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Well I sold my previous M20E 4 months ago, told myself I should save money... Well I did that for 4 months so let me introduce my "New" to me Mooney, it's a 1964 M20E with nothing I can really think of upgrading (so far). I'm excited for my cross country trip at the end of the month to pick it up!

Who have you tried to reach out too? The goal is business as usual for TT and help them on there way with getting certs out the door. We know at this point their backlog is just growing, so we're going to try and help push through that backlog as well. PM me if you need anything, and I'll work to get it addressed. Cheers, Steve Pearce BendixKing

Yes, all of our Caravan members want us to sit quietly and wait for however long the FAA takes. No pictures of bent metal have been shared here and no information has been divulged, although the Official Statement was redone to explain that two planes actually touched in flight (from the original "there was an incident"). No information, no photos, no discussion--completely shuts down the opportunities for the rest of us to learn anything from the real events and its myriad possible causes. But we've been invited to next year's Caravan training to see the improvements. This is now the second time that I'm withdrawing from this thread, having been told already by non-communicative "informed persons" that I don't know what happened. Because I wasn't there, and those who were ain't saying.

There was a kid that had parents that worked for the faa... he was 15 before he figured out his name wasn’t “No”.

This would be great, but I wouldn’t hold my breath. This idea makes too much good sense for a federal agency to adopt it. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I saw a short commentary (I think it was on the AOPA website and at OSH) about the Feds talking about something new for "legacy" airplanes called a "Special Airworthiness Certificate" to allow the installation of what are now unapproved parts (avionics)? One would turn in their current airworthiness certificate in exchange for this one. It would allow as noted what are now unapproved parts and maybe allow the owners to do the maintenance much like experimental aircraft owners do now. Maybe a special repairman's certificate (just speculating on that one). Limitations, as mentioned, might be nothing outside of the USA, no Canada or Mexico but I feel that might not be a restriction in the future, I can't find where I saw it but I'll keep looking. As I said, I think it was one one of my AOPA emails like the weekly update or something.

I have been a "lurker" here for about the last 6 months as I considered a Mooney purchase. I want to thank Mooneyspace.com for their generous and open door policy of allowing people to look in on subjects posted. It has been of great benefit in my airplane search. I am proud to say I am the new owner of N192JK, a 2005 Ovation as of 2023 UTC yesterday. She is currently located at Don Maxwell's shop undergoing a pre-sale, now an annual and a WAAS upgrade. Thanks to this forum I was able to select Don Maxwell as my preferred place to perform the pre-buy and I have had the honor to meet both Don and Paul who are real gentlemen and have been most helpful. I will be basing out of KGVL as I live on Lake Lanier My previous airplane was a PA18-160 Super Cub rebuilt by Cub Crafters. It was probably one of the few IFR certified Cubs around and had an Aspen 1000, Garmin 420W and a Lynx ADS-B unit. I loved the airplane but my mission has changed to a need for reliable and fast transport up and down the Eastern seaboard. In my search I needed good avionics and TKS. I wanted to avoid turbo charging, preferring horsepower and displacement. I don't really want to be sucking on a tube all that much in search of performance. It came down to an early to mid 90's Bonanza or a 2000 something Mooney. Since my wife and I are not tall people and it is usually just the two of us I concluded the Mooney was the best airplane for the buck and (shhhh), it will blow the doors off a Bonanza. I have flown a lot of Beech products, even worked for a Beech dealer and I love their airplanes but if you have to write the checks........ A little about my aviation self. I am coming up on my 50th year since solo at KRHV. I have about 29,000 hours. About 8000 in GA aircraft of all kinds from C-150's too biz jets. I have been a CFI-I, a Chief Instructor with examining authority, a Line Check Airman and a Part 135 Chief Pilot. I recently retired off the Airbus A330 after a near 40 year career. Aviation has been my life and passion all my life and being a pilot is the only thing I have ever wanted to be since early childhood. This Mooney will most likely be my last airplane and I hope it will be the best! I look forward to learning from you fine folks here. You all have been very helpful in getting me to this point in my "Mooney experience"!

Alex, I always liked working on my plane and for the last 20 years of Mooney ownership, I would do my own oil changes every 25 hrs of course. I would take that opportunity to, cut open the filter, inspect the suction screen, mouse milk exhaust joints, visually inspect intake and exhaust, clean air filter, inspect for oil leakage, fuel leakage etc. I would remove plugs and borescope each cylinder and clean the plugs, re-anneal the copper plug gaskets, rotate and regap. Yep it took a 1.5 hr job and made it into a 5-6 hr job. I had the piece of mind of the condition of the engine going forward for another 25 hrs. It was probably overkill, but I enjoyed it and more importantly, it was a great time to put eyes on everything under the cowl.

