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I went to my wife 9 months ago and said I was buying an ovation. I had done the logbook review, talked to the broker, and was going to submit an offer the next day on a ‘97 (I think) ovation 3. I had been talking about upgrading for a while and my wife had always said no. This time she just said not another Mooney. She didn’t find it to be comfortable. I’ll always be a mooniac, but I subscribe to the theory that the best plane for any mission is the one your wife likes. Wife and two little girls (3 and 6 weeks)- I need more space in the plane than would be feasible in an ovation. The goal was family plus bags ~600 miles in 3 hours. Not feasible in an ovation, but not far off in a turbo normalized A36. The Bo won’t make it in 3 hours, but at least it will be a comfortable ride. I brought the plane home and took my wife to see it. I showed her the rear cabin- she sat down and smiled at the space. Then she looked at the panel and said, “no glass? You’re going to redo that right?” So that’s the story of how I bought a Bonanza in May and why the bird is in the avionics shop right now.

I just completed a current pilot record for insurance renewal on my Baron. I flew 175 (actually 177.5) hours in the last 12 months, 38 hours in the last 90 days. Of that, 150 was in the Baron and 25 hours in single engine, mostly teaching and exercising a friend's P210. In the last 90 days, 36 of the 38 hours were in the Baron with two flight reviews in single engine, each an hour flight time thrown in. I was expecting about 150 hours last year so 175 hours is a nice surprise. I do have a non-equity partner in the Baron and his time will determine the insurance premium, unfortunately. He has about 25% of the hours I do and flies about 25% as much as I do. But . . . he pays half of the expenses. Oh, and my first flight in the Baron was January 15, 2018 so that 150 hours in the Baron is for a 10 month period, not a full year

I really can’t agree that the operating costs of the Bravo are all that high. I say that though with a caveat. That’s once you get it completely dialed in so far as all systems are concerned with everything operating rock solid where you want it. But then again that really applies to any new-used plane that is 15-50 years old. The reliability an dispatch rate of the Bravo has been great, and as mentioned above, it has a Lycoming that will make TBO with little problem if you fly it correctly which really isn’t that hard, and this certainly should be factored into the equation . Some might argue that burning 18 to 19 gallons an hour in cruise is high , but it really is reasonable when you consider the speed and therefore efficiency of the thing, being able to get up and over a lot of weather that you would otherwise have to circumnavigate, etc

The 14.9 number works great but is only for LOP ops with a 8.5:1 compression ratio. When ROP HP is more a function of MP and RPM, hence why the "key" numbers work out well. So when rich of peak use "key" numbers (what ever they are for your airplane) and when lean of peak use FF. Cheers, Dan

There is plenty written up by MSers that have used desicants and air pumps to supply dry air to their engines for extended periods of time. Lets not confuse the three devices... 1) Heaters are great for warming the engine to avoid really cold starts with really thick oil... 2) Dehumidifiers are For keeping moisture away from corrodable surfaces... 3) Pre oilers are the things that put the oil back on all the surfaces after time and temperature have allowed the oil to drip and drain back to the oil pan... 4) We get some confusion by heating air, where the RH has a tendency to drop. Winter cold air has a pretty low moisture content, and warming it up drives the RH even lower... 5) The problem with this thought process is... the air inside our engines is not following these simple rules... it is high humidity air in a pretty tight container... and some parts are open to the outside through the air intake, others are open to the exhaust, a few parts are open to the case vent If you are not going to fly for a few months... dehumidifiers work, pickling is fine, leaving the engine open is almost good... but leaving part of the engine with moisture still in it at 70°F is likely to increase the rate of oxidation... So why heat the engine up? Mike Busch is really smart, and writes pretty well... rarely has left us uninformed... Tanis is really smart, and writes in a commercially acceptable manner... Taking either of them out of context is a bit dangerous, for your wallet... They may be saying leaving the heat on is harmless.... as in it won’t damage things by overheating or lighting a fire.... But they are not outwardly saying it will do what you want it to do... “heat your engine to prevent internal corrosion...” That is what I would need to see to believe this could work, then I would be looking for an MSer that has done this before... preferably a mechanic that sees multiple engines frequently.... Call the fine folks at Tanis and ask directly their thoughts... They must have had several people each year have the same idea. They aren’t trying to sell something for the wrong reason, just to make a buck... that technique usually has a high failure rate... in this case an expensive failure rate.... If it did work that way, i’d Leave the heat on.... Got Time to make a call? we need a contest... MSer with the most responses from different vendors.... @wcbis pretty good at this! PP thoughts only, my steam tables are printed on paper... Best regards, -a-

It's not passenger chatter that get's you (though it might contribute). It's something so distracting that it takes your head completely out of the current task at just the right moment even if only for a fraction of a second and then prevents it from returning to the task completely. I would never say that it could not happen to me or that I could not be distracted. That would be tantamount to a self inflicted curse. I think I'm a decent stick and conscientious about how I do things. I also think that many pilots far superior to me in skill, experience and discipline have screwed this particular pooch...many times. Unsurprisingly, Mr. Deakin has penned some of his wise and entertaining musings on the subject.

