Who's Installing a G5?

[Danb]

2 hours ago, Marauder said:

 

He went to a shop that is not known for economical pricing. I will be getting a few quotes in the next couple of weeks. Other than the pitot static and electrical connections, he may have been charged for a IFR cert on top of it.


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Quite an understatement Chris. My friend will open and manage a new avionics shop at KILG, Flyadvanced is the owner. Mark will be in charge I'm sure you know him, Since Beechcraft Hawker closed their doors 11-1, he didn't want to be transferred., a new plus for Wilmington, about time. Another choice other that LNS.

[bradp]

The radio shop neighbor to east of Lancaster Avionics has some experience with the various flavors of G5s or so I've heard. 

 

This is regarding install of an experimental G5 (the one that actually has the HSI):

" My shop talked to the Harrisburg FSDO and was told that it's a minor alteration, logbook entry if not in the six pack, purely advisory, and had no effect or control of any aircraft systems. " - beechtalk.com,  https://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=129744&sid=f5e5f0b2ed590c13da397e1829d92ff1&start=30

I've also heard that for the experimental version - needs to be out of the six pack, no required instruments can be removed, but can be connected to the pitot, static.  For experimental version only, the AIRINC out from the GPS needs to tie in to the GAD-29 CANBUS to the unit - so it brings the cost of the experimental with battery and GAD in line with that of the certified.  It just has more install limitations, but can "do more".  Or so I've heard.

For those with a capable A&P or who can do the electrons themselves - it can be installed by any A&P / signed off (not just Garmin dealers).  There's an unlock code for the garmin website to get the STC documentation.  It seems like aside from a circuit breaker install and wiring from the GPS to the unit, it should be a pretty straightforward installation.  Those are, of course, famous last words. 

If anyone does this install in a late model F or early model J / K - please post your experience.  The panel clearance is quite tight vertically and I'm wondering if the same issue would happen as with George's...

 

 

[Joe Larussa]

My install started today. Will report back!

[GeorgePerry]

On 11/13/2016 at 11:25 AM, APTUS Pilot said:

So, George- Can you shed any light on this?

We are trying to determine if the HSI functionality is available at all in the STC'd version.

Thanks,

Ben

right now its just STC'd for AI replacement.  Hopefully Garmin will go the next step and STC an HSI replacement too, but I have no idea if this is something being looked at.

[GeorgePerry]

On 11/11/2016 at 5:46 PM, AaronDC8402 said:

I checked out a friend's airplane today with a recently installed G5. When you push the cursor button and scroll all the way to the right, there is a HSI button. Selecting that brings up an HSI. I know that Garmin has not (and reportedly plans not to) certified the G5 to be used as a HSI.

For those that have the G5 installed, do you have this page also? I would guess that it's "not for navigation" if it really is in there on the STC'd G5.

 

You can access the GPS derived heading info on the certified G5.  Although it needs GPS signal to work.  If and when Garmin produces a certified G5 HSI, it'll require a magnetometer to get heading info w/out GPS aided info 

 

 

[GeorgePerry]

On 11/14/2016 at 6:10 PM, Marauder said:

 

He went to a shop that is not known for economical pricing. I will be getting a few quotes in the next couple of weeks. Other than the pitot static and electrical connections, he may have been charged for a IFR cert on top of it.


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I did also get my IFR Cert done (Pitot static and Xponder check too)

[Marauder]

If the G5 can act as the primary AI, I wonder if they will allow it to display an HSI since both can't be activate at the same time.


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[GeorgePerry]

Here's a video of the start up and aligning sequence and the heading display that shows up once you enable the HSI page and are able to get a GPS signal.  

 

[MB65E]

Nice rain shower George! 

Thanks for the video.

-Matt

 

[OR75]

5 hours ago, GeorgePerry said:

I did also get my IFR Cert done (Pitot static and Xponder check too)

Pitot/static is required if you modify the pitot static lines but still steep result. Even with an antenna install (And I am not convinced it was needed) a 10 hours install max

  

[GeorgePerry]

1 minute ago, OR75 said:

Pitot/static is required if you modify the pitot static lines but still steep result. Even with an antenna install (And I am not convinced it was needed) a 10 hours install max

  

It was due...So I had it done.  Had nothing to do with the install

[Joe Larussa]

Okay so my install is going on twenty hours. I think this is more involved than I ever thought.

530 tray needs to be removed, wiring for GPS, and don't forget the recheck for static leaks

as well as jack the plane up and level it to adjust the inclinometer! Geeze!

[Kelly Householder]

Has anyone who has this installed done an approach with it and do you have a video?  Love to know how the GS and LOC function work or if they do?

[drclive]

I was quoted $500 by Sarasota Avionics (sarasotaavionics.com) but they did it at the end for $ 1k.

Best,

Clive

[NotarPilot]

On 11/18/2016 at 8:04 AM, Kelly Householder said:

Has anyone who has this installed done an approach with it and do you have a video?  Love to know how the GS and LOC function work or if they do?

