Biannual and Wings Credit Confusion

[ToddDPT]

My biannual is coming up due in March and I thought I had been working on the Wings Credit, but I have to admit, I'm confused as to how it works.  I have not had to do a "flight review" since getting my PPL because I passed my instrument tested the same month I was suppose to have one.  I have completed the 3 knowledge activities for SEL Basic - Phase 1.  The goal of this is to not have to do the oral portion of the flight review, right?  Is that all I need to have done or do I need to continue through Advanced and Master to not have to have the oral portion of the flight review?  I wish they were clearer on this.  Any help is appreciated.

[jrwilson]

biennial...   Useless grammar stuff, but still...  Sorry it is probably no help to your current situation.  Although, it might be, what if the CFI asks; "What is the difference between a biennial flight review and a biannual flight review?"

[rob]

I found the wings program to be cumbersome and poorly executed, so I stopped paying attention.

That said, a BFR isn't really a big deal, especially if you've been flying with any regularity. I wouldn't worry about trying to exempt yourself from part of it; just go, learn something and have a good time!

[Hank]

Me, too. It's terrible the way the FAA improved a good, simple program so that most users don't understand how it works, even with the 40+ page instructions. I quit trying to figure it out long ago.

[1964-M20E]

I try to attend some of the wings programs every year but I do not try to achieve any level or use it for my BFR.  I agree with others it is too complicated to worry about.

[BigTex]

My last BFR was done at a MAPA PPP. By far the best way to meet your BFR/IPC requirements. Going forward, this will be how I will be getting my BFR.

[Bob_Belville]

I just completed my flight review this week. I found it very good. After having done 3 units of the "ground school". I designated my flight instructor and schedule the flight with him 1.4 hours covered three units I applied for credit for those units and he approve them pretty easy hand learned a thing or two.

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[Bob_Belville]

Excuse the typos dictating on smartphone

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[jlunseth]

The WINGS program works really well.  However, each Phase requires ground school/seminar activities, and also flight training activities. If you have fulfilled the three ground activities for Basic, you still need to get together with an instructor and do the flight activities.  Any CFI can sign you off on the flight activities.  There is a separate CFI log in for them to do so.  Be sure to have your CFI look at what the flight activities are, if they are not already familiar with the WINGS program.  Eash of the three flight activities for Basic has a different subject matter.

 

It is really simple to figure out where you stand.  Log in to your WINGS account at www.faasafety.gov, and then click on the My Wings link that is about in the middle of the page.  That will show you what activities they have you down as having satisfied to complete a Phase, and what acitivities remain, and also what the subject/requirements are for the remaining activities.

 

You must complete a full Phase, in your case Basic Phase I, in order to satisfy the regulatory BFR requirement.  In other words, you must complete all the ground activities and all the flight activities for that Phase.  You will be notified in your faasafety.gov account when you have completed a Phase, and you will also get an email.

[ToddDPT]

 

You must complete a full Phase, in your case Basic Phase I, in order to satisfy the regulatory BFR requirement.

 

So all I need to do is complete the Basic Phase I (which I have).  I will make sure the instructor knows about the remaining requirements then.  Thanks!

[jlunseth]

Sounds like there is still some confusion.  To complete a Phase you need do the required ground activities, and also fly with an instructor and do the three flight activities.  You have either done the three flight activities (plus the ground activities) and completed the Phase I, or you have not done the three flight activites and therefore have not completed the Phase I, just completed the ground activities required for it.   There is no completing a Phase, whether Basic, Advanced, or Master, without having completed both the ground activites and the flight activities required for that Phase.

 

It sounds a little as though you think you need to do the ground activities for a Phase and then see an instructor to do some kind of BFR, but that is not it.  You do the ground activities, you do the instructional flight activities, you do them in any order, and you are done.  There is no BFR.  You can print out the certificate from www.faasafety.gov that you get for having completed the phase and paste it in your log if you want a record, part of the print out is a little slip with the regulatory language on it that says, in effect, you have completed your WINGS Phase and are good to go for another two years.