I'm still intrigued by the "inappropriate touching" of two Mooneys on the caravan this year. The fact that there's pressure to not talk about it makes it even better.

Oh crap. That means I started the next 13 pages that took this downhill.

Did someone really make that comment on this forum? I'm sure someone can find a way to spend your money.

Hey Everyone. The West Coast Mooney Club has a brand new website promoting our group and club activities. You are all invited to check out the site and also join the club by going to the site and clicking the Join Now icon. https://westcoastmooneyclub.com/ Thanks so much, MrRodgers

keeping the 20k I've paid in labor in the last year would more than makeup for any loss in value of the aircraft

1) Fisk is pretty safe... it would be hard to say it isn’t and have actual data to support the statement. 2) it can be crazy busy, similar to flying between VORs on a warm weekend, down low, in the North East... so call it uncomfortable for some, or many... 3) Part of the Caravan Plan is a bit hidden... I had to learn what a Madison Bag was... 4) I heard... ‘Don’t forget to pack your Madison Bag’... I didn’t know if I even had a Madison bag...had to look around the house to find something stylish that I could use for an overnight stay... and hold a couple of hundred pages of documents and my iPad... 5) Madison had another stylish convention going on too... if you are familiar with American Girl Dolls... Madison is a style leader... the headquarters for AG is just outside Madison... https://www.americangirl.com/shop/ 6) Finding all the extra time... back when I was working... that was more of a precious resource. Retirement helps. Grown kids helps even more... Free time was available... Madison is where I got to sit and talk with Yves and his copilot Patrick... Another hidden detail... you are going to meet a few people that you know, and find out more about them... The hotels were low cost, the dinners were low cost, yet the conversations were priceless... similar to our Fryer Tuck’s nights of the past... 7) Fear of Fisk is similar to fear of flying... the more you learn about doing it, the less fearful it is... that’s the Notam that Becca referred to reading a few times... 8) Fear of close proximity to other planes... becomes less fearful when you have training, experience, know your wingmen, and have great weather... 9) It can really help Having a copilot onboard... Caravan and Fisk are similar for this... 10) Flying at 120ias doesn’t leave much opportunity to do anything other than fly, and scan... out the window... 11) Healthy fear... can be a strong driving force for a person to work at improving their skills... KOSH... The more I go... the more comfortable it becomes... Best regards, -a-

Upgrades are in. Panel lights, G5, turn coordinator and JPI 830

http://www.mooneycaravan.com/news/updateonmooneyincidentatmooneycaravan19july2019 http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2012/07/plane-crash-at-eaa-airventure-airplane.html Updated Statement Relating to Incident During Mooney Caravan to Oshkosh XXII, 21 July 2019 posted Aug 5, 2019, 3:42 AM by Ashley and Maria Neboschick [ updated Aug 5, 2019, 3:45 AM ] As many of you know, we had an incident during Mooney Caravan 2019. During the en route portion of the flight, a slowdown occurred during a rejoin to fingertip maneuver. During this same time period, an en route course change also occurred in the direction of the rejoining wingmen. As such, an overrun occurred and both pilots took corrective action. After landing it was noted that contact had occurred. No other elements of the formation were placed in danger by the incident. Currently, a team of Caravan individuals is analyzing the event in order to come up with procedural recommendations. This team is in the process of gathering and reviewing all available information. While our internal investigation is not yet complete (and will not be until the NTSB makes their analysis and recommendations public), there are several takeaways that we are working on for future Caravan operations. These recommendations will likely include more thorough training, more focus on emergency procedures and emergency calls, as well as more detailed written emergency procedures. Please be patient with us as we try to decipher the information, and come up with meaningful conclusions. It is important that the NTSB report comes out prior so that we can incorporate all data into a thorough Caravan safety report.

Too bad she didn’t have a 406 ELT.

I honestly have no idea what you are referring to. None of the sequence you listed for the Caravan is remotely accurate. The decision to not fly in on Saturday was made at about 7am, the storms were indeed forecast at the arrival time of 1130, hence the reason the caravan delayed. The Caravan was scheduled to land right after the Cherokees. About half of that formation had their tents destroyed as they attempted to set up camp. Yes B2OSH delayed through their first arrival window, electing to attempt an 8 PM Saturday arrival, however the airfield never re-opened for grass parking so their leadership decided to cancel their mass arrival. The Caravan did not use the B2OSH landing window on Saturday. On Sunday, the Caravan was given a 9am land time by OSH ATC. The Caravan was then slightly delayed by EAA because they were unsure where to park 62 ACFT. Initially, the plan was to park the aircraft on a taxiway until a dry enough spot was located. it was not until after the Caravan landed that EAA informed the lead aircraft that they had a parking location available. There was continuous coordination between the Caravan Lead pilot and OSH ATC and EAA, luck had nothing to do with it.

