DonMuncy Posted July 29, 2016 Report Share Posted July 29, 2016 The FF meter in my 231 decided to die. My avionics guru determined it is the transducer that failed. He tells me this is Mooney part, and has a call in to LASAR. Since my JPI is a secondary only device, we can't tie a JPI transducer into the engine monitor for fuel flow. Until he pointed it out, I was not aware the FF was a necessary instrument, but that appears to be the case. Anyone have a transducer laying around, know of other sources, or have idea's about alternatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parker_Woodruff Posted July 29, 2016 Report Share Posted July 29, 2016 For people that are responding to this thread, Don has the FT-101 fuel flow transducer, IIRC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMuncy Posted July 29, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2016 Thanks Parker. You know my plane better than I do. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parker_Woodruff Posted July 29, 2016 Report Share Posted July 29, 2016 My bad, Don. You're talking about the transducer being bad, not the cockpit fuel flow instrument itself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cris Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 Don I believe that is a Shadin Flo Scan transducer. You can check with then to see. You might also remove it and attempt to clean it out. These are simple devices with paddle wheels that sometime get clogged. Should be an easy part to remove and clean before purchasing another just to be sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 (edited) When the transducer to our FT101 failed a few years ago I believe an OEM replacement was really expensive so we opted for a Electronics International FT60 , aka "Red Cube". The only issue was resetting the FT101 to the new K-Factor because it uses internal dip switches. Setting the JPI to the new number took a minute. Edited July 30, 2016 by flyboy0681 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peevee Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 (edited) Don, What symptoms did you exhibit? Did it drop to zero or go to max flow? Was it intermittent at all or just completely dead? Ours is also dying. Depending on the cost I thought this was a good option. http://www.aerospacelogic.com/index.php?dispatch=products.view&product_id=232 Edited July 30, 2016 by peevee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike A Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 Why does he say that it is a necessary instrument? It is not required by the FARs and not listed on the type certificate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMuncy Posted July 30, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 19 minutes ago, peevee said: Don, What symptoms did you exhibit? Did it drop to zero or go to max flow? Was it intermittent at all or just completely dead? Ours is also dying. Depending on the cost I thought this was a good option. http://www.aerospacelogic.com/index.php?dispatch=products.view&product_id=232 It reads zero , but will seem to work properly sometimes. Even though reading zero, at the end of a flight it would show a "amount used". However this may have been showing the amount used while it was working. The final determination was made when wiring in another transducer and when blowing through it gently, the unit showed a flow, but no flow shown when the same done with the original transducer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMuncy Posted July 30, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 3 minutes ago, Mike A said: Why does he say that it is a necessary instrument? It is not required by the FARs and not listed on the type certificate. I'm not sure where he got his information. He indicated that they are necessary on turbo engines. It was installed at the factory and is listed in the POH. I don't know how to check the type certificate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peevee Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 17 minutes ago, Mike A said: Why does he say that it is a necessary instrument? It is not required by the FARs and not listed on the type certificate. The explanation I have seen around here is that it is a required instrument to operate the e gone within the parameters of the poh. It seems about 50/50 on required or not. Our ei is more accurate anyway but not certified for primary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piloto Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 I had the same problem. Inside the transducer there is a rotary vane that rotates with the fuel flow. As times go by fuel residues accumulate on the vane shaft causing it to stop momentarily. I fixed the problem by spraying carburetor cleaner into both ports. Then blowing air by mouth into the inlet port until you can hear the vane rotating after you stop blowing in. So far after 1000hrs no problem. José Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtVandelay Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 I had the same problem. Inside the transducer there is a rotary vane that rotates with the fuel flow. As times go by fuel residues accumulate on the vane shaft causing it to stop momentarily. I fixed the problem by spraying carburetor cleaner into both ports. Then blowing air by mouth into the inlet port until you can hear the vane rotating after you stop blowing in. So far after 1000hrs no problem. José Do you have to bleed these engines when you disconnect fuel lines? