Anyone wondering why the Chinese bought Mooney?

[Andy95W]

From my experience, living abroad as an employee of the US Government is completely different from living abroad as a private citizen. And especially from living on a US Base abroad which is almost like being in a little US bubble. Living and working abroad as a private citizen got me a much deeper immersion in the local culture and with the local people.

I don't disagree, to a point. Maybe partial credit. I found it depends on the individual. Some went out and explored, and learned as much as they could of the locals and life in that country, and others just stayed in the barracks.

Living now in the Detroit area, I know some Ford and GM employees that go overseas and never do anything to learn about the country they're posted in. Unless it's England. They seem to like England. Again, I think it depends on the individual.

[Omega703]

From my experience, living abroad as an employee of the US Government is completely different from living abroad as a private citizen. And especially from living on a US Base abroad which is almost like being in a little US bubble. Living and working abroad as a private citizen got me a much deeper immersion in the local culture and with the local people.

I'm reading this over generalization on the bullet train from misawa to tokyo, but I don't disagree that one can put them self in a cocoon, especially when it's more convenient. The further removed from western culture, the more convenient it becomes to "hole up". I disagree that this is a difference between civilian and government employees. Your post strikes me as a generalization about military members, where I believe it's an individual issue. I don't profess to speak fluent Japanese, but I can get around without shaming America and appreciate the advantages (namely education, friendliness and a non-existent crime rate) our eastern allies have over us.

It may surprise you and many others to know that there are many military professionals that have spent years at the defense language institute to be made fluent in a foreign language (Arabic, Korean and Japanese are some if the more popular languages) only to proceed to foreign military developmental education for the very reason of cultural submersion and understanding.

Lastly (and more on topic), working with the many Japanese professionals that ensure my airspace and aerodrome are safe has been a pleasure I won't forget. Like you said, they speak much better English than I do Japanese (a comment I often mention to ATC when they get frustrated with themselves over the difficulty communicating with the US traffic). It's lots if fun flying VFR from the surface to FL280 in my (the tax payers) supersonic death machine.

Maybe I took your post out if context- if so I apologize. But if my interpretation is accurate, you are ignorant of the experience us unwashed military members have had the good fortune of having while stationed abroad. To me and my family, our experience does "count".

[gsxrpilot]

I don't disagree, to a point. Maybe partial credit. I found it depends on the individual. Some went out and explored, and learned as much as they could of the locals and life in that country, and others just stayed in the barracks.

Living now in the Detroit area, I know some Ford and GM employees that go overseas and never do anything to learn about the country they're posted in. Unless it's England. They seem to like England. Again, I think it depends on the individual.

 

 

I'm reading this over generalization on the bullet train from misawa to tokyo, but I don't disagree that one can put them self in a cocoon, especially when it's more convenient. The further removed from western culture, the more convenient it becomes to "hole up". I disagree that this is a difference between civilian and government employees. Your post strikes me as a generalization about military members, where I believe it's an individual issue. I don't profess to speak fluent Japanese, but I can get around without shaming America and appreciate the advantages (namely education, friendliness and a non-existent crime rate) our eastern allies have over us.

It may surprise you and many others to know that there are many military professionals that have spent years at the defense language institute to be made fluent in a foreign language (Arabic, Korean and Japanese are some if the more popular languages) only to proceed to foreign military developmental education for the very reason of cultural submersion and understanding.

Lastly (and more on topic), working with the many Japanese professionals that ensure my airspace and aerodrome are safe has been a pleasure I won't forget. Like you said, they speak much better English than I do Japanese (a comment I often mention to ATC when they get frustrated with themselves over the difficulty communicating with the US traffic). It's lots if fun flying VFR from the surface to FL280 in my (the tax payers) supersonic death machine.

Maybe I took your post out if context- if so I apologize. But if my interpretation is accurate, you are ignorant of the experience us unwashed military members have had the good fortune of having while stationed abroad. To me and my family, our experience does "count".

 

All points well taken. I am certainly making a gross generalization. But I've had some experience on both sides and was speaking based on that personal experience.

[aviatoreb]

Seems to me like lots of racism hidden as a joke, and then exclamations that anyone who calls them on it should "lighten up."

 

Can it be that all Chineese are hard workers and industrious?  I don't know.   I have taught many Chineese graduate students in my mathematics PhD program over the years. There is something special about a person who is wiling to leave everything they know, to travel halfway around the world, to study in a graduate program in a language that they have not yet mastered.  Usually the students I have seen do very well, through hard work.  These are the go-getters.  The ones who specifically go-get.  These aren't the average folk I presume even from their home. The ones who got up and through great effort want to better themselves take significant risk and willing to work very hard.  That takes some impressive courage.  Their English usually improves dramatically as they study alongside US students, and also students from other countries.  (Graduate studies especially are essentially an export industry in the US).

