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steingar Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 17 hours ago, Bob_Belville said: I just decided that when I sell my old E I will not be listing it here. Who needs the armchair experts telling me, and everyone else, that sight unseen, my plane was overpriced by 25%. And these are my friends. Your loss. My aircraft was advertised on this site, here is where I first saw it and it was a post here that convinced me to buy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob_Belville Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 6 hours ago, steingar said: Your loss. My aircraft was advertised on this site, here is where I first saw it and it was a post here that convinced me to buy it. That's consistent. I didn't say MS wasn't good for the BUYER. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtVandelay Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 I like to know why they list items like: instrument panel, control yokes, etcWhy not just add landing gear and it has wings too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob_Belville Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 2 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said: I guess to point out the extent of its "201" modifications, which are indeed extensive. Jim It might be a little ambiguous, but I agree he intends to note that those details are 201. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexLev Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 Just saw this Mooney come up for sale locally today, ad attached below in case anyone is interested, not a ton of information or pictures, but I've pasted it below: 1965 MOONEY MK21 RANGER M20C • $35,000 • ACCEPTING OFFERS • Beautiful 1965 Mooney Mk21 Ranger M20C N5804Q Owned since 1972 Always hangared Impeccable maintenance IFR panel TT 2690 Engine 1395 SMOH Annual 9-2016 GPS- Garmin GNS 430 GPS/Comm- Garmin GNC 250XL Audio panel- Garmin GMA340 Nav/Comm-Narco Mk 12D DME- Narco 890 This Mooney has been in the family for 45 years! It has updated paint and interior. It needs nothing Aircraft is available for inspection. I am accepting offers. Call Dave for appointments or more information • Contact David Thering, Owner - located Akron, NY USA • Telephone: 716-432-6858 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexLev Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 Yeah, seems like a decent airplane; higher-time engine (curious when it was overhauled and by who), but a 430 (is it WAAS?) and it's definitely awesome that he's owned it for practically 50 years. If I was in the market, for a 20C, I think 30k is probably a decently fair price for it as long as the PPI checks out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 If we assume both the 1965 and the 1969 pass a thorough Pre-Buy inspection and both are corrosion free, leak free, good compression, and all components work, how do they compare. The difference in price between the two is $15K. I can't help but think about how much it would cost to bring the 1965 up to the same upgraded level of the 1969. (I'm not considering the factory differences between the two such as electric gear, throttle quadrant, etc. But rather just the after-market upgrades.) Of course there's no requirement to upgrade to the level of the 1969, but there can't be any doubt it would be a more enjoyable airplane to fly and would have a much better resale value. In my estimation there's at least a $40K difference in upgrades and only a $15K difference in asking price. Therefore the 1969 would be a $25k better deal. Just my opinion, but that's what I think about when I'm buying an airplane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted June 18, 2017 Report Share Posted June 18, 2017 15 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said: All else being equal I agree completely. Condition is the key for me, though, even above resale value and upgrade costs. I'll mostly agree with you ;-) Condition is certainly more important that upgrades. But I would say that condition will directly affect resale value. So good condition will equal good resale as well. To further agree with you... I'd be afraid that a plane in poor condition could be hiding issues that aren't easy to find during inspection or could be missed. A plane that is in great condition and is flown regularly will likely be a better buy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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