 

One of the differences between a BFR and the ground + flight activities for a WINGS Phase, is that the WINGS stuff does not involve any test or oral of any kind.  The flight part is just three instructional activities, and the CFI only needs to go on the website and sign off on the fact that you have done those instructional activies, he does not need to sign off on having tested you and found you competent to fly or anything like that. 

 

If you are unsure whether you have completed a Phase, log in to your WINGS account and look it up under My Wings.  It will tell you what you have left to do to complete the Phase.

[Hank]

The last time I visited my Wings account (a couple of years ago), it was showing credit for ground activities under multiple levels, and indicated that I needed to select some flight activities. How do I know which flight activities are appropriate, correct, will complete the next phase? I have a giant Wings pin from them after my last MAPA PPP, so I guess now I should work on Advanced, right? Or do I do a different level of Basic? It used to be so simple. No, I don't have the patience to wade through the Help book; if it takes more than 10-15 minutes to read and understand, either the Help is poorly written, the system is overly complicated, or both. What we have here is Both.

[midlifeflyer]

My biannual is coming up due in March and I thought I had been working on the Wings Credit, but I have to admit, I'm confused as to how it works.  I have not had to do a "flight review" since getting my PPL because I passed my instrument tested the same month I was suppose to have one.  I have completed the 3 knowledge activities for SEL Basic - Phase 1.  The goal of this is to not have to do the oral portion of the flight review, right?  Is that all I need to have done or do I need to continue through Advanced and Master to not have to have the oral portion of the flight review?  I wish they were clearer on this.  Any help is appreciated.

 

The goal is for you to replace the entire flight review. You don't get "oral credit" for completing a couple of courses; you get full flight review credit for completing a full Wings Phase. which includes not ground and flight instruction.. 

 

The new program is cumbersome but, to simply it a lot, the overall goal is to replace waiting 2 years for your next instruction with a program that has you obtaining recurrent training on a more regular basis. So, when you take a course, you get classroom credit; when you fly with a CFI, performing certain tasks - which tasks are listed, but it pretty much covers the PTS so you get a good exposure - you get air work credit. When you get the correct combination of the two, you complete a phase and get credit for a complete flight review.

 

The complaint of confusion is legit; it could be set out a lot simpler.

 

The other complaint that keeps people away is, "why should I have to spend 3 hours with a CFI when I can do it all in one." Also legitimate if you think you don't need recurrent training. Of course, the difference between the "normal" GA accident rate and those of Part 91 corporate, Part 135 and Part 121 (who fly every day and get recurrent training)  accident rate suggests such thinking just might be in error. Besides, a lot of us get recurrent training anyway; why not get FR credit for it? 

[Bob_Belville]

I printed out the syllabus for the 3 flight segments required and my CFI checked off each element as we flew. We logged 1.4 hobbs time, Did every component of all 3.   

[mike_elliott]

_{Good for you, Bob. Wings is a great way to maintain currency and get your Flight review. If you fly to PTS standards, it can be done in short order as you have demonstrated.}

[jlunseth]

My quote function is not working, but I am replying to Hank's question about how to find out what flight activities to do to complete a Phase, and what order to work on Phases.  You need to get one Wings Basic Phase in 12 months in order to move on to other levels.  Once you have that one Basic Phase in the last 12 months, you can work on different levels and Phases in any order.  If you are only looking for a Wings Phase to satisfy your BFR, you might as well just do one Basic Phase.  Any Phase regardless of level (Bas., Adv., or Master) substitutes for a BFR.   

 

To find out what flight or ground activities you need to complete a Phase, go to www.faasafety.gov  and log in to your account.  In the middle of the page after you log in, will be a block with a red border at the top and the label WINGS .  In the bottom right hand corner of that block is a link that says My Wings.  Click on that and you will be taken to a table or spreadsheet that has tabs at the top for Basic, Advanced, and Master.  You can click on that and see exactly where you are in the next Phase of that type.  You can do as many phases of any type that you want, the FAA's list shows some people with over 100 Phases of Wings.  The table will show the activities you have completed, and the ones you have yet to do, and in the case of the ground work will suggest some courses or seminars that provide credit towards that requirement.  The flight activities part of the table will do the same, except it often just lists the activities in the Practical Test Standards that you need to work on with a CFI in order to get credit for that activity.  So you can do as Bob did, click on that PTS citation in the table, print out the result, and take it to your friendly CFI.  If your friendly CFI needs help on how to give you credit, just have him/her log in to WINGS, and the block for CFI's is right next to the WINGS block.

