sailon Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 On my 68F model with the J bar, I have the seatbelts with shoulder harnesses. The issue is that when I drop the gear, the J-bar catches the latch and undoes the seatbelt on both the pilot and passenger sides. I have found myself inadvertantly landing with my seatbelt undone in the first couple of flights. I have thought about getting longer webbing on the latch side, however, that would move the shoulder harness away from the center of my torso. Presently, I turn the buckle into my body after I fasten belt, but it is not the best solution. Ideas? Art Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N601RX Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 Push button latches like are in automobiles are available. Check with Alpha. http://alphaaviation.com/Mooney.html 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob_Belville Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 Yup, it happens to newbies and sometimes to veteran JBar folks. Try putting the gear down in a 2 (3?) step process: release from floor latch and allow the bar to come up a foot or so; pause, mindful of the seatbelt latch, ease the bar by the latch, and finish the process swinging the bar into the down&locked latch. About every 10 or 20 times without tripping the seatbelt you'll forget and get a reminder of your SOP. If that is not satisfactory the previous owner of my E had a Velcro strap around the seatbelt latch. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 Yup, it happens to newbies and sometimes to veteran JBar folks. Try putting the gear down in a 2 (3?) step process: release from floor latch and allow the bar to come up a foot or so; pause, mindful of the seatbelt latch, ease the bar by the latch, and finish the process swinging the bar into the down&locked latch. About every 10 or 20 times without tripping the seatbelt you'll forget and get a reminder of your SOP. If that is not satisfactory the previous owner of my E had a Velcro strap around the seatbelt latch. I naturally evolved into this semi-two step process. I unlatch the bar and slow it down a bit as it comes up to the seat buckle and I push the buckle out of the way with my thumb as i guide the bar past it. All with my right hand. It's almost second nature and i don't even think about it. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sailon Posted August 20, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 16 minutes ago, Hector said: I naturally evolved into this semi-two step process. I unlatch the bar and slow it down a bit as it comes up to the seat buckle and I push the buckle out of the way with my thumb as i guide the bar past it. All with my right hand. It's almost second nature and i don't even think about it. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk The "two step" sounds great for the pilots belt, what about the passengers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob_Belville Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 18 minutes ago, sailon said: The "two step" sounds great for the pilots belt, what about the passengers? You're easing the JBar by both latches but you can give her a head's up and she can pull her seat belt good and tight and away from the center aisle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsxrpilot Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 1 hour ago, sailon said: The "two step" sounds great for the pilots belt, what about the passengers? She can re-buckle her belt easily. She's not landing the airplane. Another option is to bend the edges of the latches downward. Your fist around the J-bar will slide past it much easier. For most of us, the correct answer is just Practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 If all else fails you could go for a "right checkectomy" Clarence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nels Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 On my old E model I fashioned two wide rubber bands out of an inner tube and stretched one over and around the edge of each latch. This allowed me to open the latch when needed but also held it in the latched position when my hand accidentally rubbed over or caught on it when moving the J bar. A larger bicycle inner tube would probably work better or maybe a wide rubber band is available somewhere that would work also. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 Interesting.... I think we have found another distraction measuring device. (Better/less costly than the GU landing) 1) This situation can happen to anyone during the landing phase of the airplane. 2) We have all done it enough to learn how to avoid it. 3) It still happens when we are the most busy trying to prep for landing and traveling pretty quickly while descending towards the earth's crust. 4) Is there a method to improve on GUMPS? U for undercarriage - down, but protect my seatbelt from disengaging while doing it? 5) Be polite while telling the SIC you just unlatched her seatbelt and she is on her own to get it back in place... 6) is it time to go around already? Another lap around the pattern while getting reorganized sounds like a pretty conservative idea. 7) I used the process Bob outlined above. Selecting a slower gear down speed is helpful. Too fast, the Jbar comes ripping through the cabin, un latching things that are supposed to stay latched, adding to the surprise..! I continue to be interested in how the brain actually works for some reason... And how it can let us down some times... And how we can modify our procedures to best protect us from our own brain fades... For Art, the OP. Yep, been there, done that in my old M20C. Just didn't have a group of friends to discuss the weird event that has been happening to you/me/us... Back in the day people reversed the direction of the seat belts... Kept the buckle out of the hot zone. Then somebody noticed the value of the three point harness. Now the buckle is back in the hot zone... Great discussion. Best regards, -a- 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetdriven Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 8 hours ago, gsxrpilot said: She can re-buckle her belt easily. She's not landing the airplane. Another option is to bend the edges of the latches downward. Your fist around the J-bar will slide past it much easier. For most of us, the correct answer is just Practice. Or buy the alpha belts and solve the problem surely and permanently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 Byron, How long has the alpha belt with the modern automotive latch been around? I don't have any old memories of it. unfortunately alpha doesn't have coverage for the long bodies. I'm supposed to go mega dollar airbag seatbelt...one of these days. Hope they come with the modern latch... Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob_Belville Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 16 hours ago, carusoam said: Byron, How long has the alpha belt with the modern automotive latch been around? I don't have any old memories of it. unfortunately alpha doesn't have coverage for the long bodies. I'm supposed to go mega dollar airbag seatbelt...one of these days. Hope they come with the modern latch... Best regards, -a- Hum, interesting to know that JBars are making a comeback in long bodies! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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