If you haven’t already committed to Plane Plastics, Mooney will still produce a replacement side panel for your K. I have an ‘80 K-model with the same panel and just went through this process at annual in May. Went with the original Mooney panel and looks good as new. As a side bar, Plane Plastics does NOT make the correct panel for your oxygen setup, and will not custom make one (ask me how I know). After fighting with them for nearly two, maybe close to three months to get a refund on the returned incompatible panel, I decided I probably won’t be doing business with them unless I am absolutely certain they have what I need.

Just being able to do routine maintenance on your plane without spending 2 years studying jet engines, pressurization systems and deicing would be great. I’ve long advocated for a private a&p program not for hire with restricted authorization ( ie change a mag but not overhaul an engine) Also saves a couple grand on every Garmin panel toy. I guess that means it won’t happen. -Robert

Fwiw - the airport was open on Saturday morning before the late morning storms rolled in. That’s when we arrived, 7 am - had about 4 hrs of good weather to set up and then watch the storm from a restaurant. Parked in Row 520 so really close to the show. Many Bos and Cirri would have been able to get in if they looked at the weather and realized that their formation arrival schedule would be in the middle of a storm and just come in on their own time earlier in the morning rather than waiting for their “slot”. Instead they spent another night at a motel instead of at osh, the downside of formations. Mooney caravan though was basically miraculously timed for arrival this year! I was really happy for the caravaners for that timing it was basically perfect. that said, I don’t think any midair’s occurred among the thousands of airplanes that arrived via Fisk, one midair occurred out of 62 planes on the caravan. I don’t think that is conclusive evidence that a mass arrival inherently less safe. But that’s not the point of this thread - more that Fisk is safe. That said... I have been a little concerned, as I mentioned in the other thread, about the caravan safety culture given the currrent response, but I’m holding judgment until I see how this is handled in the training and procedure updates and transparency about what happened...

Thank you all for the warm welcome. Since you asked for pictures, here you go

Last September, I took delivery on my 95 Bravo. At the time, it had 2420 hours TT and about 1100 Hrs since the last overhaul. During the past 10 months, I've had the following items overhauled: Prop Governor Turbocharger and wastegate main fuel pump one cylinder TKS pump entire exhaust system I've had a number of other items repaired or replaced as well. Last week, I took the aircraft in for annual. At the time, I posted a photo on the FB Mooney page and mentioned that I would be doing some of the grunt work. @mike_elliott, made the statement at the time to be sure to have a good look at the exhaust system. I responded proudly that the exhaust had been recently overhauled so we should be all good there. Well...herein lies the lesson to NEVER assume anything where aircraft are concerned. First, the number 3 cylinder failed the compression test. Then the borescope inspection revealed a damaged exhaust valve. This necessitated removal of the cylinder which in turn required the removal of the exhaust. Here's a look at the valve: During removal of the exhaust, it was discovered that a clamp that supports the section that connects the left and right sides was installed incorrectly, causing chafing which would have certainly led to perforation. The area that this clamp is installed is also the same area where the heater shroud is located so the cabin could have potentially filled with exhaust and CO. Moreover, the problem was hidden by the intstalled shroud. The clamp should have been installed to one side of the cable eye, not with the eye in the middle. This caused the clamp to be loose. Lastly, we also found a hole in the air duct: Lots to think about on this one...I am grateful these issues were discovered. Alex

Hi Erik-- Welcome aboard and good luck with the checkride! My $0.02 Given you're probably interested in a Mooney in part because of the long cross country speed and efficiency, an autopilot is a pretty good near-requirement. While it adds complexity, cost and headache, it can reduce your workload in critical phases in flight, and you will be less fatigued at the end of a long flight when you need the most concentration. The more functions, the better, with approach/GS coupling, yaw control and GPSS being the most. Most older Mooneys have either the Century or BK series AP's, although there are some intrepid souls who have retrofitted other options. A multicylinder graphic engine monitor is a must, preferably with data logging. WAAS GPS is only necessary if you're planning on getting your IFR rating (which you should) ADS-B transponder is only necessary if you're planning on flying near any Class B airspace. Stormscopes are questionable in value, but a nice addition Speedbrakes might be helpful for some of the turbo long-bodies, but for any NA Mooney it's just a luxury. Edit: I somehow missed the fact that you're up in Beaverton. Give me a PM if you're interested in poking around a J model. It'll be down for a couple weeks here sorting out a fuel pressure issue, and an annual next month, but I'm just down in Corvallis

Here is a picture of the fuel selector I have come up with with DER approval to install. Makes changing tanks easier and reliably reachable. Also holds the carpet in place. John Breda

You're omitting the scatalogical origins of "cockpit" itself!

I feel much more comfortable with 1+ mile spacing between me and any other planes piloted by humans, computers, robots, or lizard people.

