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Very bad FBO experience


helitim

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Landed at Mather today near Sacramento to pick up an aircraft part that was being delivered to the airport FBO, Sacramento Jet Center.  The name alone should have been a tip-off.  We parked about 200 yards from the FBO building and walked to the door.  The delivery lady was waiting out by the curb with the part in a small box.  Turned around and walked back to the plane to leave.  We were on the ground no more than 5-10 minutes. Some young 20 something kid pulled up in his little truck and physically parked in front of the plane.  He said he was there to collect the landing fee of $20.  My buddy thought he was joking and just laughed.  We got in the plane to leave and the kid just kept sitting there waiting.  My friend got out and asked him to move.  He said no, that he was going to collect his money.  My friend told him that we had received absolutely no services from them and had not parked anywhere near their FBO so why should we be charged to park on a public ramp? The kid just kept saying "it's my job". For the life of me, I cannot wrap my head around how they feel compelled to charge you for this.  Is this common?  

They can rest assured, if the goal was to keep GA planes out, they have succeeded as far as I am concerned.  Total rip off.

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A quick read of the airport data supplied by AOPA and delivered by WingX....  which used to be called the AFD....back when people used to print books of knowledge...

There is a ramp fee...

It doesn't say how much or who to pay.  But, I guess the kid in the truck was there to help you with that...

We have a local Class D airport where people know the place to park.  Obviously, if you park at the FBO, they are going to send a kid in a truck on a mission...

Always read the AFD to find the details about the airport...

Know that at Class D airports, there is a lot going on.  Lots of people, approach equipment, and pavement that needs to be serviced...

The tactic to avoid paying for landing is paying alternatively for fuel...

The tactic of not paying for anything is to taxi directly to the hangar areas as if you live there and pay a monthly hangar fee.  I learned this by having to pick up parts at one airport. My airport manager needed a ride...

You can always ask the kid if there are alternatives like buy a minimum of gas.  Yes it is expensive, but you are getting a $20 discount...

Overall, I don't think you had as bad of an FBO experience as the kid had a crummy CB customer experience... :)

Just the facts...

there is so much to know.

Best regards,

-a-

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It is well inside the borders of the People's Republik of Kalifornia... and you are one of those "rich airplane owners"...


Thanks for politicizing Mooneyspace. Some of us prefer to think of places like that as an economic engine that drives the country. You don't need to tear it down....


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Hey buddy I don't think you are a "total boob". Annoys the hell out of me too when an airport that is paid for with tax dollars has an FBO on the airport and charges fees like this.  The FBO typically does not own that ramp space.  It is paid for and maintained by tax payers and the FBO should not be able to charge a ramp fee for someone not using any of their services.  If it is a private airport then that's a different deal but for a public tax payer supported airport why should an FBO be able to charge a fee for nothing when that ramp space has already been paid for by tax payers.  If that $20 fee went to actual airport maintenance that would be different but I've experienced FBO's at public airports charging me for a turn around without using any of their services.  The fee gets really high if your in a turbine.

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It's not as simple as public/private. Either way costs a lot to run a big airport. That FBO I'm sure pays a lot of rent. And I'm still not clear if you paid a ramp fee, a landing fee, or both... but I'm used to both at airports that size...


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I might venture a guess that the FBO is leasing his ramp from the airport and has to generate revenue to pay for it, it's called business.  I land at some airports that have landing or ramp fees and other airports that don't, it's life.  

Clarence

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I had the same experience there recently. They said they would waive the fee if I purchased 10 gallons. Airplane only took  9.2 so they let me slide on the fee. The trip was great though, because I met two U2 pilots from Beale AFB who were there on a training flight in their nightrider black T-38 Talon. They obliged me and let me check it out and showed me around.

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You I am afraid are a total boob!You are really going to bitch about a 20 dollar landing fee for your convenience!...just what planet are you from?You are a total clueless idiot....is this the future of avation from this brain dead idiot !Where did you learn to fly?How did you get so stupid and self assured?Fine,...you want to fly for free...like you expect someone to provide your landing spots at there expense?What exactly do you do expect is your future when all airports are closed because so many idiots like you can't or won't pay their fees...maybe next time heli heap try landing in the bay!Its so cheap for you ,I just know how you will give it positive reviews!I am so sad and discouraged to listen to this idiot....

You are totally out of line here. I'd rather be a boob than an ass...


