63-C-

Mooney crash, pilot walks away

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Dan, Wow!, No words can convey my thoughts. What an amazing outcome. I have to agree with Guitarmaster, not luck, but God.

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Dan, a friend of mine, he got me back in the air after 20 years away, calls me a Mooney "fanatic".  I hear a story like yours and I know why I am a true believer in our unique planes.

God bless!

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Dan, I just sent you a PM. I am so glad to hear of a great outcome for once. Please know the Mooney Summit is available to help. These things have a way of really messing with your head also. You have made my day seeing your post!

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Dan,

This is the most amazing story of survival I have ever heard of. A miracle outcome of a terrible situation. I have one of those $5 CO detectors stuck on my panel but after reading this I'm rethinking it. So glad to hear you're going to make a 100% recovery.

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Dan what an amazing story, writeup.  I am so pleased to hear that you are ok and that you got home for your daughters birthday, thats the best birthday present ever.  

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Dan, Thanks for the posting. I nearly lost two dear friends, one 20,000 hour CFII, when his Cessna 150 leaked Carbon Monoxide into the cabin - this on a 1 hour training flight in which the heater was not turned on. The student pilot, a close friend I had induced to take flying lessons from my CFII friend, after about three quarters into the flight said that she wasn't feeling well, and wanted to return to the airport. Later the instructor told me he felt just fine, but if the student wanted to return, that was fine. As they flew back, as told to me, the instructor began to feel "woozy", and took the controls and managed to get to the runway. By then the student was barely conscious, and as the airplane rolled down the runway, he managed to get a door open before he fell unconscious. The airport has a "crash" fire truck, and the EMT pulled them both from the airplane, and an ambulance took them to the nearest hospital where they both stayed for more than 24 hours. They were lucky in that the CFII was skilled enough to get them to the airport, potentially saving their lives. Please MS forum members, install a "real" Carbon Monoxide detector in your airplanes. I use a panel mounted Guardian unit, with separate panel annunciation, and change the battery at every annual. There are a lot of other solutions, but I would not trust my life, and that of my passengers, to one of the (long expired) cards with a circle to check for Carbon Monoxide.

 

 

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I briefly mentioned our Auto-Heat system in the vendor forum.  Even before this incident, at a friend's suggestion, I have started work on a version with a CO detector that would close the heat, set a warning light, and potentially even open the vent.  I feel that this system would help pilots out in this type of event. The alarms are great, I have two, but you must still respond and do the right thing.  I am curious if this automated system is something others feel would be useful?

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1 hour ago, takair said:

I briefly mentioned our Auto-Heat system in the vendor forum.  Even before this incident, at a friend's suggestion, I have started work on a version with a CO detector that would close the heat, set a warning light, and potentially even open the vent.  I feel that this system would help pilots out in this type of event. The alarms are great, I have two, but you must still respond and do the right thing.  I am curious if this automated system is something others feel would be useful?

 

If it can be had for cheap, yes.

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Dan,

1) I'm so glad for your survival!

2) I'm glad you were able to post your story so quickly.

3) the story has generated so much discussion and internal/individual review on the CO topic.

4) trimmed for climb in an M20C is usually about 120mph.  The trim didn't change.  

5) your plane would have flown, descended and landed at 120mph.

6) Somebody has got your back!

Let me know if I missed something.

Best regards,

-a-

 

Edited by carusoam
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4 hours ago, carusoam said:

Dan,

1) I'm so glad for your survival!

2) I'm glad you were able to post your story so quickly.

3) the story has generated so much discussion and internal/individual review on the CO topic.

4) trimmed for climb in an M20C is usually about 120mph.  The trim didn't change.  

5) your plane would have flown, descended and landed at 120mph.

6) Somebody has got your back!

Let me know if I missed something.

Best regards,

-a-

I think I was trimmed slower than that, the events leading up to it are a little blurry.  I'm guessing I was trimmed for 100 ish.  I don't think I would have lived through 120mph landing.

I also recall entering direct to ONA in the 530 when cleared direct.  Muscle memory takes over and I immediately push the GPSS button to switch off heading mode. But I didn't on this flight. I think this might be the point I passed out.  The outcome would have been much different if I hit that GPSS button. 

Yes, someone must be watching out for me.

Dan

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Dan,

You are indeed one the luckiest airmen on the planet.  I am so glad you are here to tell the tale! I have shared your story with some of the locals and everyone is just shocked, yet heartened by the outcome.  People are going to be telling this story around airport lounge coffee tables for decades. Congratulations on becoming notorious and staying alive; usually it's one or the other. Wishing you a speedy recovery and long life!

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2 hours ago, Shadrach said:

Dan,

You are indeed one the luckiest airmen on the planet.  I'm am so glad you are here to tell the tale! I have shared your story with some of the locals and everyone is just shocked, yet heartened by the outcome.  People are going to be telling this story around airport lounge coffee tables for decades. Congratulations on becoming notorious and staying alive; usually it's one or the other. Wishing you a speedy recovery and long life!

Dan has been asked and has accepted to be on a panel at the Mooney Summit V of Mooney accident survivors to recount his experience and field questions from our attendees. If anyone else would like to join Dan and I to share their experience, please let me know (Neil, Jolie, got your ears on?). This seminar will most likely be followed by a seminar from Major Mari (Mars) Metzler, flight examiner for our F22 boys at Tindall on CO poisoning.

