iPad Question

[Parker_Woodruff]

Highly considering an iPad for IFR use and getting ForeFlight.

I don't have any need to spend $15/mo. for AT&T access.  I assume the app can be updated no problem thru WIFI or computer interface, right?

Any alternatives to ForeFlight that anyone has found useful?

I just want IFR charts everywhere I go for cheaper than buying the NACOs, and VFR charts would be a plus.

[sixsixX]

The ipad is awesome and foreflight is a great deal at 75.00 a year, and if you have an iphone as well , Foreflight allows you to have a subcription on both devices at the same time for the same price. The 3g wi fi model is the only one with built in GPS, and works increadable to follow while on charts . This is awesome in IFR , and for re-routes and fixes. You really will wonder how you lived without it.  Updating is easy over any wi fi connection.  The lower cost i pads will work , just no gps to see while you fly along on the chart, I find the added value of the gps model to be right one for IFR , the plates are about full size and are easy to read . There is a few lower cost options, but for the best value i have to say foreflight is the best and seems to be adding more and more value as they progress.  No need to activate the AT&T service, Wi fi works for all updates and 28 day chart and plates.  Quite possibly the best tool i have used in aiding in IFR flight!

[HopePilot]

Just got an IPad so I don't have any opinions yet, but I'm trying to figure out a better way to bring it into the cockpit.  Has anyone tried one of the RAM mounts that attaches to your seat rail?  I tried the RAM yoke mount, but the flexible rod concept seems like it might work better.

 

[leesh]

I have an iPad and the ForeFlight App (I love it)! Yes, you can do all your updates over WiFi. If you want the moving map function, you'll either need the 3g model or one of the two external supported gps units. I don't have the 3g version, and bought the 'Bad Elf' external GPS which seems to work well, but I haven't had much time to try it in the cockpit. Supposedly, the Bad Elf is a better GPS receiver than the one in the iPad, and ForeFlight is looking at making the approach plates available with moving map if used with an external GPS.

The first Bad Elf I received was DOA, but their support was good and they were great about replacing it immediately. My only complaint about the Bad Elf is that it slips out of the connection very easily, and as small as it is, it would be very easy to lose the gps under the seat. I wouldn't want to rely on ForeFlight as my primary navigation GPS and it isn't IFR certified. Of course, if you also have an iPhone (as I do), the app is universal and will run on that as well, providing some back up. The main advantage of ForeFlight is as an excellent flight planning tool, and the database update subscription which includes all the sectional and IFR chart updates is very affordable ($80/yr).

Alisha

Proud new owner of a 1967 M20F.

[Parker_Woodruff]

So the built-in GPS will work without an AT&T subscription?  That's good, unlike their phones which require something like $9.95/mo for GPS service...no thanks.

[leesh]

No, let me clarify that. There is no built in GPS in the WiFi model. You have to buy an external gps if you go that route. The Bad Elf GPS was about $100. 

However, this is the approach ForeFlight recommends, since the internal GPS isn't accurate enough to use with the approach charts.

I agree with your wish to avoid AT&T monthly service. Also, if you happen to have an iPhone with the old unlimited data plan, buying an iPad data contract forces you to give up the unlimited data for a limited plan.

Alisha

[leesh]

Looking again at your message ... I think you can buy an iPad 3g without the contract, and the gps will work. However, you actually spend less by getting the standard WiFi model and buying the external gps (which is more accurate).

Alisha

[Parker_Woodruff]

Quote: leesh

Also, if you happen to have an iPhone with the old unlimited data plan, buying an iPad data contract forces you to give up the unlimited data for a limited plan.

Alisha

[Parker_Woodruff]

Quote: leesh

Looking again at your message ... I think you can buy an iPad 3g without the contract, and the gps will work. However, you actually spend less by getting the standard WiFi model and buying the external gps (which is more accurate).

Alisha

[rob]

The new iPad is expected to have cameras, a better screen, and be thinner. It will likely be announced in January and sold in April.

[rbridges]

I bought a wifi Ipad for my daughter for christmas.  I was thinking about using it for the IFR charts.  great info in this thread.

[leesh]

Sounds like my schedule, Parker. I also have a 1 hr commute each way for work, and use Pandora.

I've wondered if my desire for speed in the air comes partly from the desire to be able to make the most of my personal time.

Alisha

Quote: Parker_Woodruff

Yeah, I have the unlimited plan on my iPhone and am hesitant to give that up till I establish a trend for data usage.

Phone says I've received 6.5GB since August and sent 573MB.

I'm sure a huge amount of that is listening to Pandora on my hour commute times 2 almost every day.  Plus 3 email accts currently.

[N513ZM]

and of course, with an iPad, one can buy PiELog...

 

 

[FlyDave]

Parker,

I have been thinking about an IPad as well but there are a few things that are holding me back:

1. 
   
2. For me, yoke mounting it does not provide enough clearance for me to hold the yoke comfortably.
   
3. The IPad is known to shut down in high heat situations (above 95 degrees F).
   
4. I wear polarized sunglasses and the screen is unreadable in portrait mode with polarized sunglasses.
   

Here's a post I started about the IPad, but there are quite a few other posts here on Mooneyspace:

http://mooneyspace.com/index.cfm?mainaction=posts&forumid=4&threadid=1913

Also, here's a video the AvWeb produced comparing the IPad to the 696.

http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/exclusivevids/ExclusiveVideo_AppleIPad_vs_Garmin696_Comparison_203547-1.html

I was enamored with IFR plates on the 696 when I saw it. The ability to read IFR plates at night without having to take my eyes off of the instruments for 5-6 seconds at a time sounded increadible. When I saw that I started investigating the IPad but found the 3 things I listed above that are now pushing me much closer to a 695/696.