They are taught in the Mooney Safety Foundation PPP and are called "key" numbers. Goes like this: (RPM/100)+MP = Key number For my J, 44=55%, 47=65%, and 50=75%. Not sure if your F would be the same values or not.

If you do, you'll instantly be my new best friend!

I replaced the clock in our panel with the AV-20. So far I am very happy with it and paid the deposit for the AV30. I have not connected static and temperature probe. After installation is complete I will provide more information on the full range of functions.

Sounds like mine, back n the mid 1980’s I had a warrior to learn to fly in. We went on our first trip the day after I got my PPL, the cars on the highway were just as fast as us or faster, she wanted to know why I got a plane that wasn’t as fast as a car. So we started to look at planes, after looking at a Bo, Cherokee six, C 182 then a Mooney it was over. She sat in them all, I’m not going to trash any other planes,she does, therefore it was a Mooney or nothing. 30years later and now three Mooneys she won’t change her mind a Mooney or nothing.

In a normally aspirated Mooney, assuming little/no wind, on a long cross country the goal is to fly as high as it takes to accomplish Carson’s speed at full power! That will be the maximum TAS for the buck you can get. It will end up something like 120kias at 60% power at like 12000ft for a TAS of about 150ktas on 8gph.

You want data? I have data. Here is my most recent real time monitoring report. I have done numerous tests at different temps, oil cap open vs closed, etc. I find 90 degrees is a good temp for RH less than 30%. Oil cap open did not make a huge difference in my previous lycoming. I have not tested the oil cap in my current continental. I do leave the cap open because that is where the probe goes. I never saw condensation on the underside of my Lyc oil cap but I have seen it on my Conti cap. Not sure why the difference.

Other than your potato chip bags popping, you won't have any issues.

Nicely covered, Dan! LOP %hp is a direct function of FF. Because all the fuel gets used to produce power... ROP %hp is more challenging because some amount of excess fuel is not used to produce power... and is hard to account for... In the LOP calculation the Compression ratio is an important part of the calculation... So, each engine has its own specific factor for calculation... Something I believe should be represented as well is engine ignition timing... but under cruise conditions, all the fuel that is going to burn, is being burned before leaving the exhaust valve... %hp calculations using an engine monitor have improved over the years... when they first came out the numbers didn’t match the engine’s chart very well... MAPA is a proponent of the Key Numbers for ROP. Really easy to use in flight.... The engine performance charts in the LB POH are really good for the IO550 operations... Best Economy is an LOP standard... Best power is an ROP standard... Be sure to read the details on how many °F (ROP or LOP) are being used in those standards... can technically be 1°F, LOP... you won’t want to go to 50°F LOP if you don’t have to (low power)... ROP recommendations might leave you in the too hot CHT range as usual... One of my favorite topics... PP thoughts only, not a mechanic or CFI.... inviting @patrickf to have a look at Robert’s excell spreadsheet for the IO550N (my engine) the IO550G (standard O engine) will be the same in this case. The N has different cooling fins on the cylinders... Best regards, -a-

(Anthony, I'm that last one qualified to be correcting spelling or typos... but 3 times in one line...)

They just needed more engines:

herd?

T51 in Fredericksburg, TX has a diner and hotel on the tarmac. The diner has an American menu along with Blue Bell ice cream soda fountain. I won't go as far to say that the food is the best I have ever had, but for a destination, and okay food, and mostly everyone in there is a pilot because the restaurant is right on the strip, it's a good place to go. The town of Fredericksburg is a tourist destination so it is worth the trip there. The Museum of the Pacific war is there and very much worth a walkthrough if you have never been.

You make no sense what so ever. This argument is an argument against purchasing the PF system. It's not like you get your money back if you remove it. So no one would remove a working system just because the improvement was small compared to the cost. The cost is spent at that point. Try again.