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LANCECASPER Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 A couple possibilities: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Floscan-Fuel-Transducer-Model-201-Used-/152184198375?hash=item236ee294e7:g:xmQAAOSwENxXmVyb&vxp=mtr http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cessna-182G-Floscan-Fuel-Flow-Transducer-M-N-231-/331875811665?hash=item4d45570151:g:gA8AAOSwbYZXVyuK&vxp=mtr or better yet, a complete Shadin with transducer: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shadin-Fuel-Flow-Model-912041-/142068307787?hash=item2113ee574b:g:5sYAAOSwyDxXh51j&vxp=mtr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMuncy Posted July 30, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 Thanks Lance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 30, 2016 Report Share Posted July 30, 2016 The fuel flow transducer is made by Floscan, likely a 201 series. Cleaning it as Jose suggests is a low cost effort. Clarence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piloto Posted July 31, 2016 Report Share Posted July 31, 2016 9 hours ago, teejayevans said: Do you have to bleed these engines when you disconnect fuel lines? No need to bleed. After you reconnect the fuel lines turn the boost pump to check for FF. The whole process takes less than an hour and you can get the carburetor cleaner spray can from Pep Boys for $4. Worth the try. José 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerodon Posted August 1, 2016 Report Share Posted August 1, 2016 On July 30, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Piloto said: I had the same problem. Inside the transducer there is a rotary vane that rotates with the fuel flow. As times go by fuel residues accumulate on the vane shaft causing it to stop momentarily. I fixed the problem by spraying carburetor cleaner into both ports. Then blowing air by mouth into the inlet port until you can hear the vane rotating after you stop blowing in. So far after 1000hrs no problem. José Try cleaning, but don't blow. You can 'overspeed' and destroy the bearing quite quickly without fuel lubrication and cooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerodon Posted August 1, 2016 Report Share Posted August 1, 2016 On July 29, 2016 at 0:30 PM, DonMuncy said: The FF meter in my 231 decided to die. My avionics guru determined it is the transducer that failed. He tells me this is Mooney part, and has a call in to LASAR. Since my JPI is a secondary only device, we can't tie a JPI transducer into the engine monitor for fuel flow. Until he pointed it out, I was not aware the FF was a necessary instrument, but that appears to be the case. Anyone have a transducer laying around, know of other sources, or have idea's about alternatives. Don, I have spare transducers, send me an email to Supercub180@gmail.com. But I would be concerned if you have two transducers in series in your plane - the JPI can 'piggy back' of a shading transducer, and I'm sure with the hoskins too. Somewhere, I have a diagram, showing how to diode the one that is not providing the power. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zwaustin Posted August 1, 2016 Report Share Posted August 1, 2016 Instrument tech in Addison can sell you a new transducer. I just went through the same hassle with my Hoskins ft-101 unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N231BN Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 Per the M20K IPC, Floscan P/N 201B-M is a replacement. A Shadin Miniflo-L is a great replacement. I purchased one from Ebay for $250 with a transducer(now a spare) and emailed Shadin to get a copy of the STC. I had the older MP/FF gauge which quit like they all eventually do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMuncy Posted August 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 As several of you suggested, I cleaned the transducer with carburetor cleaner and induced my hangar elf to reinstall it. It works like a charm; at least for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piloto Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 36 minutes ago, DonMuncy said: As several of you suggested, I cleaned the transducer with carburetor cleaner and induced my hangar elf to reinstall it. It works like a charm; at least for now. Glad you fixed. Nothing better than a low cost repair. José Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtVandelay Posted August 2, 2016 Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 As several of you suggested, I cleaned the transducer with carburetor cleaner and induced my hangar elf to reinstall it. It works like a charm; at least for now. Did you see fluctuations before it stop working completely? Mine tends to bounce around and was wondering if I can benefit from similar treatment: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMuncy Posted August 2, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2016 No, mine either worked or it didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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