Gear indicator on retraction - '87 252 TSE

[IndyTim]

On retraction, my gear unsafe indicator (on the floor) doesn't fully turn to green. I see just the beginning of the green line, mostly showing the red hatch.

I did a flyover at the tower, to see if they could detect any gear door issues, and they reported the underside looked clean. There are no Issues on extension - the time to extend and all indicators are normal.

What must happen for the indicator to go full green? I assume there is a pressure switch somewhere?

[Parker_Woodruff]

Hi Tim,

 

I might not be understanding your question correctly.  I think the indicator on the floor will only show full green on gear extension.  On retraction, the gear unsafe light on the annunciator panel should go out.

 

As always, check gear rigging anytime the plane is on jacks & at annual inspection.

[kortopates]

Parker is of course exactly right. The red gear unsafe light should on be on during transit only and the green gear down light should only be on only when the gear is down and locked - any discrepancy should be checked out with the plane on jacks right away.

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[duke]

he is talking about the floor indicator,Green with black line in center is gear down and locked.  red crosshatch is gear retracted.

[DonMuncy]

I could be wrong, but my impression is that the floor indicator is a mechanical tab that swings into the correct position when the gear is up or down. I think it may be spring loaded toward the up position and only swing the thin bar in position when the gear is down. If that is the case, one would have to open up the belly panel and look to see what is going on.

[duke]

floor indicator is a decal stuck to main retract tube--actuator attatched to it to make it rotate which in turn moves 4 push-pull tubes which actuate gear.

one foe each main and two for nose.

[N201MKTurbo]

it is not even a tab, it is a sticker. Most people who rig Mooney gear are so concerned with preload, they may overlook the gear up situation. When I got my current plane the two wheels retracted way different. They had the gear doors rigged so they closed alright, but one had a big stack of washers on it. Just saying....

 

Anyway the sticker was probably placed to properly indicate down and locked and nobody checked how it looked with the gear up.

[DonMuncy]

Ah, someone much more informed than me. At least I was right about it being mechanical.

Sorry for the misinformation.

[Marauder]

it is not even a tab, it is a sticker.

Not sure when the design changed, but mine is a piece of plexiglas that slides back and forth with the gear movement.

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[IndyTim]

My floor indicator has a plexiglass cover over top of a sliding label that shows two states: safe (green) and unsafe (red cross hatches). This does appear to be mechanically activated, as mentioned above.

EDIT: I'm going to amend my comment above. Per Hank's comment below, there could be three states: GREEN (gear down), RED BARBER POLE (in transition), WHITE (up).

During transition, either extending or retracting, the red cross hatches will show. Once the operation is complete, and the gear is either fully extended or fully retracted, it should be fully green, or at least that's what I remember... I don't think I'm losing my mind yet.

There is also a "gear unsafe" light on the panel that additionally lights up during transition - not seeing a problem with that.

I had a cracked inner gear door activator - a little piece about 10" long, which I just had replaced. We did full swing tests etc to make sure the gear fully checked out about two weeks ago, and there were no issues. When I flew it again, I noticed this indicator state which I'm reasonably certain is new behavior.

Based on the comments above, y'all have me thinking about it. I'll need to get back over to the hanger and look in the manual. I could have sworn it went green when retracted, to indicate that the transition completed. But then, there is also an argument that, when retracted, it should show red, indicating unsafe to land. So to speak. But by that logic, wouldn't it make sense for the panel light to also be red in that state?

Anyone with an airframe from this era: if your gear is fully retracted, does the mechanical indicator show red or green?

[carusoam]

Green would be a disastrous indication for the gear being up.

There have been plenty of combinations for lights and colors related to the gear.

Green means one thing... Safe to land. Unless something has changed...

Some lights are on for transition.

Other lights are on when the gear is up. On the floor, it is the barber pole.

Four signs the gear is down...

1) Green light on the instrument panel is lit.

2) Green light on the floor is lit.

3) The thump under the floor boards as something goes over center.

4) The airspeed decreasing like you have thrown out an small anchor.

Keep in mind, I am only a PP. You may want to speak with your mechanic before using this advice...

Best regards,

-a-

[Hank]

My gear indicators are very simple to interpret.