As far as I know the GS and LOC are disabled on the STC'd version.

[NotarPilot]

On 11/17/2016 at 3:39 PM, Joe Larussa said:

Okay so my install is going on twenty hours. I think this is more involved than I ever thought.

530 tray needs to be removed, wiring for GPS, and don't forget the recheck for static leaks

as well as jack the plane up and level it to adjust the inclinometer! Geeze!

Holy crap! 20 hours!!! Are you being taken to the cleaners or is this a legitimate install? I was sold on it being a simple installation of about 5 hours.

[Joe Larussa]

5 hours ago, NotarPilot said:

Holy crap! 20 hours!!! Are you being taken to the cleaners or is this a legitimate install? I was sold on it being a simple installation of about 5 hours.

I was told the same thing by many people. It was a legitimate install. Maybe I got hosed, but I think there is more involved than people think. I would like to hear other people's experience. 

[Marauder]

Okay so my install is going on twenty hours. I think this is more involved than I ever thought.

530 tray needs to be removed, wiring for GPS, and don't forget the recheck for static leaks

as well as jack the plane up and level it to adjust the inclinometer! Geeze!

Joe -- something isn't right with your install. I read through the Garmin documentation and whatever they are doing seems to be more than what it should take.

The connections needed are pitot static, electrical and an optional data input from a GPS (they only show the 430/530 & the GTN series). The GPS connection is a simple line connection.

As for the ongoing discussion about what the G5 is certified to do, it is shown on page 10 of this document;

http://static.garmin.com/pumac/190-01112-11_01.pdf

It is primary as an attitude indicator (no HSI, no autopilot control, nothing else than an AI as primary) and secondary for everything else (you can't remove your ASI, altimeter, turn coordinator or VSI). The GPS signal if available will present ground track and ground speed. According to the documentation it is also used in the attitude indication if the signal is available.

Pilot's guide: http://static.garmin.com/pumac/190-01112-12_01.pdf

Joe -- I would ask this shop what the heck they are doing. I think 20 hours is excessive considering what the installation guide suggests.

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[Marauder]

Joe -- here is a picture of the GPS connection. The STC even allows them to splice into them!




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[Joe Larussa]

5 minutes ago, Marauder said:

Joe -- here is a picture of the GPS connection. The STC even allows them to splice into them!




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I'm thinking I got screwed. There is a itemized invoice stating what they did and how many hours it took. I don't understand it. Maybe I'm a sucker but everything always seems to cost more and takes longer than its supposed to. Again anybody who has had one installed please chime in. Thought I saw someone pay 3,000.

[DXB]

The G5 seems like a great device.  But I am waiting for it to be certified as a backup AI and carry over its Nav functions from the experimental version - or for someone else to make something similar. I have an Aspen PFD and no second nav readout presently.   It would be the perfect device to complete my panel while tearing out my vac system, without spending an arm and a leg. it would dominate the market if it could also be a backup AI.  It has a 4 hour battery, so what's the holdup?

Wishful thinking?

Anyone at Garmin listening?

[Joe Larussa]

On November 13, 2016 at 6:25 PM, NotarPilot said:

Holy crap! $3000 for installation? I was under the impression it would only take a few hours to install. I was thinking maybe 5 or 6 hours tops. I hope that $3000 was due to the movement of the Moritz gauges. I have a G5 ready to go in a box just need to schedule a day to get it installed.

Did you get yours installed yet?

[Marauder]

6 minutes ago, DXB said:

The G5 seems like a great device.  But I am waiting for it to be certified as a backup AI and carry over its Nav functions from the experimental version - or for someone else to make something similar. I have an Aspen PFD and no second nav readout presently.   It would be the perfect device to complete my panel while tearing out my vac system, without spending an arm and a leg. it would dominate the market if it could also be a backup AI.  It has a 4 hour battery, so what's the holdup?

Wishful thinking?

Anyone at Garmin listening?

Dev - if I am reading their STC correctly (and looking back at the FAA rulemaking on electronic replacements), I think the G5 should qualify as a primary backup for your Aspen. At least that is what I am looking to do now. As for future enhancements, with the GPS inputs, they could update the firmware and allow for an HSI on the certified box. My guess they rolled this version out for Oshkosh and future enhancements which require modifying the STC are in the works. 

[gsxrpilot]

Am I correct in thinking that two Aspen panels and a G5 would allow me to remove the vacuum system on my 252? It already has redundant electrical systems.

[OR75]

2 hours ago, Marauder said:

Joe -- here is a picture of the GPS connection. The STC even allows them to splice into them!




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An RS-232 can indeed be spliced. The only thing I am not sure about is that if it is configured a certain way , for example as "Shadin " for a port that is going to a fuel flow, it probably cannot be used for the G5 since the G5 needs to be configure as Mapmx. 

The GNS 430 has 4 RS-232 in/out ports , they are not that difficult to pull anyway. 1 hour max to remove the backplate and crimp 2 pins.