Filling o2 tanks

[jrwilson]

I would like to get an oxygen refill system so I can refill my built in tank.

I've  read topics on here about leasing  a big tank from a welding shop, so refills and exchanges are easy.

I'm hoping someone can give me some specific things I need to buy/lease. 

What size tank do I need?  Can I just use one?  What type of adapters and hoses do I need to fill the plane tank (part #s/websites).

My airport doesn't have oxygen service so flying to one that does, plus the $50 + per fill, is time consuming and pricey.  I'd much prefer to do it myself.  

Thanks in advance for the info:)

[Piloto]

Check with your local Scuba Dive shops that sell Nitrox (Oxygen + Nitrogen) mixtures. I have my portable tank filled with O2 from them for $15.

José

 

[jrwilson]

I have a built-in tank.  Trying to build a refill station.  

[carusoam]

I think Bob has posted some nice pictures of his tank filling process, including hardware and safety chains and other safety discussions that went along in the thread.

Best regard,

-a-

[DonMuncy]

I think that the monthly fees for tank rental would seriously decrease the savings from filling your own tank. I would watch Craigs list, etc. and try to buy one. Buying one new outright would probably ruin the economics.

As far as size. The bigger the better. The larger the tank, the more refills you get out of it.

If there is any way to get two tanks, "cascading" them will increase the number of fills per fill up (or the big tank(s))

You will need: (1) a gauge (cheap- anyplace, perhaps even Home Depot.), and standard fittings to "T" the gauge into the fill line. (2) A flexible line (Not too bad - Aerox or equilivant) (3) A fitting to match the one on your filling port. (More difficult, as it is not a standard fitting- Aerox will have them) (4) Fitting(s) for the big tank(s),(Cheap - from a welding supply store) and fittings to adapt the big tank fitting to the flexible line. (Standard - from Home depot)  (5) Standard copper tubing and standard fittings (Only if you are cascading)

Remember, handling oxygen, like aviation, is not inherently dangerous, but very unforgiving of ignorance of poor judgment.

Most important, the valve in your plane where you fill it, is finiky and expensive. When you fill, if it makes a rattling sound, that valve is bouncing and will soon fail. Slow down the flow rate until the rattling stops. It takes a little time. Don't hurry it.

Feel free to PM or call me for more details or clearer explanation.

Don 214 207-6744

 

 

[jrwilson]

Thank you, that is helpful and specific.  I'll send you a pm with a few more questions.  There was a setup on aerox that I'd like you to take a look at.

28 minutes ago, DonMuncy said:

I think that the monthly fees for tank rental would seriously decrease the savings from filling your own tank. I would watch Craigs list, etc. and try to buy one. Buying one new outright would probably ruin the economics.

As far as size. The bigger the better. The larger the tank, the more refills you get out of it.

If there is any way to get two tanks, "cascading" them will increase the number of fills per fill up (or the big tank(s))

You will need: (1) a gauge (cheap- anyplace, perhaps even Home Depot.), and standard fittings to "T" the gauge into the fill line. (2) A flexible line (Not too bad - Aerox or equilivant) (3) A fitting to match the one on your filling port. (More difficult, as it is not a standard fitting- Aerox will have them) (4) Fitting(s) for the big tank(s),(Cheap - from a welding supply store) and fittings to adapt the big tank fitting to the flexible line. (Standard - from Home depot)  (5) Standard copper tubing and standard fittings (Only if you are cascading)

Remember, handling oxygen, like aviation, is not inherently dangerous, but very unforgiving of ignorance of poor judgment.

Most important, the valve in your plane where you fill it, is finiky and expensive. When you fill, if it makes a rattling sound, that valve is bouncing and will soon fail. Slow down the flow rate until the rattling stops. It takes a little time. Don't hurry it.

Feel free to PM or call me for more details or clearer explanation.

Don 214 207-6744

 

 

 

[Bob_Belville]

20 minutes ago, carusoam said:

I think Bob has posted some nice pictures of his tank filling process, including hardware and safety chains and other safety discussions that went along in the thread.

Best regard,

-a-

Bingo. In my case I'm filling a portable tank, probably much smaller than your installed.