Gear Down: green light on panel, green rectangle showing through floor window with "GEAR DOWN" in white.

Gear Up: orange light on panel, red rectangle showing through floor window with "GEAR UP" in white.

Gear In Transit: orange panel light blinking, red & white barber pole showing through floor window.

I've never watched the floor indicator during gear transit (I'm kinda busy at those times), but saw the barber pole when my right wheel wouldn't fully retract one winter. New pucks stopped that, and gave me back 10-12 mph in cruise. Not sure what makes the floor indicator work, guess I could rummage around the Maintenance Manual on my computer.

P.S. for Anthony--my gear thumps moving in both directions. Both are satisfying, as I KNOW where the gear is without checking anything. No thump means they didn't move . . . which could be troubling. Even when I had total electrical failure, though, the green floor indicator still worked. I always confirm the green light after dropping gear and on base, and check the light and the floor on final, every time.

[IndyTim]

Hank - I believe I should be seeing something similar. I can't attest that I was getting a white indicator before (on successful retraction) - I'm embarassed to admit that I don't remember. However, I do know for certain that I wasn't getting the barber pole once the gear was up.

So, I need to understand the causes for the barber pole state when the gear is retracted. I got new pucks at last annual, so presumably it's not that, although I'm interested in hearing how worn pucks would have contributed to this problem for you.

My gear indicators are very simple to interpret.

Gear Down: green light on panel, green rectangle showing through floor window with "GEAR DOWN" in white.

Gear Up: orange light on panel, red rectangle showing through floor window with "GEAR UP" in white.

Gear In Transit: orange panel light blinking, red & white barber pole showing through floor window.

I've never watched the floor indicator during gear transit (I'm kinda busy at those times), but saw the barber pole when my right wheel wouldn't fully retract one winter. New pucks stopped that, and gave me back 10-12 mph in cruise. Not sure what makes the floor indicator work, guess I could rummage around the Maintenance Manual on my computer.

P.S. for Anthony--my gear thumps moving in both directions. Both are satisfying, as I KNOW where the gear is without checking anything. No thump means they didn't move . . . which could be troubling. Even when I had total electrical failure, though, the green floor indicator still worked. I always confirm the green light after dropping gear and on base, and check the light and the floor on final, every time.

[IndyTim]

Green would be a disastrous indication for the gear being up.

There have been plenty of combinations for lights and colors related to the gear.

Green means one thing... Safe to land. Unless something has changed...

Some lights are on for transition.

Other lights are on when the gear is up. On the floor, it is the barber pole.

Four signs the gear is down...

1) Green light on the instrument panel is lit.

2) Green light on the floor is lit.

3) The thump under the floor boards as something goes over center.

4) The airspeed decreasing like you have thrown out an small anchor.

Keep in mind, I am only a PP. You may want to speak with your mechanic before using this advice...

Best regards,

-a-

I agree that it probably does not show green on retraction. Not sure what it's supposed to do, possibly white as Hank says. But it's definitely not red/barber pole, if it's working properly, once the gear is fully retracted.

[Hank]

Hank - I believe I should be seeing something similar. I can't attest that I was getting a white indicator before (on successful retraction) - I'm embarassed to admit that I don't remember. However, I do know for certain that I wasn't getting the barber pole once the gear was up.

So, I need to understand the causes for the barber pole state when the gear is retracted. I got new pucks at last annual, so presumably it's not that, although I'm interested in hearing how worn pucks would have contributed to this problem for you.

If you're getting a barber pole indication, the gear isn't all the way up. When mine was like that, I had an annoying horn every time until it finally went up.

How old, hard pucks causes poor retraction (my understanding) is that they do not fully expand after takeoff due to reduced flexibility, so the gear up switch won't make. I posted the squalling horn on the MAPA list, and the response was fast and unanimous--happens to old, hard pucks when the weather cools off. On a burger run, a fellow pilot confirmed right tire was visible. It popped up on descent, and I accelerated a LOT as I descended towards breakfast.

The last fourteen months with new pucks, I've not had hanging gear, squalling horns, barber poles or reduced airspeed, and landings are often smoother.

P.S.-- my floor indicators are GREEN for gear down, RED for gear up; both have white writing.