Oil change by owner

[Bob_Belville]

Just now, Danb said:

I also changed tempest fine wires a year or so ago with good results

That too. I switched to Tempest fine wires about 10 minutes after I bought this plane. There are enough thingies to worry about and failsafe plugs means one less.

[Marauder]

Does the magnets actually grab the metal if any, sent the samples to black stone hopefully still,ok

Blackstone looks at metal dissolved in the actual oil. It's reported as you know in PPM levels. The filter magnet grabs fines. If it's there, it's like a slurry of metal sludge.


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[Danb]

Makes sense, I'll most likely try after next change I have another filter left 

[Danb]

For real Bob 

[Bob_Belville]

Just now, Danb said:

Does the magnets actually grab the metal if any, sent the samples to black stone hopefully still,ok

There is never significant metal on the magnet from my engine, thankfully, but I've seen plenty caught on other Mooneys coming through the shop here. 

[Danb]

That would be upsetting, cut open the filter nothing I always hold my breath when looking 

[Bob_Belville]

Just now, Danb said:

That would be upsetting, cut open the filter nothing I always hold my breath when looking 

There a Mooney parked in a shade hangar here now, Lynn said the fresh engine should be here this week. The owner knew his engine was limping when he brought in to AGL for an annual. He was right.

[Guest]

How many 231/252 owners pre fill their oil filters with oil before installing them?

Clarence

[flight2000]

1 hour ago, Bob_Belville said:

I have a hangar full of stuff from HF including box and open end wrenches is about 4 lengths but I had trouble crushing Tempest filters until I got the band wrench.

I had trouble getting the oil filter off one time and then realized I forgot to grease the gasket on the filter to keep it from seizing itself to the mount.  Are you using grease on the oil filters gasket before spinning it on?  Never an issue getting it back off when I don't forget to add the grease. 

This is what I use: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cspages/dc4.php?clickkey=147022

Cheers,

Brian

[peevee]

I can't imagine crushing an aviation filter, the housing are pretty thick.

 

I also use D4 as per what I've come to understand is the proper technique.

[laytonl]

2 hours ago, Bob_Belville said:

I have a hangar full of stuff from HF including box and open end wrenches is about 4 lengths but I had trouble crushing Tempest filters until I got the band wrench.

I had the same problem and the band wrench solved the problem too.  Lee

[DonMuncy]

11 minutes ago, laytonl said:

I had the same problem and the band wrench solved the problem too.  Lee

Were you using Tempests as well.

 

[Marcopolo]

Clarance,

 

  I fill the filter before it goes back on my K, not quite to full but at least 2/3, filling it full causes too much spillage going back on,  2/3 keeps the gap from pressure loss to a minimum.  I usually pull the top plugs and spin the engine by starter until I see good oil pressure before starting and leak checking after the oil change.  Hope this isn't breaking any mechanics code or something!

 

WhiskeyTango,

 

  Anytime you're ready just give me a day or two notice and I'd be happy to walk you through the process.  I'm near Charlotte NC but can be in Savannah within an hour or so by Mooney.

 

Ron

[carusoam]

Thoughts on the magnet...

1) It is good for picking particles that are attracted by magnets. Steel and iron...

2) Not very good about picking up aluminum, or plastic bits...

 

Thoughts on metal dissolved in the oil...

1) 'dissolved' is probably too strong of a word.  

2) If the metal were to dissolve in the oil, the oil would also be adsorbed into the metal.

3) If the metal parts adsorbed oil, they would swell over time....  we know that's not happening....

4) the tiny metal particles are circulating with the oil. The finer/smaller the particle, the more surface area it has per milligram  (surface area to weight ratio). More surface area is akin to to having more friction with the surrounding oil. More frinction keeps it flowing with the oil, less setling due to forces like gravity or magnetic fields...

5) they would have to get pretty close to a magnet to get caught.  Or the magnet has to be really strong to attract the particles.

6) there is going to be a right size that gets picked up in oil analysis. Whatever size that is  increases a lot when the cam is throwing chunks around....

7) like EGTs, the numbers are very relative from one oil change to the next. but different oil and different magnets will change the readings a bit, as does,a,different number of hours or the type of flying that has been done.

8) Now where is Ed our oil guy?

9) follow-up note: I lost faith with the Champion brand. There was a loss of trust.  Not because they didn't engineer a good product. Because, They continue to sell a crap product, they know it fails, and seem to do nothing about it. The same decision makers are at the top of the brand.

10) why isn't there guidance on the package... check resistance at each annual or something like that...?

PP ideas only, I don't know much about making spark plugs, but MS taught me how to measure a bad one...

Best regards.

-a-

 

Edited June 6, 2017 by carusoam

[apil]

I'll second what was said earlier. Do it with an A&P first. Hopefully you have an airwolf and a quick drain. Have a good breakfast before changing oil -- hand tight is tighter that way

My biggest pain is the number of screws to be removed in my C. And it is only one side that needs to come off.

[kpaul]

I have been using Champion only because that is what was on the plane when I bought it.  I currently use PN CH48110-1, is the Tempest PN AA48110-2 the correct replacement?

