Let's talk about tires...

[Raptor05121]

In my 6 months or so as an owner, I'm learning a lot about what companies make what, who to stay away from, etc etc. The tires on my plane are mismatched (three different manufacturers with three different types and some aren't even the same ply) and one has a minor flat spot. I plan to learn my Mooney on these, get the bad landings out the of way, and then when I'm comfortable, I plan to put new tires all around.

As far as tires go- I have no idea what brands out there (other than Michelin and Goodyear) are good or bad. I'm looking in my Spruce Catalog and I see some manufacturers have two or three different types. I'd like to purchase new, I'm not interested in retreads. Once I'm out of annual, I plan to fly at least 100 hours a year, probably be close to 200 a year. It's hanagred so I have no worry about UV damage and rot, I'm sure I'll wear them out long before they go bad.

Also, I see the nose tire on the C is optional at 4 or 6 ply? What are the difference between them? What about weight? Would one not be interested in the lightest tire as far as useful load and initial spin-up inertia when landing?

[Marauder]

There is a thread out there on tires, but for what is worth, I switched to McCreary Air Hawks a few years ago and they have been fine. Never saw any real performance difference between the Michelin, Goodyear Flight Customs (all flavors) and the McCreary's.

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[Hank]

I keep GoodYear Flight Customs (1, NOT 2 or 3) on the mains and a condor nose tire, which seems to last half as long as the mains. The important thing is the tube inside, Michelin Leak Stops. Hardly ever need to add air other than the change of seasons.

[DXB]

+1 on Michelin Leak Stops.  My plane had them installed just before I got it.  When I bought the plane, I also bought a fancy compressor gun for the hangar, figuring I should pay a lot more attention to my planes tire pressures than I do for my rather neglected car.  I hardly ever needed to use the thing, so now it lives in my car!

[1524J]

Air Hawks and Michelin Airstop tubes. But I'm going to try retreads if I can ever fly enough to wear down the Air Hawks. Make sure to replace the tubes. I'm a devout CB but I won't reuse tubes.

[clh]

If you keep off the brakes, the leakstop tubes will last with whatever "cover" you put on them...  My first set of airhawk tires lasted 6 years and about 500 landings.  I am told the "higher quality" tires (Michelin or Goodyear) will last longer, but I find it hard to justify.  (I am a CB after all)  

I am only brand loyal to the tubes because keeping the tire pressure right is the most important issue.   I have had a couple of nose wheel flats over the years, but I think that is because I keep replacing the tubes with whatever is available when the @#$%#@ thing goes flat.  Again, I'm too cheap to just buy the good tube and replace the crap while it is inflated... I may have to start carrying an extra couple of tubes and hope they are not dry-rotted when I need them.

 

 

[RangerJim]

I've had good service from Condor tires along with the above mentioned Michelin Air Stop tubes.  I concur with not reusing tubes unless you you are really in a bind and then only as a temporary fix (a two beer story).  I'm told Condors are a down market product from Michelin manufactured in Thailand but haven't independently confirmed this.  The type certificate data sheet for my C specifies a 4 ply tire for the nose.  YMMV.  Try the Desser Tire website for CB prices and fresh stock.  Your plan to wear out your current tires getting familiar with your bird sounds good to me.  I'm thinking about the retreads too but have a ways to go on the Condors yet. 

Edited April 15, 2016 by RangerJim

[Raptor05121]

Okay, so I'm a little confused here. You guys run tubes in the inner, aka like a bicycle and lawnmower? So the tires are tread only? Is this the ONLY way to do it or can one just run tires only?

Hank, what are the differences between the Flight Custom 1, 2, and 3s? Why only the 1s?

[DonMuncy]

If you are asking if our planes ever have tubeless tires. No, I don't think so. We all have tubes.

[carusoam]

More like 1960s cars...  Soft rubber, no sidewall strength, no white lettering or stripes.  No high G cornering capabilities at all.  They only go 50,000 miles when they are tucked away.

they go from 0 to 60 mph in a few inches of contact with the runway's surface.  Their only complaint is a nice chirp.  Tubes only, no run-flats or radials.  Wear is evident when threads are showing.  Usually related to a flat spot from locking up the brakes.

Best regards,

-a-

[1524J]

5 minutes ago, Raptor05121 said:

Okay, so I'm a little confused here. You guys run tubes in the inner, aka like a bicycle and lawnmower? So the tires are tread only? Is this the ONLY way to do it or can one just run tires only?

Hank, what are the differences between the Flight Custom 1, 2, and 3s? Why only the 1s?

We've all got split rims as far as I know. Tubeless wouldn't work.

[rbridges]

8 minutes ago, Raptor05121 said:

Okay, so I'm a little confused here. You guys run tubes in the inner, aka like a bicycle and lawnmower? So the tires are tread only? Is this the ONLY way to do it or can one just run tires only?

Hank, what are the differences between the Flight Custom 1, 2, and 3s? Why only the 1s?

I bought Flight Custom 3s for my mains, but I'll probably switch to a less expensive tire next time.  My tire has a higher speed rating (I believe the sidewall is thicker), but it's kinda wasted on my plane.  

[M20F]

42 minutes ago, clh said:

If you keep off the brakes, the leakstop tubes will last with whatever "cover" you put on them...  

 

 

I find if you hit the brakes with any flappage the tendency is going to be a bald spot.  Even though if you are careful hit a little fast in a cross wind and they will scuff.  That low wing generates a ton of ground effect lift.