Here's one of the threads from a while back. Let me know if you need more info. If you use a lot of O2 it would pay to have a couple of large tanks to cascade. In my case I fill my big tank less than yearly.  

 

[carusoam]

The power of MS is exponential!

Thanks Bob!

Best regards,

-a-

[kortopates]

I have a two tank cascading system in my hangar. The Tanks are 220 cft tanks. That is about the biggest I can pick up to transport in my car. You will need a transfilling equipment and adapter to attach to the O2 portal on the plane. These are available from Mountain High http://www.mhoxygen.com/ and others. 

But before you go purchase a tank(s), I suggest you first call around and pick a near by gas provider and talk to them about tanks. Otherwise you may find the people you want to use won't service your tanks - at least not on an exchange basis - which will be an added inconvenience. I bought mine, to avoid a monthly rental cost. After more than 10 years I am certainly ahead. Even though I own them, I am able to exchange them for each refill and don't have to contend with hydro's or valve maintenance. Depending on your supplier you'll have a choice between welders O2 and Aviators O2. Yes, they come from the same source but they clean and vacuum the tank 2 or 3 times before they fill any breathable O2 container. Some people say their suppliers charge a lot extra for that, but mine does not and its not a big deal for them to do that either. I found a supplier that provides it to the military that was much cheaper than an Airgas store that I am sure you will also see locally. 

[peevee]

the filling system is cheaper here

http://www.chiefaircraft.com/ao-fbo-1.html

than mile high.

 

around here T tanks (320cu ft) rent for about $6 a month per tank, plus the cost of the fill. keep in mind those weigh around 130lbs each so you need some kind of cart. I haven't seen any tanks come up on craigslist for sale around here and I'm trying to sort out a cart setup for those beasts. If I could weld it'd be easier.

it's a $15 delivery charge to swap the tanks out for you if you can't take them in.

I think most people just use medical or welders o2.

Edited December 8, 2016 by peevee

[aaronk25]

A acclaim pilot and myself lease 2 great big orange steel o2 tanks for $150 each for 5 years. I bought a 24cu portable off of sportys and the cascade system.


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[jrwilson]

Any thoughts on this kit (fbo-0) ?  What else would I need?

[DonMuncy]

11 hours ago, kortopates said:

I have a two tank cascading system in my hangar. The Tanks are 220 cft tanks. That is about the biggest I can pick up to transport in my car. You will need a transfilling equipment and adapter to attach to the O2 portal on the plane. These are available from Mountain High http://www.mhoxygen.com/ and others. 

But before you go purchase a tank(s), I suggest you first call around and pick a near by gas provider and talk to them about tanks. Otherwise you may find the people you want to use won't service your tanks - at least not on an exchange basis - which will be an added inconvenience. I bought mine, to avoid a monthly rental cost. After more than 10 years I am certainly ahead. Even though I own them, I am able to exchange them for each refill and don't have to contend with hydro's or valve maintenance. Depending on your supplier you'll have a choice between welders O2 and Aviators O2. Yes, they come from the same source but they clean and vacuum the tank 2 or 3 times before they fill any breathable O2 container. Some people say their suppliers charge a lot extra for that, but mine does not and its not a big deal for them to do that either. I found a supplier that provides it to the military that was much cheaper than an Airgas store that I am sure you will also see locally. 

I agree that the gas provider will not want to "swap" tanks with you if you don't have "his" tanks, but they will fill yours for you and give you the same ones back. Very often, by about the second time you go, they won't notice that you don't have their tank (especially if the label on your tank has mysteriously fallen off), and just swap. Then you will have "their" tanks, and you are in business.

[Hank]

Seems to me that Dr. Bruce Chien wrote up how to build a refill station and posted it as a sticky somewhere in the AOPA forums a while back . . .

******************

Wow, I can't quote myself. Anyway, Bruce's post is on POA under Medical Topics. It's a sticky, so it's the very first thread there.