Fly safe,

[FlyDave]

Another AvWeb piece on the IPad:

http://www.avweb.com/blogs/insider/AVWebInsider_iPadAgain_203450-1.html

[Parker_Woodruff]

Quote: FlyDave

Parker,

I have been thinking about an IPad as well but there are a few things that are holding me back:

For me, yoke mounting it does not provide enough clearance for me to hold the yoke comfortably.

The IPad is known to shut down in high heat situations (above 95 degrees F).

I wear polarized sunglasses and the screen is unreadable in portrait mode with polarized sunglasses.

[carusoam]

Parker,

I think every CFII should have something like this.  It can be financially challenging, but the reward is tremendous.  All the data / charts you are looking for at the touch of a screen.

IPad - Great source of charts and approach plates....

I have the I pad with all the memory and the internal GPS.  It has way too much memory for what I need, and now the Bad Elf is available.  Recommend:  Only buy as much as you need/want.  I use the wifi to load the charts, and GPS to use the charts, the AT&T service is not connected.

I have been using the WingX (Not completely happy with it).  It uses simplified IFR charts,  only the minimal amount of information is available.  MEAs, NDBs and published holds have been removed from the simplified charts.  Updates are still coming for the Ipad program.  On the plus side, It is so simple to use, my non-flying copilot was very capable of helping us navigate on a 1,000 NM trip.  Departure procedures, arrival procedures and approach procedures are available and organized for each phase of flight.  AOPA airport data is also available.

The company that provides for moving maps on the IAPs is Seattle Avionics.  It can be used with WingX (this is why I chose the WingX originally).  The subscription for the moving map IAPs is another $100 per year.  I think Ken Reed indicated for $300 he got a lifetime subscription!!!

Other favorite things.....Duat.com, flightplan.com    We could check our weather, file our flight plan, and fly our flight plan, all from the same small device.

Other things I need to get: 24V cigarette lighter / USB power supply.  They are available, just haven't bought one yet.

I have not had any glitches yet either.  I still have a slight fear of reliability on this device.  I still have paper back-ups printed from the free gov't charts.

I believe the Seattle Avionics can be used with other main apps such as ForeFlight and SkyCharts.

I loaded the ForeFlight free sample that was available.  It indicates 5 - 10m accuracy from my kitchen table. 

I think my next purchase will be SkyCharts for $20 it supplies moving map on IFR and VFR charts. 

The other 6 days a week, I pull emails from Outlook for work.  Not having success yet with AT&T Interwise yet.

Mooneyspace and the IPAD are not a perfect match.  Flash driven programs and Apple seem to be at odds with each other.

IPad is not a perfect device, but it sure beats 300 pages of paper charts in a book, in the dark, bumpy cockpit.

If you don't have one, get one.  If you are waiting, there will be other things than Apple products to consider also.  I couldn't wait any longer.

Best regards,

-a-

[Parker_Woodruff]

Quote: carusoam

If you don't have one, get one.  If you are waiting, there will be other things than Apple products to consider also.  I couldn't wait any longer.

Best regards,

-a-

[Immelman]

Parker,

If your needs are charts + approach plates, A/FD and GPS: SkyCharts Pro is the best deal at $20 a year. The base-model ipad has more than enough storage for downloading all charts for the U.S. If you get the model w/o 3G, there is no built in GPS; I have the BadElf GPS module that is tiny (1 square inch) that plugs into the ipad connector, and it works great.

I've been using this setup (well, the GPS is new) since May of this year, VFR, IFR, etc, and have been really pleased.

I hate recurring bills so I did not get the 3G model or any data plan, and its been just fine using wifi to download things.

Finally, for instructional use I like the iPad as a backup in case you need to refer to a teaching outline, manual, or FAA book. I've downloaded all the standard FAA teaching pubs onto it (free PDF downloads), my own outlines saved as PDF, all the Mooney maintenance manuals, and even some things to help me turn the wrenches on my airplane (AC 43-13).

[danb35]

Quote: Immelman

I hate recurring bills so I did not get the 3G model or any data plan, and its been just fine using wifi to download things.

[N513ZM]

Quote: carusoam

I couldn't wait any longer.

Best regards,

-a-

[eldeano]

I use my IPAD with a kneeboard, it also has a clipboard that folds over the top to write down apis etc. .  Airguide publications also just came out with a GPS unit for the IPAD that will geo reference  all of their charts and airport diagrams and soon IFR plates. Works via wi-fi no connection issues. 

It also has an aux jack that you will be able to plug in weather on XM or ADS-B soon.  I also have Skycharts, Foreflight and Radar's seattle avionics version.

I would like to see the Seattle Avionics moving map with the Airguide Gps plus ADS-B weather and I would be happy!  

Skycharts Though, has a great quick chart interface something Airguide needs to work on a bit. Cockpit usability!

P.S. polarized sunglasses  are not good for any glass cockpit applications, which sucks because I look good with my Maui Jim's!

But an Anti-glare protective film for the IPAD helps and is a must.

 

[KLRDMD]

Quote: FlyDave

For me, yoke mounting it does not provide enough clearance for me to hold the yoke comfortably.

The IPad is known to shut down in high heat situations (above 95 degrees F).

[eldeano]

Has anyone tried the Skyradar ADS-B/GPS reciever? Looks pretty cool.  Weather and a reliable GPS. I could sell my aera to pay for it and drop the $75.00 a month to XM. Not to mention the Garmin update prices.

[KLRDMD]

Quote: eldeano

Has anyone tried the Skyradar ADS-B/GPS reciever? Looks pretty cool.  Weather and a reliable GPS. I could sell my aera to pay for it and drop the $75.00 a month to XM. Not to mention the Garmin update prices.