I haven't personally checked the costs, but could easily see this being true. If so, that much of an "aviation maintenance tax" is appalling on every imaginable level. The engineering for the M20 series was done decades ago.

I used the old ground cable to sync them. Since the old lights were seperate and each wing tip had 2 lights, that means that there were 2 ground cables. Since the orions use one ground, i cut the second ground cable out, attached them from both sides, and used it as a sync wire.

I said exactly this years ago here. It makes sense. Airframe and engine certified and the rest open to discussion.

Thanks for posting the update.

Wow, very nice. Congrats.

Very pretty. Congratulations on the new to you ride!

Hell, I still want one Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think if this thread had been characterized as inappropriate touching earlier it would have gotten a lot more attention.

Thank you Steve for chiming in here, it is very much appreciated. I have a long list of eager Mooney owners submitted with the TT guys. We are all looking forward to the approval and reduction in back orders.

Steve Pearce- My heart felt "THANK YOU" for this communication!!!!!!! I will PM you THANK YOU again for communicating.

There is a pressure port on the flow divider to drive a pressure gauge calibrated in fuel flow on the RSA injection systems. Some Pipers and Cessna use it -- probably others. Mooney installations I've seen (including the factory installations) use the more accurate Floscan transducers in the fuel line between the fuel pump and the servo. Are you sure yours is a pressure takeoff? Skip

I've done this route in an M20C. It was easy, all under 12,500. No O2. Full disclosure by KCOE I was thinking of selling the C and upgrading. By KWYS I'd convinced my wife that we should sell the C. And by KOMA it was sold. Then we went and bought a 252.

Wonderful, let me know when you plan to come! You can stay at home. BTW of @carusoam wants to come too we could really have a fly in! The flight is not that difficult. Oscar

I think they have had such a system in Canada for some time.

That looks cool but that's exactly where I rest my feet on flights when the seat is slid back. Noo thanks

I bought mine from someone else at my home base, who had stumbled onto a great deal on an A36. What became my C was already mostly fixed up to be his retirement ride.

Amelia c Reid,founded flight school at RHV ,passed away mar 3 2001.In 1997 ,when I flew with her ,she was very nappy,and made enough noise to be heard above aircraft ambient

If you have a year or two before you are planning on buying then do some tracking. When I was looking I made an Excel Spreadsheet and tracked all the Mooneys on the market that fit my potential price range. They were C's, E's, a few F's, and the D I ended up buying. The great thing about Excel was I could just keep adding columns for what I was tracking. Price Price Changes including when the price dropped and how much Year Model Serial # Tail # State/City Exterior Color Quality of paint 1-10 Interior Color/Material Quality of Interior 1-10 Panel Layout a Scale of 1-10 (This is just subjective as to what looked good to me, surprising how many different ways there are to layout a panel) AFTT Engine Overhaul Date TSMOH Type Prop Hours on Prop Date of last annual Listing of Avionics Columns with links to current ads. (Controller, Barnstormer, Mooneyland, Aerotrader) Just looked and I had 40 planes on my spreadsheet priced from $26,999-$65,500. The market is different now than when I bought mine a little over 2 1/2 years ago, but if you spend the next 6-12 months tracking all the planes in your potential range you will get a good feel for what is "too cheap" and what you are really looking for. The other thing I believe, is that when you get ready to buy, it is just as important to do your pre-buy on the seller as the plane. The guy selling the plane I bought flew it the hour from Cottonwood, AZ down to Chandler, AZ to meet me and show me the plane. We agreed on a price pending an inspection and shook on it. He offered to fly it to an MSC to have the pre-buy done on it, wasn't hiding anything. I didn't have a complex rating (I didn't even have 60 total hours) so after the purchase he delivered the plane to me in CA in exchange for me buying his plane ticket back. The plane was being flown regularly, he was selling because he was moving up to an Ovation.

Interesting. I'll ad some photos inline.

Bonanza people are some of the friendliest and nicest I've met. At worst, they treat us like kindred spirits who are simply too cheap to buy a Bonanza. And they do it really nicely!

I don't ever buy avionics of any kind without talking to Chase at @Avionics Source. If there's a deal to be had, Chase will let you know.

The tester is basically a 6.25 amp load made up of the unit's own draw and two 12v halogen bulbs which are activated by a programmable electronic voltmeter. That activation also starts a clock through a relay. When the amperage drain pulls the battery down to 10 v, it shuts off the bulbs and clock. Starting with a fully charged battery, you and hook the clips on it (either in or out of the plane). When you come back the clock will tell you how long it took. You could do the same thing without the gadgetry if you were willing to watch a clock and a voltmeter for the length of time it takes. By dividing the amp hours of the battery by 6.25, you can calculate how long it should take and calculate the % capacity.