To the OP I use the cheapest tires and tubes, never noticed a lot of difference.  Personally I don't like retreads but that is just me, others swear by them (not looking to start a debate).

Enjoy the Mooney I have 40hrs booked in May for work locations, gonna be fun; efficient with my time; and cheap.   

[Raptor05121]

Awesome, thanks for the info guys. I had no idea we had tubes. I'm just so used to the automotive mentality of tires.
 

I'm very fond of Michelin tires on my truck, I do love their product. I will look at their tires and tubes. Thanks for the info, I learned something.

[Hank]

I've not tire shopped for my Mooney in several years, but the best I can remember the main difference between Flight Custom 1, 2 & 3 is the speed rating and the price. FC3 cost almost double FC1, and have a speed rating of either 140 mph or 140 knots. For my plane, Vgo = 120 mph, but the tires will never touch the ground at that speed. My preference is to land with the stall horn squalling, which is generally in the low-60-mph range. Why pay more for stiffer sidewalls and higher speed ratings? Oh, yeah--takeoff, right? My Owners Manual says to rotate at 65-75 mph.

So the much less expensive FC1 works just fine! At 2575 lb gross weight, that's not a factor, either. Besides, when you price the tubes, you'll be glad to buy the less expensive tire . . . . .

[Parker_Woodruff]

I like Condor.  Reasonably priced and seem to last a long time.

[Shadrach]

This topic has been hashed and rehashed many times! Use the search function my boy! 

I like Wilkerson retreads.  They are outstanding!

 http://wilkersonaircrafttires.com

[Andy95W]

1 hour ago, Shadrach said:

This topic has been hashed and rehashed many times! Use the search function my boy! 

That's all well and good, Ross, but it doesn't help me decide if I should use flaps on takeoff!

[rbridges]

Just reviving an old thread.  I ended up "stepping down" to flight special II for my right side main, but I'm still getting the michelin airstop tube.  best price I could find was desser.  Just wanted to remind AOPA members that you can get $10 off 100 with the promo code.  $172 shipped for new tire and tube.  

[Hank]

9 hours ago, rbridges said:

Just reviving an old thread.  I ended up "stepping down" to flight special II for my right side main, but I'm still getting the michelin airstop tube.  best price I could find was desser.  Just wanted to remind AOPA members that you can get $10 off 100 with the promo code.  $172 shipped for new tire and tube.  

That's what I have on my mains, on purpose. The big difference that I could see with Flight Special III is the speed rating is equal to my cruise speed, and I didn't see a benefit for the extra money. But Air Stop tubes are the way to go! I'll be replacing my nose tire soon, with all the turning it lasts about half as long as the mains.

[rbridges]

Just now, Hank said:

That's what I have on my mains, on purpose. The big difference that I could see with Flight Special III is the speed rating is equal to my cruise speed, and I didn't see a benefit for the extra money. But Air Stop tubes are the way to go! I'll be replacing my nose tire soon, with all the turning it lasts about half as long as the mains.

Yeah, I'm not sure if it's any different besides sidewall strength.  $60 less though!

[BKlott]

On 4/14/2016 at 6:42 PM, Marauder said:

There is a thread out there on tires, but for what is worth, I switched to McCreary Air Hawks a few years ago and they have been fine. Never saw any real performance difference between the Michelin, Goodyear Flight Customs (all flavors) and the McCreary's.

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Similar experience except I started with Goodyears and they just didn't hold up. Went to the Air Hawks and realized much longer life. Never looked back

[Tommy]

Can anyone actually tell any difference - objectively - when it comes to the longevity and ride smoothness of different tires especially after so many contradicting anecdotal evidences. When I heard someone said one tire lasted longer than the other, I often wonder if s/he actually logged the distance traveled and the landings made (including the surface condition of the runway used and quality of the landings) for each and every tire? If not, how can one say with any confidence which tire lasts longer and more resistant to flat spots etc? Unless there was an independent testing done?   

My $0.02: get the cheapest one out there! Lol. But definitely worthwhile getting a good tube unless you are prepared to pump the tire every 2 weeks. 

[Raptor05121]

4 hours ago, Tommy said:

 

My $0.02: get the cheapest one out there! Lol. But definitely worthwhile getting a good tube unless you are prepared to pump the tire every 2 weeks. 

 

This. I talked to the Desser guys for about 45 minutes at Sun N Fun. He was blunt with me and when I told him I was (then) flying 20 hours a month and about 50 landings a month, his eyes got real wide and told me I should either get the Monster retreads or go for their lowest priced option, which was IIRC $340 for three retread tires and Desser tubes.

I know, I know, Michelin air-stops, but the Desser guy told me they have good warranties on theirs, AND I'm a broke owner, AND the tubes I have on my plane are no-name knockoff installed in 2013 and for the past 100 hours and 250 landings I have in my plane, I've only had to adjust them once, going from winter to summer temps here in FL I needed to let out a few PSI. I've never had to bring my air compressor to the hangar. They still hold their pressure.

As soon as my exhaust comes back and I get a few maintenance checkout flights done, the cheapest tires from Desser will be on order. I might spring for the 11/32nd Monsters for IIRC $40 more.

[N201MKTurbo]

3 hours ago, Raptor05121 said:

I might spring for the 11/32nd Monsters for IIRC $40 more.

You can't use the Monster tires on thr Mooney. They are too big. They will grind the zerk fittings off your gear legs and ruin the paint. 

I bought a set once, being a CB I bought a tire grinder from Jegs and ground about 1/4 inch of tread off of them so I could use them.