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12 minutes ago, Shadrach said:

Dan,

You are indeed one the luckiest airmen on the planet.  I'm am so glad you are here to tell the tale! I have shared your story with some of the locals and everyone is just shocked, yet heartened by the outcome.  People are going to be telling this story around airport lounge coffee tables for decades. Congratulations on becoming notorious and staying alive; usually it's one or the other. Wishing you a speedy recovery and long life!

Thanks, I always thought I would be remembered for my superior airmanship.:) But I'll take the lucky guy who is still alive.

I hope it is talked about for decades to come.  And I hope everyone who is involved with those conversations chooses to safeguard themselfs with good CO detection.  Clearly I'm happy with the outcome, I'm here. But I'm so mad at my self for not having a detector.  With the all detection devices available to us these days CO prevention should be as simple as not running out of gas. It just shouldn't happen.  

Since my accident so many people have told me stories of CO Poisoning that, by dumb luck, were not fatal. It's clearly a big problem.

Dan

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Dan, yours is an incredible story, and we are all thankful of the positive outcome!

But more importantly you may be the catalyst that results in MANY MORE lives saved.

As a result of your experience and your willingness to share it I have just ordered a new low-level CO Monitor/Alarm to use in my plane. I am ditching the little "spot detector" I've been using. While I occasionally look at the little "spot" it would never actively attract my attention like a true monitor/alarm. There are lots of models to choose from, and even if I have to replace the $60 sensor every couple of years it provides great peace-of-mind for me and my family.

Thank you sir, for I (and the whole aviation community) owe you a debt of gratitude for your lesson learned!

 

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This accident is a sobering lesson for us all.  Would those who have electronic CO detectors mind sharing details about which models are being used?

Clarence

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17 minutes ago, M20Doc said:

This accident is a sobering lesson for us all.  Would those who have electronic CO detectors mind sharing details about which models are being used?

I count 5 of them already recommended in this thread.

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I looked up mine...

http://www.aeromedix.com/safety-equipment/carbon-monoxide-detectors/ultra-low-level-carbon-monoxide-detector-co-experts-2016

As I aged, I lost the ability to notice light aromas, so I bought one of these portable devices proactively. Along with other devices around the house.  CO and nat gas.

Now the technology is pretty well proven, a panel mount device is next on the list.  

The portable is good enough for a warning that extends over a few flights... it may get missed if the CO occurrence is a strong first hit.

Do they still teach using the nose as a method to avoid CO poisoning?  They need to add act immediately at the first hint of an exhaust aroma...

Dan, your story is amazing. Please continue to tell it...

Best regards,

-a-

 

Edited by carusoam
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Dan has been asked and has accepted to be on a panel at the Mooney Summit V of Mooney accident survivors to recount his experience and field questions from our attendees. If anyone else would like to join Dan and I to share their experience, please let me know (Neil, Jolie, got your ears on?). This seminar will most likely be followed by a seminar from Major Mari (Mars) Metzler, flight examiner for our F22 boys at Tindall on CO poisoning.


Mike, even before I got to your post I was already thinking that this would make a great Mooney Summit topic. By that time, Dan will have all the details including the true cause of his CO leak and should make for a great presentation.

Dan, I'm glad you are still here with us and as others have said your experience may very well save other lives. I'm one of those with a spot detector that I rarely look at. NO MORE!! It's actually ridiculous when you think about it. I've spent lots of money on gadgets and other crap that actually adds not much more than convenience, but failed to spend a small amount on a real CO detector that can actually save my life!?!?


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This accident is a sobering lesson for us all.  Would those who have electronic CO detectors mind sharing details about which models are being used?
Clarence


I ordered this one: http://sensorcon.com/collections/carbon-monoxide-meters/products/portable-carbon-monoxide-detector-meter?variant=4193480964 which is also available on Amazon.

It's made in the USA, alarms at a low (35 ppm) level, and can be clipped on a seat-pocket. Having previously read the Aviation Consumer write-up on CO Detectors I believe the most important feature is detecting and alarming at LOW levels (unlike your typical cheap home-use detectors).


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This is what the Q&A said on Amazon about the one (Sensorcon) that I ordered:

Question: How long can this remain on? i want to use it in an airplane to keep an eye out for co induced hypoxia. thanks!

Answer: From what the manufacturer states the unit can stay on continuously for 2 years. I turn it on for my entire work shift at the fire department and turn it off when shift is over.
By JD on January 3, 2016

The meter can be turned on and left on. With normal usage and alarm frequency, if left on the battery will last approximately 2 years.
By Sensorcon SELLER on January 4, 2016

It won't turn off until you do it. Unlike other brands, you can clip this device to your shirt and have it on continously throughout your shift.
By mydleon1 on January 3, 2016


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2 minutes ago, cnoe said:

This is what the Q&A said on Amazon about the one (Sensorcon) that I ordered:

Question: How long can this remain on? i want to use it in an airplane to keep an eye out for co induced hypoxia. thanks!

Answer: From what the manufacturer states the unit can stay on continuously for 2 years. I turn it on for my entire work shift at the fire department and turn it off when shift is over.
By JD on January 3, 2016

The meter can be turned on and left on. With normal usage and alarm frequency, if left on the battery will last approximately 2 years.
By Sensorcon SELLER on January 4, 2016

It won't turn off until you do it. Unlike other brands, you can clip this device to your shirt and have it on continously throughout your shift.
By mydleon1 on January 3, 2016


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I think I like that feature better than the one I have which cuts off after 15 minutes and must be turned back on.

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11 hours ago, cnoe said:

Just wanted to comment for those who did not follow the link to that sensor:

For an extra $10 dollars you can get one that has a vibrating alarm, seems to me a very useful feature in a loud cockpit environment.

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