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Just bought N22VA


Stetson20

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22 minutes ago, carusoam said:

Somebody loved their C...

Who is doing the PPI?

Best regards,

-a-

 It's an E model. PPI by Northern Flyers in Schaumburg IL

Panel will eventually need upgrade. 450 to TBO. But I am planning for that.

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It was hard to keep my buyer fever down through the winter, but I'm glad I waited. Nothing worse than buying then having to sit &a wait to use it! Thanks Matt (GuitarM) for all the advice! I owe ya many adult beverages!

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16 minutes ago, Stetson20 said:

 It's an E model. PPI by Northern Flyers in Schaumburg IL

Panel will eventually need upgrade. 450 to TBO. But I am planning for that.

Stetson,

My bad...

I was so focused on all the panel details, I forgot what I was writing... (pay attention, pay attention, pay attention to all the details...) distracted by the mental images of nice planes for sale.... :)

remember how simple a distraction can be C/E, gear up/down....Gumps, Gumps, Gumps...

now I need to go work on a Gumps procedure for posting.

Best regards,

-a-

Edited by carusoam
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Just now, carusoam said:

Stetson,

My bad...

I was so focused on all the panel details, I forgot what I was writing... (pay attention, pay attention, pay attention to all the details...) distracted by the mental images of nice planes for sale.... :)

remember how simple a distraction can be C/E, gear up/down....Gumps, Gumps, Gumps...

now I need to go work on a Gumps procedure for posting.

Best regards,

-a-

Well you got me thinking, too. I need to check on the fuel tanks. Part of pre-buy look over item.

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PPIs are great for finding things that are not expected...  if you can balance it right, the PPI can be rolled into a full annual.  Same work being done if you request it. But it is done in an order to expose the most problem areas while spending the least amount of time/money. In the event the project needs to stop.

There are so many things we expect when an airframe is old or the engine has high time...

There are also a handful of things to expect when an airframe is low time or the engine has been under-used...

To find a plane that has low hours, (nice) and has been used often, (ideal) would make it close to being new... (expensive)

Best regards,

-a-

Edited by carusoam
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3 hours ago, highlowfastslow said:

Hey I just bought a '65 E last year, you're going to love it! With your PPI being done in Schaumburg are you also Chicago based? I'm over at GYY.


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Yes. MDW based- for Southwest. I have family in Hammond, Griffith and Calumet City. I live up in Michigan and will base the plane at 6D6 :)

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8 hours ago, mooniac15u said:

That engine has an interesting history.  According to the logbook it has less than an hour of tach time since 2014.

I know. Getting it borescoped and having oil sample sent off for analysis. The current owner, as I understand it, lost his medical.

The 2+ years of sitting has caused me some concern, but several sources have told me that, even sitting for extended periods, engines this far along toward TBO don't *usually have a catastrophic failure. They sorta slowly get worse until it's apparent that it's time for overhaul.

What are your thoughts? Thanks for the input! :)

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(0) Sounds like a nice story to make you feel good... (did it work? :))

(1) Then somebody comes along and tells you about engines that sat and had corrosion...

(2) and how corrosion effects the cam surface.

(3) and how the hardened cam surface isn't very thick.

(4) and that oil analysis works pretty well.

(5) and cutting open the oil filter really works well.

(6) Airplane ownership is Best done with both eyes open.

(7) expect that things can and will go awry.

(8) have a plan B in mind when it does.

(9) recognize the signs of a cam going away...

(10) look for signs of the cam going away...

(11) Accept that the Cam is going away when the signs are showing themselves...

(12) missing bits of cam lobe show up in oil analysis.  

(13) it shows up in the filter as a teaspoon of metal bits.

(14) the performance effects show up as longer T/O runs and slower climbs...

(15) photos of worn cams and the matching lunar surfaces of the cam followers are shown around here.

(16) It is not hard to get photos of your cam and cam follower surfaces when you need to.

(17) It is pretty easy to measure your planes T/O distance and climb rate.  Record weather conditions for comparison while doing so.

(18) compare your planes performance numbers to the book numbers.  They will be pretty close if the engine is in good condition.

(19) fortunately corrosion from sitting doesn't usually cause the engine to stop.  That's the realm of prop strikes... the effect of stuck valves are worth learning about too.  I got one in my first few hours of O360 ownership.  It had sat outside for a couple of years, unused...

(20) all things you learn about in aviation. The more you know, the better off you will be.  Learn from somebody else...

PP thoughts only, stuff I learned about here. 

Best regard,

-a-

Edited by carusoam
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My thinking is that if the engine were started and run to full oil temp, THEN cut the filter and do an oil sample, you would know if there is a cam problem.

My experience is automotive, but in an auto engine, once the flat tappet cam and lifters are thoroughly broken in, unless they are totally oil starved they will hang tough.  Until full break in, they are more delicate.  If the engine has had CAMGUARD or Aeroshell PLUS (which includes a CAMGUARD additive) in it during the set up time it has a better chance.  If I were purchasing, I would want to run it and cut the filter and send off a sample.  IF it is recently run without making metal, holds strong oil pressure and makes solid compression, it could have hundreds or even a thousand hours or more left in it.  The time to run it and check for metal is BEFORE you purchase it, not after.

My Cessna 140 with O200A is well past TBO and is very strong.  They are known for running reliably to a point almost double TBO if cared for properly.  With the reputation of the Lycomings engine used in our birds, it wouldn't surprise me if they too commonly fun far beyond TBO for those who choose to do so.  That said, my C Model has an engine with less than 300 hours total time, so I have not researched the statistical engine life of these Lycomings.

my$0.02,

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