Edited December 9, 2016 by Hank

[peevee]

2 hours ago, jrwilson said:

Any thoughts on this kit (fbo-0) ?  What else would I need?

none other than maybe buy it cheaper elsewhere

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/pspages/fbo-1A.php?clickkey=7182

[StevenL757]

JR - I have that exact transfill system (2 T-size tanks) and a cart in my hangar (minus the small bottle).  I lease the tanks from my nearby (less than a mile) gas provider.  They also sold me the Scott adapter, CGA-540 adapter, hose, gauge...basically all the "FBO-1" components in that photo for less than $200...not $475.  I won't name that website (some of us know), but from past experiences, their prices - and customer service - are in need of a major overhaul.

Ping me if I can help with specifics not offered here, but appears you have good advice from several folks already.

Regards, Steve

[KLRDMD]

13 hours ago, aaronk25 said:

A acclaim pilot and myself lease 2 great big orange steel o2 tanks for $150 each for 5 years. I bought a 24cu portable off of sportys and the cascade system.

Orange ? Industrial and medical gas tanks are color coded. Orange is cyclopropane. I don't think I would be comfortable using "oxygen" from that tank. Oxygen is in a green tank in the US and a white tank everywhere else in the world.

[Yetti]

search ebay for "transfill adapter"  You can also find 540 adapters and flow meters.

[Bob_Belville]

52 minutes ago, Yetti said:

search ebay for "transfill adapter"  You can also find 540 adapters and flow meters.

I think I listed my EBay find in the older thread. It was a company that sells to the veterinary industry and had the best price I found ~ $100 for all you need to transfer from your bulk to your on board tank. 

[LANCECASPER]

30 minutes ago, Bob_Belville said:

I think I listed my EBay find in the older thread. It was a company that sells to the veterinary industry and had the best price I found ~ $100 for all you need to transfer from your bulk to your on board tank. 

Which of these would work on a built in system on a Mooney?

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=transfill+adaptor&_sacat=0

[29-0363]

Just a word of CAUTION when handling pressurised oxygen cylinders and filling apparatus.  

NEVER LUBRICATE or allow fittings to come into contact with grease or oil.

There is a SERIOUS RISK OF FIRE OR EXPLOSION.

http://www.megamedical.com.au/_literature_54771/Cylinder_Safety_Information

[peevee]

8 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

Which of these would work on a built in system on a Mooney?

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=transfill+adaptor&_sacat=0

this would work

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Oxygen-Transfill-Adaptor-CGA540-to-CGA540-Fill-small-Welding-tanks-/141041565692?hash=item20d6bb7ffc:g:O68AAOxye9lSElfW

then you would need a cga 540 to scott adapter, those are expensive.

http://www.mypilotstore.com/MyPilotStore/sep/9389?gclid=CjwKEAiAyanCBRDkiO6M_rDroH0SJAAfZ4KL-UQSNIovKzjgbV5eIvCgmp9VogWV4bEKDQCQY3owPRoC88fw_wcB

I ASSUME that's what you have, because it's what I have.

 

That has you at roughly $167, aircraft spruce has the adapter a little cheaper. If you wanted a two tank setup you could add a tee for about 40 dollars and two braided hoses for about $100, but then you're at about $320, when the full kit is only $350

 

what you really need is a gas booster that can pump the pressure from a depleted tank up to 2000psi so you can completely empty your tank, then I could get 2.5 fills per tank

Edited December 9, 2016 by peevee

[DonMuncy]

8 hours ago, peevee said:

what you really need is a gas booster that can pump the pressure from a depleted tank up to 2000psi so you can completely empty your tank, then I could get 2.5 fills per tank

You can get them, but they cost a few thousand dollars, and require a power source to operate them (compressed air, etc.) So most of us suffer the waste of retuning tanks with unused O2 in them.

[peevee]

1 hour ago, DonMuncy said:

You can get them, but they cost a few thousand dollars, and require a power source to operate them (compressed air, etc.) So most of us suffer the waste of retuning tanks with unused O2 in them.

one member here has a pneumatic driven. I keep watching for a used electric, it might happen some day.

[DrBill]

I got my big O2 tank on Craigslist for $25. Then bought transfill adapter.  I only use one tank since it's only c $20 to swap with a full one. For a bilt in tank, I might get 2 and swap them about.

Bill