ILS power setting for M20B

[kwilkins]

I'm a CFI-I with no Mooney experience. Trying to teach my student who owns a M20B and need some suggested power settings for the ILS. Any and all advice appreciated.

 

[Hank]

In my C, I run ~16"/2300 to slow down to 90 knots [105 mph indicated], then add approach flaps and put ~2" back in.

 

it's a simple exercise--go fly at approximate approach altitude, and see what works for 120 mph and 105 mph clean, flaps down and gear & flaps both down. I drop gear 1½ dots above glideslope intercept, and she will start down with the needle centered. Shouldn't take long to determine.

 

Your results may vary depending on flap and gear speeds. Mine are 125 mph Vfo and 120 mph Vgo.

 

Good luck, and fly safe!

[Marauder]

I would do as Hank suggests. You may see a little difference between Mooneys of the same model due to speed mods. I have a chart that I made up for the various configurations of instrument flight (straight and level at 100 KIAS, 500 FPM descent at 100 KIAS, etc.).

[carusoam]

Another source of information comes from MAPA. They publish speeds and power settings for each model.

They also cover the model specific situations that a new owner wants to be aware of.

Best regards,

-a-

[Hank]

Another source of information comes from MAPA. They publish speeds and power settings for each model.

They also cover the model specific situations that a new owner wants to be aware of.

Best regards,

-a-

True dat! But my notebook's in WV. I'll have to get it this weekend. Those are only starting points to figure out for your own plane, anyway. My C's numbers aren't very close to what they publish, but my V speeds are higher, all electric and 201- windshield are the reasons.

[Danb]

Hank the Mapa's manual is on the web..just google it and within it are all the speeds for all makes and models.

[Danb]

Google. Mapamooneymanual.pdf

[47U]

If you're flying a 'B' your flap speed is probably 100 mph, like my '63C. A 90 kt approach puts you a tad above the flap speed. During training, I flew just about all my ILS aproaches with the flaps retracted... around 16" and 2400 rpm was my normal - no real speed mods with only the LASAR cowl enclosure. Trying to get the flaps down at ILS minimums is too much goofin' around on short final for my taste, but the airplane lands just fine flaps up. If you go missed, there's less clean-up and pitch trim change to manage, too.

[BigTex]

The MAPA PPP manual doesn't have the B model broken out so you'll likely have to use some of the ballpark numbers for the C model and adjust for his aircraft.  Keep in mind that it has a manual gear, miss approaches are pretty challenging because anything over 90 MPH you have to be superman to raise that gear.  Use the search feature on the site as this topic's been discussed many times.

[kwilkins]

If you're flying a 'B' your flap speed is probably 100 mph, like my '63C. A 90 kt approach puts you a tad above the flap speed. During training, I flew just about all my ILS aproaches with the flaps retracted... around 16" and 2400 rpm was my normal - no real speed mods with only the LASAR cowl enclosure. Trying to get the flaps down at ILS minimums is too much goofin' around on short final for my taste, but the airplane lands just fine flaps up. If you go missed, there's less clean-up and pitch trim change to manage, too.

 

Flap operations speed is 120MPH, yes the plane dose okay with no flaps and I don't want to see him screwing around with the plane after the FAP.

 

The MAPA PPP manual doesn't have the B model broken out so you'll likely have to use some of the ballpark numbers for the C model and adjust for his aircraft.  Keep in mind that it has a manual gear, miss approaches are pretty challenging because anything over 90 MPH you have to be superman to raise that gear.  Use the search feature on the site as this topic's been discussed many times.

 

 

 

I read some were that 18" and 2200 RPM should set him up speed wise and the gear would give him the descent. Going to try that today assuming he keeps his appointment. I think it was in the MAPA manual. Unfortunately they don't list the B model but its a good starting point. 

 

Thank you for the advice guys. Tried using the search feature on the site with little to show for it. Sorry if I'm rehashing old threads. Will post the configuration that works best.

[BigTex]

Please validate your flap speed as I believe Mooney didn't increase the flap speed until later C models. I'm pretty sure B's flap extend speed is100 MPH.

Also, for that engine, 2200 RPMs is in the red zone so you might consider 2300-2400 RPMs.

[bonal]

Big Tex is correct on both points

[47U]

Gear speed is 120... I'd double check the flap speed with the owner's manual. If the white arc on the airspeed indicator shows 120 the indicator may have been replaced and the markings are wrong.

[kwilkins]

Gear speed is placarded on the panel. But that could be wrong to.

[kwilkins]

Just realized I miss typed. gear speed is listed as 120 right next to the gear handle lock. I know flap speed is below that don't remember hit off hand.

[kwilkins]

18 In and 2200 RPM worked well today +or- an inch depending on the winds. Sets you up at 100 MPH which also puts you at the top of the white arch. Now if I can just get my student to push in the prop before the throttle when going missed. Gear down puts you in a 400-500 FPM descent. Multi engine work taught me to go through a flow when going missed. Mixture, props, throttle, Flaps to half, climb, gear. Hopeful I can help him develop this habit.

[BigTex]

Not sure if you've reviewed the M20B Flight manual but if not, here's the link to it: http://mooneyspace.com/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=22946

 

On page 2, they recommended operating range is 2300 - 2500 RPMs.  So I'd bump up the RPM's to 2300 and maybe pull off an inch of MP.

[Andy95W]

I humbly suggest being at prop full forward just after you drop the gear- gently so you don't overspeed- then you can do your GUMPS check and be done and ready to land or go around.

Also, as you break out of the clouds you can reduce throttle a bit and add flaps to the take off setting at which point the airplane will land very nicely or do a go around properly configured.

An ILS to minimums is best just to land flaps up in the M20B/C.

Prop full forward and landing checklist complete FAF inbound is how I was taught for Mooneys, multi, turboprops, etc., and how I taught my students as well.

The M20B should have a red arc on the tachometer between 2000-2250 RPM if it has the original Hartzell prop model. Prop full forward should take care of that too.