 

Seems to me like these folks who leave the comfort of their home to better themselves reflect the same virtue of all the other immigrants who came and built America, the best of our past on which we built this country, over the last 200+ years.  So what's the gripe?  Irish, Polish, German, Swedish, Chineese, African, Eastern European, Middle Eastern, and on and on, we are a country of immigrants, and each group seems to face some racism up hill battle when they are new, and then turn around and then some of the next generations the shovel out the same.  I know, I should "lighten up."

[PTK]

You're absolutely correct Erik.

US students continue to score below average on mathematics, science and reading proficiency.

Yes, below average in reading!!!

Several years ago we built a brand new library here in Cherry Hill to the tune of 6 million taxpayer $$.

Walk in at any given day after school hours and you'll see predominantly kids of immigrants... STUDYING!!

Where are "american" kids? Taking all they have for granted and wasting their life away aimlesly at the mall or anywhere else but the library.

Please don't tell me to lighten up. I can't.

[ryoder]

American kids have grown fat and happy by their parents and the government that coddles them and tells them they are special and gives them a participation trophy. Time for parents to stop being helicopters and put the fear of economic failure in them at an early age.

[flyboy0681]

American kids have grown fat and happy by their parents and the government that coddles them and tells them they are special and gives them a participation trophy. Time for parents to stop being helicopters and put the fear of economic failure in them at an early age.

 

I agree entirely, and imagine their disappointment when their lackluster outlook gets them a job that earns slightly more than minimum wage. It used to be when a youngster asked for advice that an older person would respond "stay in school and don't do drugs". Now it should be "stay in school, bury your head in math and science and the world will be your oyster".

[Mooneymite]

American kids have grown fat and happy.

 

 

Modify that to read, "Some American kids...." and I'll agree with you.  Certainly not all.  

 

We still have parents who teach good values/morals to their kids and take their parenting very seriously.

 

God bless them!

[aviatoreb]

You're absolutely correct Erik.

US students continue to score below average on mathematics, science and reading proficiency.

Yes, below average in reading!!!

Several years ago we built a brand new library here in Cherry Hill to the tune of 6 million taxpayer $$.

Walk in at any given day after school hours and you'll see predominantly kids of immigrants... STUDYING!!

Where are "american" kids? Taking all they have for granted and wasting their life away aimlesly at the mall or anywhere else but the library.

Please don't tell me to lighten up. I can't.

 

So its pulling toward education - and I raised education just because it is in this setting I see young and energetic Chineese students.  I just want to add a hint of optimism to your remark.  ...

 

The statement that US students STEM scores, and education generally is slipping is true in my opinion, but it relates to averages, and without going into what I think are causes, let me say:  I can say I have the distinct privilege to work with the front of the class - those who grew up in the US who are qualified to seek a PhD - rest assured that I have seen some VERY impressive home grown genius young folk who stand shoulder to shoulder with the very best from other countries, and sometimes ahead.  I am not at all worried about our front of the class.  Its the middle that is slipping that I am worried about.

[carusoam]

Nicely stated, Erik...

Best regards,

-a-

[gsxrpilot]

Thank you Erik, you said it much better than I.

[MyNameIsNobody]

Help me out. What in this thread was racist or had racial undertones? If I am to understand racism as defined here by Erik I want to hear "his definition" as used in this thread.

[Rhumbline]

Help me out. What in this thread was racist or had racial undertones? If I am to understand racism as defined here by Erik I want to hear "his definition" as used in this thread.

 

In post-racial America, you are a racist if you are not a minority and disagree with the POTUS or the administration's policies.  If you also have conservative leanings, you are churlish, greedy and without compassion in addition to being racist.  If you are not a minority, have conservative leanings and own a firearm, you are also a domestic terrorist. 

[MyNameIsNobody]

O.K. Thanks. Got it.

[par]

The first step to fixing current day America is to fix the idea of Family, which will magically lead to education. Unfortunately, I don't think any of this will happen before the next major economic disaster, which I believe is around the corner. 

[cliffy]

Both my sons teach in high school.Both agree that those who excel in school have parents that show up on parent's night. Those that don't-

do something less meaningful in life.

[HRM]

Sometimes the depth of arrogance and lack of sense of humor on this board is astounding...humor and jokes are often at the expense of others. Not possible to not offend someone in this PC world. Humor. Something the world needs more of.

 

That's what  's are for. Not enough use of them.

[fantom]

That's what  's are for. Not enough use of them.

 

Amen!

 

Interesting that those who complain the loudest are many times themselves most in need of more relaxed reactions to what others have to say.

[Johnnybgoode]

Modify that to read, "Some American kids...." and I'll agree with you. Certainly not all.

We still have parents who teach good values/morals to their kids and take their parenting very seriously.

God bless them!

God bless my wife - a homeschooling mother of 4!

[MyNameIsNobody]

Amen!

 

Interesting that those who complain the loudest are many times themselves most in need of more relaxed reactions to what others have to say.

As Pee Wee used to say "I know you are but what am I"....Ha Ha....

and

"There's no basement in the Alamo"?!!!!!!