In the late 90s early 2000s I used to rent various aircraft from Phoenix Aviation (Middle River Aviation) at Martin State north of Baltimore. They had all manner of fixed gear singles on the rental line. There was an O320 powered 172 with one of the earliest PFS exhausts. The Exhaust really woke that airplane up compared to the other Lyc powered 172s. Shorter TO roll and significant climb improvement (~200fpm). Despite being ugly (original 1970s green and orange trim), it was often the first scheduled because of how it performed.

I had dinner with a friend and Malibu driver (Piper not Chevy) last week and during the summer he flew into KCGE for crab cakes at Kay's. He remarked that they were the best he's ever had.

That's what I would like to do. How did you do it legally? Are you VFR only? Or do you have another display of time including seconds? Our GTN650 will display time, but only hours and minutes unless I dig down deep through the menus. It has a timer that displays seconds, but a timer is not a clock. The AV-20S is only approved secondary. That is, it cannot replace ANY required equipment. For IFR, a clock with a sweep second hand or a digital equivalent is required. If they can get it approved as a primary clock, I'll do the same thing. FAR 91.205.(d).(6) (6) A clock displaying hours, minutes, and seconds with a sweep-second pointer or digital presentation.

not many animals on this earth nastyer than a pig --- but man i love me some ribs and bacon..

Noted on jinxing. Also on the get gear down to slow down. I have lots of energy to get rid of since I am usually at the top or above the white arc at the threshold. the ones I hate are, when driving away from the airport, I wonder if I did all 4 checks of the gear. I mean clearly I did because the plane rolled back into the hangar just fine, it would not do that if the gear was up,, right?

Thanks for the compliment - but as you identified I am not Czech (Irish in fact), I will be following up with more pictures on the trip - got some today of the parts after they came out of the nickel plating - I imagine there is a website somewhere on the internet for engine porn - but I really am enjoying this process. Looking forward to getting some new cylinders – and more peace of mind, I think on buying a plane with an engine that is not new or nearly new there is always doubt which weighs on you when you are flying, now that everything will be ship shape and new I can enjoy flying even more.

Hi Mack, Slow but steady. All my shops are short on people and loaded with work. The challenges of a great economy have made me change my ordering schedule. I’m about 2 months behind on the cowling prototype but may have it in my hands this week to fit on mine and a J model. Pictures of the new cowling will be posted soon. Thanks, David

I assume you meant GS, not TAS. TAS remains the same no matter the wind direction.

Heating or cooling the engine will not introduce moisture. It is just there. A warmer temperature will hold more of that water as vapor and therefore not available to cause corrosion. Immediately after a flight I see RH climb as the engine cools. It peaks around 12 hours post flight and then gradually reduces over the next 2 days. I have seen 100 % RH after taxiing only when I didn’t turn on the heater. I turned the heat on and after a day it dropped to 30%. Taxiing without flying is definitely a bad thing.

Tom, if no one else has dibs I’ll take the starter

You can always do flight testing for your airplane. Develop your own power settings and speeds. Determine your own best glide speed. Set the power at idle and maintain different speeds. Write down the sink rate for every speed you try. Minimum sink rate will give you max endurance speed but best glide will be a bit higher. Use the sink rate, TAS, and trigonometry to determine which speed gives you the shallowest descent angle. And remember, best glide speed, just like stall speed will vary with weight.

I cruise at 11/12k for a short 1 hour trip. 16/17 for 2+ hour trip. Adjust for IFR/VFR and direction of course. Lots of mountains in the west where I live so you have to fly pretty high anyway. But even on our cross country trip in the east this year I flew the same altitudes. On just about every leg on that trip as we climb through 10k the bumps smooth out. And every time descending through 10k it gets bumpy.

Well it seems to be exactly what Mike is saying. Not that Mike is the final word on all things aviation - which is why I'm asking my respected MS'ers opinions too. I guess it's fair use to simply paste his statement here exactly (from his recent book "Engines").

I’ve seen a lot worse.

I think the DX (2004) was the last year of the Mac 2 blade. The top prop was used on all later models iirc. The Ovation 2 was 280 and the Ovation 3 had the stc 310. Most of the 2000-2004 2 blade units have been swapped out. They were really fast and efficient but you had to get out and push the plane down the runway

You should spend some time with Jerry. He is being very kind when he said was in the field. So when we opening up the shop Jerry? Between your brains and my brawn, not only will they be installed correctly, we’ll get paid.