I like the concept of the magnet and that I can buy 5 Tempest for the cost of 4 Champion.

[Bob_Belville]

22 minutes ago, kpaul said:

I have been using Champion only because that is what was on the plane when I bought it.  I currently use PN CH48110-1, is the Tempest PN AA48110-2 the correct replacement?

I like the concept of the magnet and that I can buy 5 Tempest for the cost of 4 Champion.

Kevin, yes my spin on Tempest oil filter is a 48110-2. My E model has a IO360 A1A which is probably the same as your F. 

[kpaul]

32 minutes ago, Bob_Belville said:

Kevin, yes my spin on Tempest oil filter is a 48110-2. My E model has a IO360 A1A which is probably the same as your F. 

Bob,

Awesome, Thank you! Yes I also have the IO360 A1A. I am getting ready to put in my order to Spruce so it is gets home about the same time I do.

[nels]

I changed my oil for the first time a couple weeks ago. I warmed up the engine, attached the hose to the quick drain and locked it open. Nothing came out until I removed the dipstick to vent the crankcase,  then all hell broke lose and I had oil all over. The next mess was pulling the oil filter....oil all over again. I did change the oil filter after flying it home after the purchase and an annual with oil change. I had about four hours on the oil/ filter change and I wanted to open the filter to some what verify engine condition. The plane set for a few days prior to removal and there was no mess at all while removing the filter. I assume the oil drained back into the engine over time. So, next time I'll warm the engine, drain the oil then wait a day or so without running the engine and then change the filter. Does this sound like a good approach?

[whiskytango]

Thanks to all for the excellent advice.  I will watch the A&P do it and maybe record it with my phone as long as he is ok with that.  

[Marauder]

I changed my oil for the first time a couple weeks ago. I warmed up the engine, attached the hose to the quick drain and locked it open. Nothing came out until I removed the dipstick to vent the crankcase,  then all hell broke lose and I had oil all over. The next mess was pulling the oil filter....oil all over again. I did change the oil filter after flying it home after the purchase and an annual with oil change. I had about four hours on the oil/ filter change and I wanted to open the filter to some what verify engine condition. The plane set for a few days prior to removal and there was no mess at all while removing the filter. I assume the oil drained back into the engine over time. So, next time I'll warm the engine, drain the oil then wait a day or so without running the engine and then change the filter. Does this sound like a good approach?

It is if you're willing to wait an extra day.


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[Oldguy]

WT, a couple of thoughts from reading this thread.

If you do not have a quick drain, get your mechanic to install one. I cannot fathom doing oil changes on my plane without one.

If you get oil analysis done, and with you flying and depending on your plane like you do it is probably a good idea, have your mechanic show you when and how to gather the sample. It really does make a difference.

Make sure you appropriately log all of the oil changes you perform. Perfectly legal for you to do, but documentation counts. Personally, I have a label printer I have set up with a format just for oil changes.

Shop for oil like was mentioned earlier. There is a distributor in my area whose price for Aeroshell is lower than anywhere I have found by about $2.00 per quart. His price for Phillips is about the same as I can get at my FBO.

 

[AH-1 Cobra Pilot]

I just changed the oil in my J.  The first time I changed the oil in this airplane, the oil filter did not drip at all.  The engine was still warm when I took off the filter.  This time, I started draining the oil after flying for 2.5 hours and let it drain for a couple of days.  When I took off the filter, it leaked oil.  The oil level was probably lower the second time, so that should not be the culprit.  The filter is high on the engine, so it should naturally drain after shutting down the engine.  I cannot figure out the difference.  Anyone?

[Oldguy]

48 minutes ago, Ah-1 Cobra Pilot said:

I just changed the oil in my J.  The first time I changed the oil in this airplane, the oil filter did not drip at all.  The engine was still warm when I took off the filter.  This time, I started draining the oil after flying for 2.5 hours and let it drain for a couple of days.  When I took off the filter, it leaked oil.  The oil level was probably lower the second time, so that should not be the culprit.  The filter is high on the engine, so it should naturally drain after shutting down the engine.  I cannot figure out the difference.  Anyone?

Slightly more weight in the rear of the plane? I have found the smallest difference in the nose high/tail high orientation of my J can yield different amounts of oil remaining in the filter regardless of the amount of time I let it drain.

Could also be the phase of the moon exerting more tidal influence....

[Bob_Belville]

1 hour ago, Ah-1 Cobra Pilot said:

I just changed the oil in my J.  The first time I changed the oil in this airplane, the oil filter did not drip at all.  The engine was still warm when I took off the filter.  This time, I started draining the oil after flying for 2.5 hours and let it drain for a couple of days.  When I took off the filter, it leaked oil.  The oil level was probably lower the second time, so that should not be the culprit.  The filter is high on the engine, so it should naturally drain after shutting down the engine.  I cannot figure out the difference.  Anyone?

The filter is high in the engine but the approximately level filter cannot drain below the opening which leaves quite a lot of oil in the filter that cannot drain. Far more than enough to make a big mess if it gets turned down while getting the filter through the maize. A teaspoon full makes a quart of mess.