 

If you are working towards a rating and taking training, that training counts for WINGS credit, just have your CFI log it on the website.  If you get a new rating, i.e. you are a PPL and get an Instrument, or get a Commercial, you get a bunch of WINGS credit for getting the rating, you just need to have the DPE log it for you on the website.

[midlifeflyer]

My quote function is not working, but I am replying to Hank's question about how to find out what flight activities to do to complete a Phase, and what order to work on Phases.  You need to get one Wings Basic Phase in 12 months in order to move on to other levels.  Once you have that one Basic Phase in the last 12 months, you can work on different levels and Phases in any order.  If you are only looking for a Wings Phase to satisfy your BFR, you might as well just do one Basic Phase.  Any Phase regardless of level (Bas., Adv., or Master) substitutes for a BFR.   .

 

That may be the piece that complicates understanding for some. Advanced and Master Wings are strictly brownie points or bragging rights phases. Higher level flight activities (i.e., commercial standards rather than private standards). If looking to maintain basic proficiency and FR replacement, all one ever needs to do is complete a Basic phase in a 12-month period.

[Bob_Belville]

That may be the piece that complicates understanding for some. Advanced and Master Wings are strictly brownie points or bragging rights phases. Higher level flight activities (i.e., commercial standards rather than private standards). If looking to maintain basic proficiency and FR replacement, all one ever needs to do is complete a Basic phase in a 12-month period.

I'm assuming once credit for a course expires, in 12 months, it is permissible to take the same course again toward the next FR? (If all one wanted to do was satisfy the legal requirement of what used to be called BFR.)

[midlifeflyer]

I'm assuming once credit for a course expires, in 12 months, it is permissible to take the same course again toward the next FR? (If all one wanted to do was satisfy the legal requirement of what used to be called BFR.)

 

I don't know. If I was making the rules I would say no. And I think (but not sure)  that with the Air Safety Foundation online courses, if you already took it, the course only thinks of a retake as a refresher and you don't get new credit.

 

But with so many good ground courses to choose from on a variety of topics, why would you want to take the exact same one over and over again? 

 

(PS - we do need to get together when the weather warms up a bit!)

[jlunseth]

Yes, you can retake any course and get credit.  I have not tried it, but I doubt you would even have to wait for the course credit to expire or to get attached to a Phase that you complete.  There are many courses, such as ADM, that the FAA would like you to take many times. 

 

The "one Basic every twelve months" rule is new.  For a couple of years you could get just one Basic and then go on to Advanced and Masters for as long as you liked and never go back to Basic.  I liked the old rule, but they are fine tuning the program to improve safety among GA pilots and decided that going back to the basics is important for everyone. 

 

But just to be clear, competing a Phase acts the same as doing a BFR under 61.56.  In other words, completion of just one Phase of any kind satisfies the BFR requirement for 2 years, not 1 year.  The twelve month requirement for WINGS Basic is only there as a prerequisite to going on and completing more advanced training. 

 

So hypothetically, you could have completed a Basic Phase in December 2013, and that would move your flight review date under 61.56, out two years to December 2015.  Then in December 2014, still within the one year from completing the Basic Phase, you could complete an Advanced or Master Phase and then your flight review date would move out again to two years from December 2014, or December 2016.

 

Also, if you take some Advanced or Master credits (ground or flight) but have not completed a Basic in the past year, the Advanced or Master credits don't not count, you don't lose credit for them just because you don't have a Basic completed in a year.  The credits will stay in your account for one year.  You could actually do all the work to complete an Advanced or Master Phase and the credits will stay active in your account, then as soon as you complete a Basic, the Advanced or Master would also issue.