First off the eagle wasnt really stripped of options. It had a 2 blade, which can be switched back to a 3 blade. The part that made a difference in weight was the insulation for sound proofing. The eagle is louder to fly, but its not noticeable when youre wearing an ANR headset. The one i have still has a GPS, speed brakes, leather interior. Other than that, there's not a whole lot of differences. And operation costs delta between the acclaim and the bravo arent that big. Every acclaim ive seen needed a top overhaul half way. The bravo uses a tad but more fuel but saying in the end the difference in ownership is negligible between a 400k acclaim and a 150k bravo plus another 100k in upgrades is a bit off. Just my opinion however. I might be completely wrong.

As one who is also following the a36 market closely it amazes me how much more the bonanza brings in the used market. A nice (‘82) sold awhile back for around the same price as a 2000 ish Ovation. The newer ones really suffer with UL but they are kind on the eyes. I’d take an eagle for the right price. However, the 95-98 Ovation or DX is my desirable range...I like the 9 pack.

I'd also have to agree that the 1994 to 2004 ovations and eagles are an awesome buy. Personally my favorites are the 99 to 04's because they organized the panel a tad bit better in my opinion but that's all personal preference. Most of the regular O1's seem to be going for around 140 to 180k. The cheapest ovation GX with waas I found was 295K. I Think its a way better investment to take an eagle or an Older Ovation, or bravo, and just upgrade the panel, interior, and paint to what you want. 115 to 155k saved leaves a lot of room for options. With that you can do a full panel upgrade and not be completely locked into garmins G1000 program. Older planes also tend to have a better useful load. especially the eagle. With 1135 Lbs of useful load I can take throw 4 people and still take 75 gallons.

The Citation X I fly now has a pressurized baggage compartment. I’d flow CJs for 23 years and no problems with water in nose and sodas. I always kept crew bags in nose and pax bags in tail baggage compartment. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I like your argument, but lets assume then there is NO flying going to happen. I.e., out of the country for three months. I will pickle the engine as per Continental's instructions (pickle oil, dessicant spark plugs, dessicant bags in exhaust and sealing it etc). Given that I really respect Mike Busch and his way of thinking, I haven't heard too strong an argument for NOT leaving the Tanis on, hence my approach right now is to pickle and leave the Tanis on Dec - Feb as the best thing to do for the engine. You can do up to 10 hours on the pickle oil, so if a chance presents itself, I'll go do a run around the patch for an hour whenever I can.

Obviously anything is possible... but I believe barring the outrageous, I'll disagree.

Hah! during my instrument training, on a particularly grueling approach to a towered airport, I did the missed approach, but I had to push forwards to keep the nose down, no matter how long I held down the trim button. I started getting frantic and told my instructor, "hey, something's wrong, I think my trim switch is stuck!" There was a brief pause, and he said "that's because you're actually holding down the mic button instead." Fortunately the tower didn't hear that part...

Well first and foremost, welcome to the Mooney Club and congrats. A friend of mine and I just bought a Mooney a little over a week ago. The first plane we looked at, Don did the pre-buy and did a terrific job! I also want to give kudos to Dave at Air Mods, which is where we bought our Mooney from, and also Brian at Orion Flight in Quakertown, PA. Dave stated that Brian did a very thorough pre-buy, and I conclude. Don, Dave and Brian are all Mooney experts in my book!

I am obviously in the market for a new AP. (going on 3 or 4 years now with no AP) These three are sooooo similar I am simply trying to highlight how close they are and light a fire under them (maybe they will get on the F and G quicker now). In fairness as I said I am glad to have had even a response. If you may remember I have posted communication between Trutrak and Trio as well. I even pointed out to Trutrak and Trio the demographic market is bigger for Mooney than the Grumman and some of the other aircraft models. (On a side note it does not take rocket since to look at some of these demographics and yet sometimes Mooney Models get put behind other models). Also, as a collective group the more we ask for things the sooner we will get them and I have nothing but very good things to say about working with and contacting all of these vendors (Garmin, Trutrak, Trio, Avidyne or JPI)

All that and a Truetrac AP What else would a 54 year old airplane need?

Again, if someone offered you a heater hangar all winter would you say “no, that might promote corrosion”?

Good luck. Hope you make your goal.

I can’t believe I liked this post! I probably need to build a bigger, heated, dog house...

I have a 211 conversion , All you have to do is make little radius pieces out of aluminum for about a buck a piece , and WHAM.... New style windows...

Well, if looks are what polishes your plow... but it is my understanding that the C172 performance benefits tremendously from the PFS.