Drumstick

What I have learned in my search - the items that impact Vref value the most are Logbooks, Damage history, Total Time, TSMOH and avionics. The avionics give zero value. Add $11 for every hour under .5*TBO. So in this case you would add about $5500 to the base Vref value. Paint and interior rated at 7 is zero addition or deduction - add or subtract as usual. Avionics credit is about .25-.5 the installed cost of the units depending on how new they are. I think the current addition is $5000 to base value for a Garmin 530W. It would cost at least $10000 to get one used and installed. Base price for a 76F according to Vref is surprisingly $53,000. Adding the low time and assuming 7/7 int and exterior it is $58.5 according to the formula the AOPA lenders will use. Now the question is WHEN were those 500 hours put on? If the overhaul was 15-20 years ago...its very risky. If it flew 500 hours in the last 5 years...giddy up! An F is a good airplane but it will always be an F and perform about as well as the earlier Fs that may have a base price of 40K. It will never be a J. Base price of a 77 J is $71K. Now the question is - what is the aircraft worth to you? The airplane that I am in the process of buying only had a Vref of $38K but I'm going to pay more for it because I know the history of the plane, owner, type of flying that was done on it etc. For an airplane, its a very low risk purchase and it meets my mission requirements (IFR in congested airspace). I have found much better deals but they all came with airplanes that had some "neglect" in their history. I would say this - if this airplane has a solid maintenance history, all flying on this motor in the last 5-10 years, responsible owner and meets YOUR current requirements and YOU are willing to invest in avionics then its probably safe that you will not end up "under water" as far as the bank is concerned. BUT - if you could find the same airplane with the avionics already installed it would be equal to about 1/4 the price of getting it done after the fact. Vref/BlueBook does not do justice to the current price of installed avionics. It will be much cheaper in the long run to find the airplane you want with the avionics installed. STEC 30 is only a 4-5K valuation increase but will cost you probably $20K to get installed in todays market. Good luck - finding the right plane is hard! Further example - Using Vance's airplane: 55K-11K (motor)+$5000 (GPS) = $48K but does not account for inter/ext condition, total time or other avionics/mods. Edited to add: Vref is a "retail value" price or what a dealer could get away with listing an aircraft for...not necessarily a selling price.

I am about to buy an M20c from a friend that offered it to me before listing. I will be paying more than the bank thinks it is worth (after a PPI) because I know it's history and it's a good regularly flying airplane. I have been looking off and on for two years and what I have discovered is there are lots of airplanes for sale but not very many quality airframes from responsible owners. There are LOTS of very knowledgeable and informed buyers that are actively looking for good deals. I have missed several airplanes by calling minutes too late. A good value will sell or have a contingent offer in hours or minutes of being listed. Airplanes that are sitting are overpriced for their features or risk. I truly empathize. There is an aircraft that I almost purchased but it was missing a couple of key features that I wanted for my mission requirements and it was priced more than 10K over what the bank would loan.

$385 and a 1 year minimum wait to get a T Hangar in Southern Maryland. 90 min from D.C.

Just spoke with Curtis at Foothills Aviation and Service in Upland CA. They typically charge $800 for a Mooney prebuy but will cut it off early if showstoppers are found and only charge the shop rate for that time. Annuals are $2200. Even better...they have time next week!

That is how its done at Cole Aviation. I need to talk with the MSCs in CA and NV to see if its done the same way there. Top Gun in Stockton charges a flat rate for a PPI and then tags on another $600 if you want an annual (not including squawks). Lincoln Skyways charges 2300 and quoted annuals as 5K-10K for a retractable aircraft. I really would prefer not to spend a flat rate on a PPI if the big deal breakers can be found inside a couple of hours (engine health, corrosion, AD compliance etc).

I was originally told a hangar at my local field was coming available. Now I'm told its 1 year. I'm fairly rural so no other fields are really close. I can now either wait 1 year to buy an airplane or I can tie down for 1 year. Its a nice airplane with a nice cover. The only time its sat out for the last 20 years is when its been on a cross country. I was thinking about adding wing covers if I have to tie down for the year. Thoughts?

First time Mooney buyer here. What are typical terms and conditions for a pre-purchase inspection and sales contract? Owner wants to make sure that the aircraft will not be held hostage by a MSC if the inspection runs up a huge list of minor squawks during a PPI. I've offered to sign a purchase contract that says I will buy the aircraft IF no-airworthiness items or major corrosions issues are found during a PPI. Any non-airworthiness squawks will be repaired at buyers cost and discretion and any airworthiness gripes are the responsibility of the seller or seller can terminate sale. Aircraft had an annual about 6 months ago. Can a MSC hold the plane hostage if they find an airworthiness squawk even though we are only paying for a PPI and not an annual? Aircraft passed annual in 6/16.

Just FYI for those waiting for info...OP's email says he is out of the office and not returning until 3 January.

I'm considering buying this aircraft. Current owner lives in a dry climate and flies 50-100 hours annually. I've know the owner for longer than they own the plane. What would be a "fair" price? Paint and interior are both 7 out of 10. Overall: Outstanding 1965 M20C very well equipped for IFR flight. Impeccable maintenance history – no expense spared. **TOP PROP CONVERSION** – New Prop and hub eliminating 100 hour eddy current inspection requirement. One owner last 10 years - always hangared. No damage history – full logbooks. TTSMOH: 1570 TTAF: 4775 Avionics: Garmin GMA340 Audio Panel Garmin GNS430 NAV/COM GPS (non waas) Garmin GI-106A GPS / VOR / LOC / Glideslope Indicator King KX-155 Digital Nav/Comm with VOR/Localizer STEC 30 Autopilot with Altitude Hold King KT-76A Transponder with Mode C Shadin Mini-Flo-L fuel flow indicator (connected to GNS430 to provide fuel remaining, fuel required to destination, fuel reserves at destination & endurance) Horizon P-1000 Digital Tach Insight G-2 Engine Monitor (4-Probe EGT/CHT, Fuel Flow, Carb Temp) Davtron Digital 5 function display (OAT-F OAT-C, Density Alt, Pressure Alt, Voltage) New/Overhauled Equipment: Top Prop Conversion - New Prop and hub (New 2012 ) Nose gear steering assembly (New 2014) Alternator (New 2013) Carburetor (New 2013) Dukes Fuel Pump (Rebuilt 2007) Ignition Harness (New 2007) Magnetos (Rebuilt 2013) Attitude Indicator (New 2016) Altitude Indicator (Rebuilt 2011) VSI (Rebuilt 2013) Battery (New 2016) Features: Bruces Custom Cover LASAR Pilot Side Instrument Panel LASAR Cowl Closure Mod Precise Flight Standby Vacuum System Lightweight Highspeed starter (New 2011) Sigtronics 4-place Intercom Radio Master Johnson Bar Gear One piece windshield Pilot and co-pilot shoulder harnesses Belly Strobe Dual Push to talk

Anyone get a response from the OP?

Justin is a stand-up guy and the aircraft appears to exactly as represented. I decided to go with a friend's aircraft but it was a really really hard decision. I would not hesitate to deal with Justin and I will definitely listen to any advice he has on a legacy Mooney - particularly when it comes to PC/Brittain systems. Just FYI - I expressed interest in the aircraft and in turn he found all the info I requested - called Brittain and found out what it would cost to upgrade his aircraft AND found two A&Ps that could get the prop inspections done within 1.5 mooney hours from my residence! Great guy - nice airplane!