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Your right it's life.  Luckily we have AFD's and pireps like this to help us navigate to airports that don't have meaningless fees.   Thanks for the pirep helitim!


How is the fee meaningless? It's a big class C airport. If you don't want to pay the price a private business wants you can land elsewhere. A phone call and you'd know the deal. No need to bad mouth them.


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Guest Mike261
35 minutes ago, thinwing said:

You I am afraid are a total boob!You are really going to bitch about a 20 dollar landing fee for your convenience!...just what planet are you from?You are a total clueless idiot....is this the future of avation from this brain dead idiot !Where did you learn to fly?How did you get so stupid and self assured?Fine,...you want to fly for free...like you expect someone to provide your landing spots at there expense?What exactly do you do expect is your future when all airports are closed because so many idiots like you can't or won't pay their fees...maybe next time heli heap try landing in the bay!Its so cheap for you ,I just know how you will give it positive reviews!I am so sad and discouraged to listen to this idiot....

since you opened the name calling window, and just said the hell with healthy discourse...

you I am afraid are a total Dick!

 

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15 minutes ago, gsengle said:

 


How is the fee meaningless? It's a big class C airport. If you don't want to pay the price a private business wants you can land elsewhere. A phone call and you'd know the deal. No need to bad mouth them.


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Not bad mouthing anyone.  Just thankful for the Pirep.    Don't understand why some FBO's at class C airports charge while others at the same airport do not.  I'm just asking what have they done to deserve a fee on a quick turnaround?  The runway and ramps are built and paid for with tax dollars at the class C airport I am talking about.  Why should an FBO be able to charge for a turnaround with no services offered.  In a PC-12 the fees are $100 for a quick turn around.  Just doesn't seem right to me.  Why do you think that it does?

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Once again, they pay a lot of rent to be there. How they recoup that is up to them and then you can choose to visit or not.

Pireps are unnecessary, you just ask them before you decide to go.


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1 minute ago, gsengle said:

Once again, they pay a lot of rent to be there. How they recoup that is up to them and then you can choose to visit or not.

Pireps are unnecessary, you just ask them before you decide to go.


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Pireps are nice.  Who doesn't like a pirep. Thanks again helitim!

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This post was intended as a pirep of what I perceive to be an FBO gouging customers just because they think they can.  I honestly wondered if this was a common practice.  Most of my flying career has avoided facilities like this.  My landing there did not affect this business in any way, shape or form. Why do they feel they have the right to charge for absolutely nothing.  Had I even gone to the restroom, at least there would have been value. Whether I can afford it or not is absolutely irrelevant. The ramp had to have been at least 50 acres with about 6 or 7 planes on it. We were in no ones way for sure. Yes, we could have called ahead but, I somehow believed the $100,000 or so dollars I pay every year in other taxes covered this public use facility. Shame on me. 

Most people on this forum have a certain educated decorum about themselves whether they agree with me or not.  That is your right. Name calling and getting personal is indicative of who you are as a person. Thinwing, I sent you a personal response. Feel free to follow up anytime. 

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There are just a few on this forum who regularly descend into cyber bullying, but thankfully there is a really nice ignore user feature on this forum. It's easy to have a few of these permanently banned from your feed. I have about 5 users on the list.

I used to be violently opposed to such ramp fees and would avoid airports with them like the plague.  I still try my best to avoid them at all possible, but after watching from the inside at my home field here in San Marcos, TX, I might have had a change of perspective. The city owns the airport and put in place a management company to run it.  They are slowly choking off business on the field by charging exorbitant lease rates. As leases come up for renewal, they often double the rent and then required the lessee to put $100K to $200K of improvements into the property as a condition of winning the lease. These are only 20 year leases meaning that by the time the lessee has paid off the bill for improvements, it's lease is over and the now improved property can be leased to someone else. There are two FBO's on the field and both are struggling to stay in business.

My beef would be with whoever owns/manages the airport, not the FBO or other business on the field.

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I think in the case of our local airport, it's all a bit short sighted. It seems to me the best way to get more money out of the local business on the field is to first provide the environment for them to thrive. Take a percentage of gross receipts rather than manipulating leases. It would be easy to increase gross receipts by having more airplanes on the field. There are probably 50 acres of land that could be used for hangars. There are currently more than 50 on a waiting list for hangars. Build hangars which will bring the planes which will increase activity at the local businesses, which will increase revenue to the airport?

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