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M20J Speed Mods?


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#1 201er

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 04:39 AM

What speed mods did your M20J come with, what have you added, and what do you think the value (speed, efficiency, and speed to cost ratio) of each is? Perhaps a list of mods from most favorable to least?



#2 rgpilot

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 11:30 AM

Added Power Flow Exhaust system. This has added 3 to 4 knots at 7000 using full manifold pressure and 2400 RPM.



#3 Marauder

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 11:35 AM

What speed mods did your M20J come with, what have you added, and what do you think the value (speed, efficiency, and speed to cost ratio) of each is? Perhaps a list of mods from most favorable to least?


Are you trying to catch me?
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#4 aaronk25

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 12:26 PM

Gami injectors......allowed operations closer to the red box when low such as 4k feet. Typically can now run 5 degrees lop down low and keep Alm cylinders below 360. Increase of 5kts by not having to baby the richest cylinder.

#5 rbridges

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 01:23 PM

Are you trying to catch me?

 

:D



#6 fantom

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 04:52 PM

61002__99775_std.jpg



#7 Hank

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 05:24 PM

And here I thought the J came with all speed mods from the factory . . . All that's left is to keep the throttle forward, climb high, push prop further forward, and maybe fly some amount ROP to go faster than the LOPers.

 

But what do I know? I have a C with several 201-style mods.


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#8 N4352H

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 05:38 PM

Wing root ferings, flap gap and aileron seals, fresh engine and prop and a bucket of soapy water. Guess what? 155 KTAS is 155 KTAS.


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#9 Jeff_S

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 06:57 PM

I haven't altered any exteranl features of my bird, but I guess it came with one speed mod when I bought it: a 3-bladed prop. And according to everyone's opinion, this modifies the speed downward! Since I haven't flown a 2-bladed J I can't say, but I still seem to do all right.



#10 bluehighwayflyer

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 08:52 PM

I think that weight reduction, antenna removal, rearward CG, slick paint, and good rigging will get you way farther in an early 201 than all of the late model M20J aerodynamic mods combined. Just my .02.

Jim
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#11 201er

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 09:10 PM

Jim, which antennas did you remove?



#12 teethdoc

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 09:30 PM

I have about every mod you can think of that came with my '78 J.  I have no idea how much they increase the speed because they were there when I got it, but I can tell you that at about 8000' the Ram air on the Lopresti cowling gives me about a 5kt boost.  5kt is not worth what those things cost if you ask me, but since I have it, I like it.

 

http://flightaware.c...1501Z/KMEM/KBHM



#13 bluehighwayflyer

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 09:47 PM

Jim, which antennas did you remove?


Hi, Mike. ADF, LORAN, and marker beacon.

Jim
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#14 jetdriven

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 11:08 PM

I think that weight reduction, antenna removal, rearward CG, slick paint, and good rigging will get you way farther in an early 201 than all of the late model M20J aerodynamic mods combined. Just my .02.

Jim

Exactly. Optimize what Al Mooney gave you, then start bolting on stuff. We sped ours up about 4 knots in cruise just correcting what was wrong, and removing unneeded antennas.


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#15 rbridges

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Posted 27 August 2013 - 11:59 PM

I have about every mod you can think of that came with my '78 J.  I have no idea how much they increase the speed because they were there when I got it, but I can tell you that at about 8000' the Ram air on the Lopresti cowling gives me about a 5kt boost.  5kt is not worth what those things cost if you ask me, but since I have it, I like it.

 

http://flightaware.c...1501Z/KMEM/KBHM

 

faster or not, that lopresti cowling is damn cool.



#16 Piloto

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Posted 28 August 2013 - 12:48 AM

Speed improvements are mostly significant on long flights

On a 200nm a 5kts difference translate to a 2 minutes difference.

However on 1000nm a 5kts difference translate to 12 minutes difference.

But if you need to stop for fuel the difference can be more than an hour.

 

I found that adding extra fuel allows me to run at higher power thus higher speed non-stop thus shorter time, vs stoping for refueling or running at low speed to increase range. If you encounter headwinds and have to land for refuel your speed mod investment goes down the drain. For a speed mod to be significant the plane has to be run at high power setting, thus more fuel. At low power setting (less drag) speed mods are insignificant.  

 

I measure speed in total trip time vs true air speed.

Time for ground preparation for a flight should be part of the total trip time.

By coincidence my front hangar neighbor was headed to KORL on his Citation I jet at the same time I has headed there too. By the time I started taxing out he and his copilot were still doing checks on the plane in the hangar. I arrived at KORL and pickup the crew car to drop my wife at my son home. By the time I was leaving the gate I saw my friend taxing in his jet. When I drove back to the airport he was still loading the rental car. 

 

The same can be said when comparing an airline flight vs your Mooney. I even include the driving and parking in the total trip time. To me is the total trip time what matters.

 

José 


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#17 carusoam

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Posted 28 August 2013 - 01:03 AM

José,

Are you responsible for the graph in the MAPA Log?

The one that shows the Monroy tanks that allow skipping the time on the ground for refueling (descend, land, refuel, T/O, climb).

The extended tanks often make an excellent speed mod!

Best regards,

-a-

#18 201er

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Posted 28 August 2013 - 01:18 AM

The extended tanks often make an excellent speed mod!

They're not a speed mod. In fact they make you go slower than faster. However, it's the time and/or cost to destination that is reduced and absolutely worth it.



#19 Bennett

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Posted 28 August 2013 - 01:33 AM

Over the years in two Mooneys I think I have tried just about every speed mod available, including some one off 337 stuff. Currently my M 20J has LoPresti cowl, a Powerflow exhaust system, a one piece belly pan, very smooth new paint, a two bladed Top Prop, and all sorts of fairings. The rigging is perfect (hands off in cruise), done by LASAR, flow matched cylinders, prop balanced to the limits of the balancing machine, but many too many antennas. For my 261 conversion we buried most of the antennas, but now I have two external GPS antennas, the towel rack on the tail, a 406 ELT antenna, a ADS-B antenna, and a transponder antenna. And two comm antennas personally, I think these antennas nullify some of the speed mods. At 8000', ram air open, 2550 RPM, and a fuel flow of about 9.6 GPH , I true out at 160-163 KTAS . I can eke out a couple more knots running ROP, but I hate paying for the extra fuel. I spend a fair amount of time looking a predicted winds aloft to maximize tail winds, and minimize head winds, and even consider alternate routes. By the way, I keep lots if survival gear in the baggage department to keep an aft CG. I also play the fuel flow/ power/ speed game to avoid unnecessary fuel stops on long flights, but I never land with less than one and a half hours (14 gal) usable in the tanks. My 261 was better for really long trips (115 gallons), but that required flying in the mid flight levels, sucking oxygen, and generally freezing. The 201 is fine for 500 - 700 mile trips, and I normally fly at non- oxygen altitudes. Any Mooney is a good aircraft, and faster than most.
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Bennett

#20 201er

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Posted 28 August 2013 - 01:45 AM

Bennett, could you please talk about the value of each mod you've tried and the cost to speed payoffs? Can you make a list in order of preference that you would add those to a factory stock 201?






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